Al Qaeda threat over pope speech

Originally posted by centurion1211
Sorry, but this seems like a strange kind of pacifist opinion from one that fancies himself the "Grim Reaper", a "scholar - fighter", who asks if anyone wants to "play for blood"? What's with all that?

humor. If you took it serious I actually wanted to play for blood and didnt realize that was a line from doc holiday, the guy in my avatar, then thats too bad. If you knew that GrimReaper797 was just my video game name for Halo, you probably wouldn't make that statement. scholar=research forum, fighter=debate forum. At least Im not calling for the destruction of any group, singling out any group to be attacked or treated extremely poorly, Im playing a video game, making music, and reading history books from the local library. seems to me like your trying to attack MY character simply because I noted a large group of people on this thread are calling out for inhumane treatment to muslims everywhere.

[edit on 18-9-2006 by grimreaper797]

Originally posted by centurion1211
For what seems like the 500th time, no one said all muslims,

The guy that started this thread did.

Uh, Fawkes, take it as you want.

Kill my pope, be tought a lesson.

Originally posted by centurion1211

Come on. Using this tired, old excuse to defend or at least dilute the actions of radical muslims whenever they start acting insanely is bogus. For what seems like the 500th time, no one said all muslims, but you and a lot of others want to keep harping this response.

Hint: you all might try condemning the actions of the radical muslims and their lackeys, the rioters in the streets if you want more credibilty.

That said, it's time we stopped worrying about every little word that might offend these people. It's like they have nothing to do but sit around and wait for some "provocation" - no matter how trivial - so they can go off. Apologies are useless to these members of the "religion of peace". They only seek to demonstrate their peaceful ways with more rioting and death.

Truth is, these rioters and people making threats have more in common with infants throwing tantrums than they do with thinking, rational adults.


[edit on 9/18/2006 by centurion1211]

You really lap up the media. There are plenty of people in this very forum here that group ALL muslims together with the extremists so dont play that card. The worldwide muslim population doesn't just "sit around and wait for some provocation" to go and riot. For your information, people from the muslim world HAVE condemned the extremists but the media wont print this as it doesn't sell. How many muslims do you know personally? Are they all screaming death to the west and praise allah? I dont think so. That is the sterotyped image that we get fed to us day in and day out.

The reason this thread has turned into this discussion is based on comments from people who DID group all muslims together for the actions of a few. That is the angle that we are arguing. Personally I think that rioting accomplishes nothing, however I have the luxury of living in the US where we have the ability to accomplish our goals thru other means.

Dont think that the evils of america are from another time, the civil rights movement just happened a few decades ago. A lot of the people who lived thru those times are still alive today and remember the hate and racism that came from their own countrymen - many of whom are also still alive to this day and hold high ranking levels in the current administration. Hate has taken on a new form.

I am not saying the muslim world is completely innocent, there have been many mistakes on both sides. I do believe however, that the pope was way out of line with his comments, whether he was quoting someone else or not. The purpose of the statement was to inflame the situation and it only politicizes the issue even more.

One more point - there are a lot of extremests in the muslim world and more are being created everyday based on OUR actions and comments. It is easy for us to justify our side of things while coneming the other side for doing the very same thing. A war of ideology (and that is exactly what the wot is) cannot be won with bombs and bullets. To do so only makes them come back in greater number.

[edit on 18-9-2006 by LogansRun]

Originally posted by Rockpuck
Uh, Fawkes, take it as you want.

Kill my pope, be tought a lesson.

So you want to wipe out all the Muslims because of words and actions of psycho terrorists?
You do realize that you sound just like them don’t you?

Fawkes, I said take out the threat. Extremist, those who spread it, those who use it to ignite massive riots like the idiots burning churches, shooting a nun. Those people do not need to be protected by your politically correct rehtoric.

It does apear you have a problem with that. By all means, have a problem with it, and know full well I do not care that you have a problem with my very politicaly uncorrect statement.

Take it as you will, distort it if you must, it does not change the people you wish to protect.

No one is protecting anyone, only pointing out the hypocracy of those who dont see the entire picture for what it is. This isn't about political correctness either, just about a head of state making an incredibly ignorant and irresponsible comment. There are people who made very bad decisions based on that comment...no one is arguing that. The point is that you cannot blame them all for the actions of a few.

Mod Note: Big Quote – Please Review This Link.



[edit on 18-9-2006 by DontTreadOnMe]

Originally posted by Rockpuck
Fawkes, I said take out the threat. Extremist, those who spread it, those who use it to ignite massive riots like the idiots burning churches, shooting a nun. Those people do not need to be protected by your politically correct rehtoric.

It does apear you have a problem with that. By all means, have a problem with it, and know full well I do not care that you have a problem with my very politicaly uncorrect statement.

Take it as you will, distort it if you must, it does not change the people you wish to protect.

actually your the extremist then. Muslim extremism wont exist if you kill everyone else off, but thats funny cause you have the same mind set in reverse. One extreme kills the opposite extreme, of course they wont seem extreme anymore.

when you kill off the comparison to you, of course extremism is gone. Your an extremist, just on the exact opposite side of muslims. Your right though, extremism is bad, and needs to stop. I suggest you take a pro step toward that goal.

You don't know me that is for sure.

Any one who burns a church, who shoots a nun, who riots in the street because an old man in a white dress QUOTED < they are to damn ignorant to realize that > then yes, they deserve to be killed, as an opposition to our way of life, as you say we are one in the same simply on the other side of the spectrum, then so be it. May the best man win then, of course we would, and because the west is so powerful we or .. a few.. like you.. feel the need to be a muslim savior.

Spare me attempts to feel as though you better yourself through protecting or defending animals.

Mod Note: Big Quote – Please Review This Link.



[edit on 18-9-2006 by DontTreadOnMe]

Originally posted by grimreaper797

profilling does the same thing, its just a matter of what group you think is worth less then another group. In this case, people seem to think muslim innocents are simply worth less. Its a good thing they are saying the same thing about you, because we know the US wouldn't stop the slaughter of innocents when it comes to the american religion....money.

Say something useful and constructive. Don't just try to slap at me in a juvenile fashion. I suspect that, frankly, you are a keyboard warrior. Have you faced death? Have you had to make life and death decisions? I would hallucinate not. You are dancing all around the issue in what appears to be paroxysm of self righteous whining and "na-na boo-boo"ing.

Say something or add something useful and not just spiteful vituperatives clothed in "So's yer Mama" and like that. I gave you enough hints in my post to show that I don't necessarily feel that way... You persist in simply wanting to jump on people and show your liberal humanity. Give some of us a break, American or otherwise... We, some of us, can see the horror that is coming. Speaking for myself, I do not want it. When you have ridden the tiger, you fear the tiger. Go ride a tiger and then come back and let us truly sit down and talk a deal.

mod edit, fix quote tags

[edit on 18-9-2006 by DontTreadOnMe]

muslim savior? you really are wrapped up in this religious biggoting aren't you? Animals? You must be.

you know what, I dont even want to talk this. Its not worth it at all. Im done with this stupid discussion.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
Fawkes, I said take out the threat. Extremist, those who spread it, those who use it to ignite massive riots like the idiots burning churches, shooting a nun. Those people do not need to be protected by your politically correct rehtoric.

My politically correct rhetoric? Being opposed to a holocaust is politically correct rhetoric? LISTEN TO YOURSELF!
I ask you to clarify your statement and all you can do is spew out nonsense like that?
I ask if you are suggesting “the final solution” and you give me some evasive comment. (BTW if you don’t understand what “the final solution” is, I’m sure you know how to look it up.)

And who said anything about protecting criminals? I'm talking about protecting innocent people who have nothing to do with these crimes. If my brother robs a bank it doesn't make me a criminal.
There is no one here trying to defend terrorists.

It does apear you have a problem with that.

I have a problem with someone who wants to murder 1.6 billion people. Be it Islamic terrorists or the KKK. Up until you made clear you are talking about "extremist." You seemed to be one of those people.
You said you want to remove the threat.
I ask if you are suggesting “the final solution.”
You gave me an evasive answer.
I call you on it and now you say I’m using “politically correct rhetoric.”

By all means, have a problem with it, and know full well I do not care that you have a problem with my very politicaly uncorrect statement.

Which is what statement exactly? There is nothing “politically incorrect” in wanting to take out terrorists. That is what you meant now isn’t it? Wiping out all the Muslims on the other hand…

Take it as you will, distort it if you must, it does not change the people you wish to protect.

I've distorted nothing. Speak clearly and don't answer questions evasively and you wont have a problem with perceived distortion.

Originally posted by grimreaper797
muslim savior? you really are wrapped up in this religious biggoting aren't you? Animals? You must be.

you know what, I dont even want to talk this. Its not worth it at all. Im done with this stupid discussion.

Wow!!!!

And I almost got the next to the next to last comment in this stupid discussion.



ps: Hope I got in under the penalty wire for a one line post.

The eradication of a religion, no, the eradication of Islamic terrorist/facist who have hijacked the religion? Yeah.

Final Solution, no, that would be pointless in getting anything done, just to take out the actual groups who use the religion as a base for political operations, who cause true believers to be pulled into this death society way of life and blow them selves up. The leaders of these groups are not religious people, they do not care about Allah, they are politically motivated in every way, that is like saying Bush is a good christian please.

The politically correct rehtoric I speak of, is if you talk about taking out these god forsaken groups, you are automatically refering to the entire Muslim population.

Using your annology, If I where to say that we need to arrest bank robbers, and your brother robs a bank, do you think that I would arrest you to because I do not like bank robbers?

I was at a funeral for a friend some time ago. A police officer, and reserve soldier serving...in Afghanistan. His five-year-old daughter will never see daddy again. Afterwards, many of us got drunk and we all decided "kill 'em all, let God sort 'em out."

I haven't seen anything that has changed my mind since. And haven't read anything in this thread that has yet either.

All I see is a five-year-old crying.

Originally posted by sigung86

Say something useful and constructive. Don't just try to slap at me in a juvenile fashion. I suspect that, frankly, you are a keyboard warrior. Have you faced death? Have you had to make life and death decisions? I would hallucinate not. You are dancing all around the issue in what appears to be paroxysm of self righteous whining and "na-na boo-boo"ing.

Say something or add something useful and not just spiteful vituperatives clothed in "So's yer Mama" and like that. I gave you enough hints in my post to show that I don't necessarily feel that way... You persist in simply wanting to jump on people and show your liberal humanity. Give some of us a break, American or otherwise... We, some of us, can see the horror that is coming. Speaking for myself, I do not want it. When you have ridden the tiger, you fear the tiger. Go ride a tiger and then come back and let us truly sit down and talk a deal.

had to address this before I left. Soon as you assumed who I was I had to. I live in new jersey and knew quite a few people effected, and a few that even died that day. I believe people have to COMMIT A CRIME, before you can act on it. Or at least show positive intent they would. I see the horror thats coming, and its mostly at the hands of a bunch of ignorant american citizens who blindly follow the tv screens words, in the most physically powerful nation when it comes to weapons. Thats the horror coming, a bunch of ignorant fools with a bunch of the most destructive weapons on the face of this planet.

when you have ridden the tiger you fear the tiger? trying to pull a metaphor for me not being through enough to see eye to eye to you? if thats the case you can just screw off, because Im sick of americans "I am better then you" attitudes even to their own citizens. It disgusts me to have to wake up every morning with my poor friends, my black friends, my middle eastern friends, amoung my other friends and get looked like were not on the same level as other people. I don't know what you been through, so I'm not going to talk to you about what you have to go through in order to see eye to eye with me.

All I will tell you is if you were in my shoes, you know what it feels like to be labeled, and punished for that label which was created by stereotypes and BS that IGNORANCE created. So when I see you making BS statements about how muslims are this or muslims are that, I know what it feels like to be on the other side of that. It don't feel good, and apparently you don't know that. Just because your white doesn't mean you like to hang black people, just because your black doesn't mean you steal and are a part of violent crime. Just because your protestant doesnt mean you like to hang catholics blacks and other minorities. Because to say that would be to judge YOUR character based on something that isnt you. You may follow it, but its not who you are.

If your muslim, that means you follow islam.
If your white, that means your ancestry is from somewhere far from the equator.
If your catholic, that means you follow the catholic religion
If your black that means your ancestry is from somewhere close to the equator.

plain and simple. it doesnt mean your a terrorist or an extremist. You blowing stuff up to prove how dedicated you are TO ANY CAUSE, makes you an extremist. You killing innocent people makes you a murderer. Not being muslims or anything else.

Originally posted by LogansRun
No one is protecting anyone, only pointing out the hypocracy of those who dont see the entire picture for what it is. This isn't about political correctness either, just about a head of state making an incredibly ignorant and irresponsible comment. There are people who made very bad decisions based on that comment...no one is arguing that. The point is that you cannot blame them all for the actions of a few.

I disagree. That is not the point. By not condemning the perpetrators of all this, you are simply serving as enablers. And it would be just as correct to point out how "incredibly ignorant and irresponsible" the radicals and rioters are for responding in such a violent way to the words (just words!) of and old man in Rome. But I don't see you doing it. The Pope's words have changed absolutely nothing in the lives of the radicals and rioters. There is no rational reason or excuse for their behavior. But there they are, and here you are defending them, no "pointing out the hypocricy", and missing the key point I just made entirely. Repeat. There is no rational reason for these people to be making threats and rioting over the words of an old man in Rome, or anyone else for that matter.

[edit on 9/18/2006 by centurion1211]

Some of you actually see what's happening, some of you, it breaks my heart how you're laughing it up. I believe the dark pope is amongsts us and a head of state does NOT make remarks without them being thought thru, this is a setup of gigantic proportions.

Some of you with you're thoughtless remarks are actually adding to the fire, don't you see this is the time when the World needs us. The pope does not speak for me neither should he speak for the rest of Catholic Christians, Al-Queda does not represent all Muslims neither should they speak for Muslims. Bush and Co. do not speak for every American. Folks you have a voice so use it!! if you see anybody out there bringing the hate, squash it, because if not, it's gonna get out of hand quickly. What are we all waiting for? to be the next souls to bite it in the name of greed and money? that you're loved ones be in the next batch of dead? is that what it's gonna take to wake you guys up? Oh I am just one person what can i do? Everything.
I for one am gonna pass the love forward and it does'nt matter who it is to because it's the only way to stop what is happening, peace and love everyone.

Originally posted by grimreaper797

plain and simple. it doesnt mean your a terrorist or an extremist. You blowing stuff up to prove how dedicated you are TO ANY CAUSE, makes you an extremist. You killing innocent people makes you a murderer. Not being muslims or anything else.

And you are so busy being "right" and downtrodden that you still don't get it...

No I read your post, and your saying because they aren't stopping that group of stubborn muslims, that all muslims will suffer. You do realize how minute that group of muslim extremists are right? there are over 1 billion muslims on this planet. do we even have 1 million muslim extremists? not even 1% is extremists.

How in gods name are you going to justify any action against muslims, when a majority of them, in reality probably 99%, no less then 97% depending on your definition of extremism, will ever do any sort of violence in the name of religion. If 3 million muslims were acting violent right now and participating in extremism, you would damn well know right now. They aren't though. Thats like saying well 500,000 of the US citizens are extremist nazis, the world is calling for you to stop them, and if you don't you will all pay, because it means you all condone nazism in america.

yea bull, but you think we can stop 500,000 nazis? no, because we don't know what a nazi looks like. Sure you can put ever guy with a bald head and a mad look on their face in a containment camp, but you still wouldn't get them all, because nazism isnt paired with looks. so say 20 of those nazi get their hands on a biological weapon and kill 10,000 jewish people in israel. What in gods name do you plan on doing to stop those 500,000 nazis, when you don't know their identities and they have no physical features caused by it?

nothing, because you cant identify the enemy you are trying to stop. You have to catch them in the act, or else your just guessing. Thats my point though. To say muslims should stop muslim extremists is like saying americans should stop those 500,000 nazis or else we condone nazism and anti semite beliefs.

now if that doesn't satisfy you, then it doesn't matter.