Flight 93 was shot down over Pennsylvania, and this is the biggest 9/11 cover up of them all.

9:38 - C130H notifies Reagan "that aircraft crashed into the Pentagon sir"

The C130H apparently is allowed to continue on its all critical mission to Minnesota.

9:42 - FAA Herndon instructs all airborne aircraft to land at nearest airport

The C130H continues on.

9:49 - Commander of NORAD directs all air sovereignty aircraft to battle stations, fully armed

The C130H continues on.

10:03

I do not think that they are the same plane. I beleive that one C-130 was assigned to the f-16's that took out flight 93.

One report days after the crash states that there was one in the area, and gives an approximate distance.

Later, it is found that the C-130 at the Pentagon DID continue with it's original mission and had nothing to do with flight 93. At least from what what I read, is that it was 2 different planes.

911research.wtc7.net...

Read the first eyewitness account, and it talks again about a white business jet. Is this coincidence?






[edit on 24-3-2006 by esdad71]

I don't know what my thoughts are. The official record states it was the first to confirm the impact crater, so they put it there. Odd, huh?

Originally posted by Valhall
I don't know what my thoughts are. The official record states it was the first to confirm the impact crater, so they put it there. Odd, huh?

It looks to be the case that the C-130H in the official story is even more of an anomaly than previously thought.

Washington, D.C. is at 38n54, 77w02 (lat/long)
Shanksville, PA is at 40n01, 78w54

The surface distance between these two points is 126 miles. You can calculate this yourself here.

Based on a speed of 368 mph (from here) it would only take 20 minutes to go from D.C. to Shanksville.

Hmm. You're correct. Google's scale or map picture must be off. I apologize for the confusion.

Hmmm, NORAD was ordered to stand down. Therefore, I think someone disobeyed orders and shot down flight 93 before it could hit the white house. Doesn't change the Bush's etc being involved with the attacks theory.

NORAD wasn't ordered to stand down.

???

I think it was the same C-130, and I still agree with most of Val's assessment. The take-off time after the groundstop, and the fact that the aircraft remained in the air, after all planes were ordered out of the sky (except those flying combat missions), on its way to Minnesota, are, again, very convenient, for it to just happen to be headed that way, and be in the area. It reported both the Pentagon impact, and Flt 93's impact.

I am wondering if there wasn't an A-10 involved in the shoot down somewhere along the line, due to the eyewitness accounts provided. If the C-130 didn't take it down with an EMP blast and the F-16 didn't get it with a sidewinder, maybe there was some kind of cockpit breach. But in that case, I think the aircraft might have been taken back under control and landed safely.

Unless there was a cockpit breach and the aircraft was taken down anyway. Then the question is, was the breach a known fact, and was the aircraft still under control and viable to land before it was taken down anyway?

I find it interesting the errors and admissions being made by posters to this thread, btw. I think the consensus now is, it was taken down on purpose and we are messing around with the details. Quite a conclusion to come to for some of what I consider the keenest minds on the board.

Yes, I have always been puzzled about the C-130 for awhile. After research it seemed more likely that it had something to do with Flight 93. I still find it odd thought that they had a civilian jet do recon with the C-130 in the air.

NORAD was not under a stand down order, the president of the United States had ordered any plane threatening a major city be shot down. This is confirmed by the vice president on meet the press.

just my 2 cents...I lived in Milwaukee, Wisconsin on 9/11. The major airport for the city lies one mile west from lake Michigan. About 35-40 miles west of that is a airport called Waukesha (pro>wa-key-shaw) Airport . Waukesha is the next county west of Milwaukee. This airport can have a big plane land ,and does have bigger then lear jets land there. Most of their business is corporate jets ... Well that day George -Big Daddy- Bush's plane landed there because all planes had been called down to the nearest airport. They had a picture of him and Barbara Bush standing in front of one of the hangers in the Milwaukee Journal/Sentinel I believe it was the next day...Just was wondering where he and her were coming/going from/to.....

Originally posted by esdad71

NORAD was not under a stand down order, the president of the United States had ordered any plane threatening a major city be shot down. This is confirmed by the vice president on meet the press.

More than just the meet the press comment. From the 911 Commission Report:

At 10:39, the Vice President updated the Secretary on the air threat conference:

Vice President: There's been at least three instances here where we've had reports of aircraft approaching Washington-a couple were confirmed hijack. And, pursuant to the President's instructions I gave authorization for them to be taken out. Hello?

SecDef: Yes, I understand. Who did you give that direction to?

Vice President: It was passed from here through the [operations] center at the White House, from the [shelter].

SecDef: OK, let me ask the question here. Has that directive been transmitted to the aircraft?

Vice President: Yes, it has.

SecDef: So we've got a couple of aircraft up there that have those instructions at this present time?

Vice President: That is correct. And it's my understanding they've already taken a couple of aircraft out.

SecDef: We can't confirm that. We're told that one aircraft is down but we do not have a pilot report that did it.

AC-130 , not in this case. F16, erop camo-900 round cannon, 6, 3 second burst, 8 to clear. Electric bird would baffle your mind, the amount of damage it can do...at half throttle. Cell phones-die all the time, electric bird, not this time. Unsure shootdown, passenger rally, job done, news has heros, end of story. We were attacked. What would you do? When you know it.

I don't post much on here...but man what an incredible thread! I too feel that flight 93 was brought down either by electronic counter measures or a combination of elctronic counter measures and conventional firepower. I did a lttle digging into the 41st and 43rd Electronic Combat Squadrons which operate out of Davis-Montan Air Force base in Arizona. EC-130Hs have participated in a wide area of operations such as in Panama, Kosovo & Serbia, and Iraq. The 41st has been headquartered in as many as nine U.S. states & two territories and four foreign countires.

See this link and the one posted below: 41st Squadron

So it's not too far fetched they could have been operating at a base near where Flight 93 was brought down. The following quote is from an interesting article found on the EC-130H's capabilities...please note it's effect on radio communication but not on land lines:

“If the enemy is using radio, we can affect that. But,” Captain LeGrand conceded, “the only way to affect a land line is to drop a bomb on it.” That’s exactly what happened in Bosnia and Kosovo — while the jammers made mincemeat of Serb defensive radio signals, the bomb-droppers cut the land lines.

Here's the link:
Caught in the Net

To play Devil's advocate, the capabilities of the EC-130H probably has improved considerably since the Kosvo conflict. And of course the full capabilitiy of these planes will not be revealed. So an EC-130H could very well have scrambled/jammed flight 93's instrumentation but may or may not have caused the landlines and power on the ground to go out. Unless, it's capabilities have been improved or hushed up. Now an EC-130H working in conjunction with a Navy Powler is a different ball game. Those two together could cause flight 93 to come down and the land line and power failures. Thought these little tid bits might help.



---warpfactor9

I also want to say that I just voted esdad71 and Valhall for "way above" for this month. I'm sorry so late in doing so but I just read this thread tonight.



----warpfactor9

Originally posted by JIMC5499
If this was EMP from a nuclear blast I'd agree with you snafu, but this was directed jamming which is a whole different issue. The bizjet and the Cessna would have caught the fringes of the jamming signal not the whole jolt. I don't think that they would have had any permenant damage.

actually, we are talking about the possibility of an EMP weapon. you know as well as i do that normal buzzing would not do this kind of damage, even at a very high output. just because i havent heard of an EMP weapon being developed (outside of "the matrix" of course) doesnt mean that it hasnt happened. the damage valhall describes is exactly the damage you would see from an EMP, and it would not in any way effect a cessna. the reason is that a cessna's controls are all pushrods and wires....nothing electronic. the only effect it might have had on a cessna would have been its radios, depending upon its location (i have a feeling that any EMP developed would most likely be a directional weapon....its pretty much useless otherwise). an airliner's controls and instrumentation are completely electronic and would be fried by an EM pulse....especially its electronically controlled engines and flight control surfaces.

now, if we are talking normal electronic buzzing like you would have from a prowler, then you are absolutely correct. But i have long since concluded that the damage described would almost have to be from an EM pulse.


[edit on 25-3-2006 by snafu7700]

Greetings Fellow Believers,

I remember the hype about a group of ill-fated passengers trying to break into the cockpit. Remember the thing the "leader" of this said that was quoted over and over: "saddle up"? Could be wrong about it specifically--but I recall it had a very John Wayne sort of flavor.

And then President Bush has an address to the people of the United States, thanking the passengers of flight 93 who brought the plane down. I vividly recall the president asking the wife of the leader of the attempted takeover of the cockpit: blue eyed, blonde, and beautiful.

Too convenient. Sure, many wifes are beautiful! But this had the flavor of Hitler's speeches. He also highlighted Aryan women too.

Am I reaching on this one?

Originally posted by Jack of Scythes
Greetings Fellow Believers,

Remember the thing the "leader" of this said that was quoted over and over: "saddle up"? Could be wrong about it specifically--but I recall it had a very John Wayne sort of flavor.

the wife of the leader of the attempted takeover of the cockpit: blue eyed, blonde, and beautiful.

Too convenient. Sure, many wifes are beautiful! But this had the flavor of Hitler's speeches. He also highlighted Aryan women too.

Am I reaching on this one?

first off..................the comment was "LET'S ROLL". what is john wayne about that comment is beyond me.

second...............your attempt to tie in hilter speechs, ARYAN women and the fact that the wife is blonde, blue eyed and beautiful to a speech that BUSH made to the family's of the crashed liner is just beyond OUT THERE.

maybe you should do some additional research on this before you try to bring hitler speeches, blonde women..............tie them to bush...........then to the doomed airplane that crashed outside of SHANKSVILLE, PA.

we're disussing whether or not the plane was brought down intentionally by the US GOVMT and a coverup relating to the downing of the liner.

nice try






angie

I figured most of the critics would believe meet the press before the 9/11 commision so I did not include it thanks for the backup valhall

I don't know what happened to that plane but from the dreadful 'Heroes of Flight 93' TV prog that was aired here a couple of months ago it was clear it was in someone's interest to push the 'passenger takeover' version of events.

I've rarely seen such schmaltsy, tear-jerking, news-manged rubbish in my life!
The whole thing was so carefully done to provoke fear, admiration amd a lingering sense that these heroes died doing the 'right thing' that it just deepened my suspicion.

If the US people have been subjected to 5 years of such manipluative rubbish it's easier to understand why so few of them are willing / capable of questioning the official line