Solar Warden

Originally posted by cmdrkeenkidsay that aliens are out there, we have a secret space fleet, and blah blah blah I easily could. But since when has anything ever been learned by taking the easy path?

AH I see... Now I get it...

You have been playing devil's advocat all along!!

Very good , sir Hat's off to ye! Well done! Jolly good show, what"

Originally posted by zorgon
While no one in the senate has said "space fleet" that I know of, talking about a " major program" of a "secret space effort ", sure makes me sit up and take notice.

Sure it makes me take notice too, but my first thought isn't to invision some space fleet. The senators say it's "unjustified and stunningly expensive.". Expensive compaired to what though. They don't say. I find the B-2 Bomber at $2 Billion per aircraft to be stunningly expensive. I'm sure lots of other people do too. Some might even consider spending money on such things like that as wasteful or unjustified. A lot of things relating to the space program are very expensive and a lot of people and politicians find the space program to be a waste of time and money. These two senators may also feel spending money on NASA and on other military projects such as the F-22A as expensive and wasteful. Do you see what I'm getting at here?



That sounds nothing relating to a space fleet at all.

Emphasis mine...




They talk about how it's not as relivant today as it would be in the past. They talk about it being more useful against an advisary like the USSR but not so much against al Qaeda. It sounds like this secret space program is something that centered around stuff here on Earth. Not some space fleet hiding behind the moon or hanging out at Jupiter.

But years ago, before the space arm, Spar Aero Space in Canada gave a demo for investors.

It was a 60 ton block of steel on a magnetic rail. They "launched" this block along the rail at high speed towards the viewers. It came to a sudden silent instant stop at a safe distance.... Most impressive display...

Got a link for that please?

Originally posted by jra
Got a link for that please?

Knew someone would ask I'm working on getting that info for myself too. They sold the company to the US it may take a bit, but I will hunt it down.


Not EVERYTHING can be found on the internet

Ever see the 'From the Earth to the Moon' series (I think it was on Showtime), the one where they are building the LEM?

hahaha! That's the espirito!

Yes but a scientific theory isn't just a bunch of unsubstantiated guesses or hunches. So far all the speculation in this thread has been unsubstantiated.

"So far"

The Democrtic senators don't KNOW what's going on, they were not in the loop, and when they try to say the spending was "totally unjustified and very, very wasteful." they were "overruled in the appropriations conference."

Aha! So, that begs the question - Who are the members of the appropriations conference and what do they know and aren't telling?

the original justification for developing this technology has eroded in importance due to the changed practices and capabilities of our adversaries. There are a number of other programs in existence and in development whose capabilities can match those envisioned for this program at far less cost and technological risk."

Adversaries might also be referring to some drooling nasty space invaders. They never said the USSR so who the enemy may be is literally up in the air.

Continuation post id: 2308453

On second thought I suppose a NIPD MHD engine could be built, but the flow would have to go against the direction of travel. As long as the plasma is conserved (never leaves the system) it would still be a NIPD even if the plasma was external the skin. This leads to the tantalizing possibility of a magnetic wave interacting in the surrounding ionic space. I'll put more thought into that one

In the past I also toyed with the idea of superluminal stators. You could build one for maybe 20 bucks. Just use four independently triggered 555 timers and adjust them to where they fire in order around a circle faster than light can travel. Good experiment for the kid's science fair...

Originally posted by Matyas
even if the plasma was external the skin. This leads to the tantalizing possibility of a magnetic wave interacting in the surrounding ionic space. I'll put more thought into that one

Hence the reason you can't get a clear photo of a true UFO while it is in flight oops said to much........

Yes but a scientific theory isn't just a bunch of unsubstantiated guesses or hunches. So far all the speculation in this thread has been unsubstantiated.

First of all since when did speculation need substantiation? And second I have seen lots of evidence in here that makes the speculation valid, certainly enough to look into the question. If we had absolute proof of any of this we would be in the "Current News" department

Now Class pay attention.

Speculation ... spec·u·la·tion

1. Contemplation or consideration of a subject; meditation.
2. A conclusion, opinion, or theory reached by conjecture.
3. Reasoning based on inconclusive evidence; conjecture or supposition.


Theory ... the·o·ry

1. A set of statements or principles devised to explain a group of facts or phenomena, especially one that has been repeatedly tested or is widely accepted and can be used to make predictions about natural phenomena.

2. An assumption based on limited information or knowledge; a conjecture

Proof ... proof

1. The evidence or argument that compels the mind to accept an assertion as true.
a. The validation of a proposition by application of specified rules, as of induction or deduction, to assumptions, axioms, and sequentially derived conclusions.
b. A statement or argument used in such a validation.
c. Convincing or persuasive demonstration: was asked for proof of his identity;
d. The state of being convinced or persuaded by consideration of evidence.

Truth ... truth

1. Conformity to fact or actuality.
2. A statement proven to be or accepted as true.
3. Sincerity; integrity.
4. Fidelity to an original or standard.
a. Reality; actuality.
b. often Truth That which is considered to be the supreme reality and to have the ultimate meaning and value of existence.

Actually truth in the original meaning, spelled "trewthe" meant "loyalty"

So as I state in my other thread

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS ABSOLUTE TRUTH

[edit on 30-6-2006 by zorgon]

To quote torbjon again.

Originally posted by torbjon
jra? A Theory is nothing more than speculation until it is proven or disproven...

speculation is an integral part of the scientific process.

Emphasis mine.

Originally posted by zorgon
First of all since when did speculation need substantiation?

Now if you want to play the dictionary quoting game...

From: Wikipedia
Science

In scientific usage, a theory does not mean an unsubstantiated guess or hunch, as it often does in other contexts. A theory is a logically self-consistent model or framework for describing the behavior of a related set of natural or social phenomena. It originates from and/or is supported by experimental evidence (see scientific method). In this sense, a theory is a systematic and formalized expression of all previous observations that is predictive, logical and testable.

You may also want to look up Predictive power

Scientific ideas that do not confer any predictive power are considered at best "conjectures", or at worst "pseudoscience". Because they cannot be tested or falsified in any way, there is no way to determine whether they are true or false, and so they do not gain the status of "scientific theory".

and also Falsifiability while you're at it.

Some philosophers and scientists, most notably Karl Popper, have asserted that no empirical hypothesis, proposition, or theory can be considered scientific if it does not admit the possibility of a contrary case.

[edit on 30-6-2006 by jra]

Hey jra, are you debating zorgon or validating him? I can't tell off-hand...

I havn't throughly reviewed jbondo's work, but at a glance jbondo sports a good attitude which is half the battle..

Yes zorgon, there is no absolute truth, but I fear the pendulum swings further from relative truth. This is what happens when moralism is included.

BTW zorgon, I think I may be onto something with vibrating mass to energy. If you recall Henry Wallace's work from the other thread, I am guessing NMR. Been under our noses all along Maybe a variation like NKR (Nuclear Kinemassic Resonance)

AND I found a link for EHD. I'd say you could build this with the kids for about $20.00 max

jnaudin.free.fr...

Sooo good to be here!

Wow this thread is still debating what the idea of speculation is all about? Amazing how there is always people that come out of the woodwork to be deliberately adversarial at all times and for all reasons.

I think the English Hacker did see something not because he wants fame but because it was easy to see things in what is probably the world's largest secret society. Also McKinnon is getting scared and by revealing some of what he saw he may be hinting to the military that he knows more than what he is saying. This I believe and he will use it to buy a great deal of leniency with them.

All the same the cat is out of the bag since the concept of an entire new and hidden wing of the military is out of the bag and this makes the discussion of new secret conventional weapons seem oh so boring.

Originally posted by denythestatusquo
deliberately adversarial at all times and for all reasons.

Adversarial Adversarial Not in this room

[qoute] makes the discussion of new secret conventional weapons seem oh so boring.


When I came into this room it was wild speculation, topic got dumped into the cellar [skunkworks IS in the cellar, isn,t it?]

Now only a few pages later its all accepted fact and already boring???

Did I miss a day



[edit on 1-7-2006 by zorgon]

Originally posted by Matyas
BTW zorgon, I think I may be onto something with vibrating mass to energy.

At this rate we will have a working model by the end of summer

Nice link I will peruse it when I can see straight

Now if you want to play the dictionary quoting game...

Sure...

How about us getting back to the original focus of this thread and define what Solar Warden might mean?

Perhaps the choice of using the word Solar actually has something to do with the sun. For years SOHO sure has been taking some weird shots of things going on with and around old Sol. Maybe the military has taken this as a call the protect the sun from aliens that might be threatening it.

Warden by definition could reference some roll in custodial, managerial, supervisorial position. And is that over a residential or prison planet?



[edit on 1-7-2006 by vorlance]

Hence the reason you can't get a clear photo of a true UFO while it is in flight

oops said to much........

Me thinks thou protest too muchath!

AND I found a link for EHD. I'd say you could build this with the kids for about $20.00 max

Very cool. What would it do?

All the same the cat is out of the bag since the concept of an entire new and hidden wing of the military is out of the bag and this makes the discussion of new secret conventional weapons seem oh so boring.

It's about bloody time that wee cat got let out! lol

Update: I still don't have an inside line on the secret US space program. No deepthroat has braved even posting anything here, yet. Drats and double drats!

Until then, here's a link I ran across on a NASA page, a proposition for a...

Antimatter Spaceship To Mars.

So I've gone link happy! Is that so wrong?!

Lacking any solid proof of Solar Warden or whatever it's called, perhaps a preponderance of circumstantial asides may be arrayed in synergistic way to reveal the Big Picture.

-=v=-


[edit on 1-7-2006 by vorlance]