Holocaust - Fact or Fiction?

Iran holds international conference to debate
whether Hitler did kill 6 million Jews.

President Ahmedinejad is the only world leader who
openly claims that Holocaust is a myth.

He says evidence is not good enough to
convince him that Germans committed this atrocity.

Iran is the only nation that questions the Holocaust.

They say Nazis killed only a few thousand Jews.

Now scholars and historians from all over the
world are heading for Tehran to discuss the incident.

Iran has invited them to examine all the evidence.

This type of conference would have been banned in Europe and America.

news.bbc.co.uk...

www.cnn.com...
www.cnn.com...







[edit on 11-12-2006 by mr conspiracy]

So all those videos were hoaxed? How do you explain that it was all fake? There is more than enough evidence that it was real.

that is why some top western scholars and historians are heading to
Iran to ask him to explain all this evidence.

Other historians from europe and australia who
agree with Iran and say its all a hoax are also going to Iran to present their case.





[edit on 11-12-2006 by mr conspiracy]

Pardon my density, but what is your position on this, mr conspiracy? Are you asking if people believe the holocaust or not? Are you asking for opinions on Iran's leader's opinion? And what is the meaning behind mentioning that this would be banned in Europe and America?

Sorry, but I'm unclear as to your point of view. Thanks.

Well... I'm all for conferences on critical thinking. I think it will be great if both sides are allowed to present their position and arguments

I juste... somehow doubt the fairness of such conference

But hey, you need to work with what you got, like mr conspiracy said this kind of conference would have been banned in most of americas and europe

How can he seriously not belive the holocaust happened!?!?! It just seems to me, that hes looking for some more attention to keep his country in the spotlight.

I believe he is questioning the scale of the holocaust, i remember reading a while ago that he did not deny it happened only the scale.

It will be interesting to see how this develops.

Oh well... for the scale I do agree it might vary a bit but it will still be terrible

like the wartoll... In history class we learn it was about 60 millions death, but it doesn't include a lot...

like MIA

Im usure as to what is the Real Number

It seems to me that some of the people attending are trying to encourage open discussion about the facts surrounding the event, while others are more interested in downplaying it, or denying it outright. One of the fellows has it in his head that no gas chambers were used - I don't know if that's true, I suspect it isn't, but all I know is what I've read on the subject.

I noticed America's own David Duke will be attending. What an embarassment that turd is to our nation. :shk:

If the point of this conference is to explore the facts surrounding the event, I would be all for it.

Problem is, with the guest list set up the way it is, I can't help but think it's just an excuse for a bunch of small-minded bigots to get together and moan about 'The Joooooos!'

they will come to find that not 6 million where killed but a couple million.

those videos did.t show 6 million people getting killed.

the holocaust did happen but the numbers of dead were over exaggerated.

IBM made them machine that kept track of everyone so if they can get their hands on that data then we can get a rough idea of how many people were killed.

As we who employ critical thinking are aware, history is written by the victors.

However, enabling extremist fascists the opportunity to revise the penmanship of the victors is a swing too far in the other direction.

My research some years ago revealed that there was some post war exaggeration of the events and nature of the atrocities as an effort to further global political agendas. However, one cannot deny the observations of countless surviving victims, the testimony of German participants, and the stories of allied soldiers encountering unthinkable visages.

it's frightening to me that he is so willing to deny this. it's about as obtuse as a certain world leader claiming the "jury is still out" on the topic of evolution.

the willing ignorance of some people never ceases to amaze.

his own people are getting tired of him

Quite the topic is it? I was wondering when this would show up on ATS after seeing it in the news. I think the conference is a good thing, and if their evidence is genuine there is a lot to discuss. I do feel that it would be appropriate for all sides to be present, meaning believers and non-believers who should present evidence which is to be judged by an impartial jury.

This will be quite the thing to track...

I personally believe that the history about the Shoa and the number of deaths were taken out of context to gain support for the (then) new state of Israel. The prosecution and transports were very real, undeniably so, but the processing as explained by Yad Vashem is even now still hard to believe as is the number of Jewish casualties given.

The numbers simply do not add up.

Well it clearly happened, a silly post. The Iranian president obviously has a few issues with The Israeli government but it is very insulting to the many people who lost their lives in that awful event and their relatives. Pointlessley callous.

Imaidiot wants to show the world that the holocust did happen. He will then use this 'proof' to say the Germany should of given it's land to the jews for the creation of Israel, not Palenstein. Though I'm sure he will ignore the fact that the Middle-east & Persia thought the palenstinains were lower than dog-doo and that it was a British colony (Britian could do what it wanted with the land) and that the UN verified the exisitence of Israel.

Imaidiot is going to use this as an excuse to attack Israel stating that they are on Mulism holy land and need to be removed.

Originally posted by CanadianGlasnost
Oh well... for the scale I do agree it might vary a bit but it will still be terrible

like the wartoll... In history class we learn it was about 60 millions death, but it doesn't include a lot...

like MIA

Im usure as to what is the Real Number

It's 60 million now? Man, just a few years ago I heard it was 40 million.
It's funny how history changes over the years.

I have to say, the fact that he's holding a conference, and
assuming he has both sides in attnedance, I think it would
show that he's not just being a bigot, though I'm not sure.

I don't think anyone could actually prove that the holocaust
never happened, unless it was the greatest hoax in history,
which I don't believe to be the case.


Personally, I think the numbers were taken out of context,
and it's more like 2-4million Jewish individuals were killed.

Something that most people seem to forget to, is that Jewish
people only made up a part of the many more millions of
people who were persecuted.

Here is a count:

Country Population 1939 Military deaths Civilian deaths Jewish Holocaust deaths Total deaths Deaths/ % of population
Albania[1] 1,100,000 28,000 200 28,000 2.56%
Australia[2] 7,000,000 40,400 100 40,500 0.58%
Austria[3] 7,000,000 45,000 65,000 110,000 1.57%
Belgium[4] 8,400,000 12,100 52,000 24,000 88,100 1.05%
Brazil[5] 41,500,000 1,000 1,000 2,000 0.00%
Bulgaria[6] 6,300,000 22,000 22,000 0.35%
Burma[7] 17,500,000 60,000 60,000 0.34%
Canada[8] 11,300,000 45,300 45,300 0.4%
China[9] 530,000,000 3,000,000 7,000,000 10,000,000 1.89%
Cuba[10] 4,300,000 100 100 0.00%
Czechoslovakia[11] 15,300,000 25,000 63,000 277,000 365,000 2.39%
Denmark[12] 3,800,000 1,300 1,800 100 3,200 0.08%
Estonia[13] 1,100,000 40,000 1,000 41,000 3.73%
Ethiopia[14] 14,100,000 5,000 200,000 205,000 1.45%
Finland[15] 3,700,000 95,000 2,000 97,000 2.62%
France[16] 41,700,000 212,000 267,000 83,000 562,000 1.35%
French Indo-China[17] 24,600,000 1,000,000 1,000,000 4.07%
Germany[18][19][20] 69,300,000 5,500,000 1,840,000 160,000 7,500,000 10.82%
Greece[21] 7,200,000 20,000 209,000 71,000 300,000 4.17%
Hungary[22] 9,200,000 300,000 80,000 200,000 580,000 6.3%
Iceland[23] 120,000 200 200 0.17%
India[24] 386,000,000 87,000 1,500,000 1,587,000 0.41%
Indonesia[25] 70,500,000 4,000,000 4,000,000 5.67%
Iran[26] 14,000,000 200 200 0.00%
Iraq[27] 3,700,000 1,000 1,000 0.03%
Ireland[28] 4,250,000 100 100 0.00%
Italy[29] 43,800,000 306,400 145,100 8,000 459,500 1.05%
Japan[30] 72,000,000 2,000,000 600,000 2,600,000 3.61%
Korea[31] 23,400,000 60,000 60,000 0.26%
Latvia[32] 2,000,000 147,000 80,000 227,000 11.35%
Lithuania[33] 2,500,000 212,000 141,000 353,000 14.12%
Luxembourg[34] 300,000 1,000 1,000 2,000 0.67%
Malaya[35] 5,500,000 100,000 100,000 1.82%
Malta[36] 300,000 1,500 1,500 0.5%
Mexico[37] 19,800,000 100 100 0.00%
Mongolia[38] 700,000 300 300 0.04%
Netherlands[39] 8,700,000 7,900 92,000 106,000 205,900 2.37%
Newfoundland[40] 300,000 1,000 100 1,100 0.37%
New Zealand[41] 1,600,000 11,900 11,900 0.74%
Norway[42] 2,900,000 3,000 5,800 700 9,500 0.33%
Philippines[43] 16,400,000 57,000 90,000 147,000 0.9%
Pacific Islands[44] 1,900,000 57,000 57,000 3.0%
Poland[45] 34,800,000 400,000 2,200,000 3,000,000 5,600,000 16.09%
Portuguese Timor[46] 500,000 55,000 55,000 11.0%
Romania[47] 19,900,000 316,000 56,000 469,000 841,000 4.23%
Singapore[48] 700,000 50,000 50,000 7.14%
South Africa[49] 10,300,000 11,900 11,900 0.12%
Soviet Union[50] 168,500,000 10,700,000 11,500,000 1,000,000 23,200,000 13.77%
Spain[51] 25,500,000 4,500 4,500 0.02%
Sweden[52] 6,400,000 0.00%
Switzerland[53] 4,200,000 100 100 0.00%
Thailand[54] 15,300,000 5,600 5,600 0.04%
United Kingdom[55] 47,800,000 382,600 67,800 450,400 0.94%
United States[56] 132,000,000 407,300 11,200 418,500 0.32%
Yugoslavia[57] 15,400,000 446,000 514,000 67,000 1,027,000 6.67%
Totals 1,986,370,000 24,456,700 32,327,000 5,754,000 62,537,600 3.17%

en.wikipedia.org...

Total of ~62 million people died in WW2

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
Pardon my density, but what is your position on this, mr conspiracy? Are you asking if people believe the holocaust or not? Are you asking for opinions on Iran's leader's opinion? And what is the meaning behind mentioning that this would be banned in Europe and America?

Sorry, but I'm unclear as to your point of view. Thanks.

He cant ask peoples opinion, cause our neighbors, the Austrians, will go to prison if they believe opposite than what is currently taught in regards to the holocaust.
So much for freedom of speech and thought and opinion.

Jews against zionism has some words to say about it...seems like any holocaust is blamed squarely on them. (zionist)

Peace

Dalen

[edit on 11-12-2006 by dAlen]

I'm just going to say this and than I am outta this discussion:

The Holocaust happened. They found the ovens, they found the incinerators, they found the showers with gas valves on them.

There's way more evidence than that.

You guys have to remember that a large majority of the Middle East governments and people are not friendly to Israel, because the US is largely sympathetic to Israel. And if they don't like us they don't like them either. And they don't like the US nor Israel about the same.

So you're going to hear this kind of talk coming out of the Middle East, especially from extreme countries like Iran(as opposed to more civil countries like Japan, etc). I don't think it's so much that they really doubt the holocaust, I think Iran is just trying to strong arm and throw their weight around in the Middle East with their ambiguous nuclear development, and to take advantage of the current Iraq and Afghan instability.

It's a pretty provocative and insulting statement to be sure.