WAR: Iraqis Forced at Gun point to be Car Bombers

U.S. intelligence revealed that most Iraqi car bombers were forced to participate at gun point. Others were completely unaware of explosives hidden within their vehicle. In another case, a mans foot was 'duct-taped to the accelerator pedal'.



This brings some light to the 'voluntary nature' of these car bombing suspects. Recent reports revealed that Al-Qaeda has been orchestrated these attacks, more specifically the ring leader Al-Zarqawi has been responsible for these wave of car combs. It's evidence that Al-Qaeda still reigns strong in certain regions in Iraq. Regardless of Americas progression in the war on terrorism, there is still much left to accomplish.

There is / was a discussion in the last week here on ATS on just how "voluntary" these "suicide bombers" are. There are reports that thier families were held hostage to motivate the "volunteers" to do thier duty.

There's nothing nice to be said about Al-Queda but you do have to admit they're creative.

We'd better start out thinking them or this war will never end.

This is absolutely ridiculous.
Either get shot or blown up. They're dead either way.
I can hear it now..."if you don't become a suicide bomber, I'm gonna kill ya"
geez...

Originally posted by Old_Crow
This is absolutely ridiculous.
Either get shot or blown up. They're dead either way.
I can hear it now..."if you don't become a suicide bomber, I'm gonna kill ya"
geez...

... Or we'll kill your wife... Or your children ... Or you parents...

Mythatsabigprobe had some of it correct. As long as we're there we need to not only start out thinking them, but we're gonna have to get as nasty and dirty as they are too. Special Ops would be my answer on that.

While that may be true for many cases, I would not say most cases

Here is another way to look it

Others were completely unaware of explosives hidden within their vehicle.

They just happen to drive fast toward a crowd of people and ram into a building...

In another case, a mans foot was 'duct-taped to the accelerator pedal'.

So he would not second guess himself....

If someone is at gun point it is giving an option to
A-drive over here blow up along with other innocent people
B-Get shot
Which do you choose? hopefully B, why kill others along with you.

Like I said, There are many people this happens to and it really is sad, but saying MOST of the suicide bombers are not volunteers is just BS.

Come on man, go easy on these people.

If Jack Bauer can be forced to kill his partner and try to assasinate the president, then surely we can't hold it against these guys!

Originally posted by Nygdan
Come on man, go easy on these people.

If Jack Bauer can be forced to kill his partner and try to assasinate the president, then surely we can't hold it against these guys!

Is that some kind of a movie or television reference?

Anyway, I don't see it as being highly inconceivable that most suicide car bombers are extorted into it -- any real/smart terrorist would want to stay alive so he could recruit or force the next guy to do it, and the next, and the next... Come one, it makes perfect sense. If all the suicide bomb squadders die in suicidal bombings, then who is left to suicidally bomb?

Zip

Originally posted by Zipdot
If all the suicide bomb squadders die in suicidal bombings, then who is left to suicidally bomb?

A large portion of the population that believe dying for a righteous cause is the most noble and honorable way to reach Allah.

[edit on 5/18/2005 by Simulacra]

Right, and some people believe that repentence will help them get to heaven, but that doesn't mean they actually STOP swearing and having sex before marriage and doing drugs and whatever...

As noble a cause as suicide bombing might be, it still takes a desparate person to do it. The Qur'an has individuals place their families above all else, including violent jihad, and this excuses anyone with one from jihad duty. The only people left are violent extremists with no families and nothing to live for. How many of those are there?

Arguably, most people have families and care about living happy lives, no matter where they're from or what books they believe.

Zip

[edit on 18-5-2005 by Zipdot]

Originally posted by Zipdot
Right, and some people believe that repentence will help them get to heaven, but that doesn't mean they actually STOP swearing and having sex before marriage and doing drugs and whatever...

Because they have easily commit all the sin and just spend a few minutes 'repenting' and the slate is wiped clean. Muslims do not have this luxury.

Originally posted by Zipdot
As noble a cause as suicide bombing might be, it still takes a desparate person to do it.

Or a person that has a true and authentic belief in his/her faith.

Originally posted by Zipdot
The Qur'an has individuals place their families above all else including, violent jihad, and this excuses anyone with one from jihad duty.

Actually this is not true. Allah is placed above all. The word 'Muslim' literally means a 'Slave to Allah'. If family is detrimental to their relationship with Allah and their Islam duties, then they can easily disregard them.

Originally posted by Zipdot
The only people left are violent extremists

Some say extremist, I say it's an authentic belief in their faith.

Originally posted by Zipdot
with no families and nothing to live for.

Because as stated earlier, when a Jihad is initiated Allah takes priority. Family, Friends...etc is secondary.

Originally posted by Zipdot
How many of those are there?

Well being that Iraq is in complete pandemonium, and taken into the fact that thousands have been left with no family, no friends. I would say quite a few.
----------

Let me just state that I prescribe to no religions. However I can admire someone if they have an authentic belief in their faith whether it's Paganism, Judaism...etc.

Years ago, someone told me a story that relates to this topic....

Sunday morning a group of masked men armed with guns came into a church and begin to threaten everyone as they walked to the front of the church. The armed man said 'Who's ready to die in the name of the Lord!' a group of people ran out of the church in utter terror. The man fired his gun in the air and said 'Who's really ready to die in the name of the Lord!'. A crowd of people stormed out of the place. The church was nearly empty except for a few people that had their head down in prayer. The armed gunman opened a bible and said 'Now that we have all those fake Christians out of here, we can do some real worship!'

from Islam
It is to struggle for your parents to be happy to you all the time:
Proof: A man came to prophet Muhammad when he was preparing to a battle and he asked him a permission to go with him. Prophet Muhammad asked him: "Do you have parents?" He said: yes. prophet Muhammad told him: "Go back and make Jihad with them"

So, what are you saying, Islam is just a giant suicide cult?

Some random page about Muslims
''Suicide is a major sin in Islam,'' Maher Hathout, imam of the Islamic Center in Los Angeles, explained. Ibrahim Hooper of the Council on American-Islamic Relations pronounced that suicide ''would not be in accord with Islamic beliefs and practices.''

Well, sort of. The Koran does tell Muslims, ''Do not kill yourselves'' and warns that those who disobey will be ''cast into the fire.'' The Prophet Mohammed is reported to have said that a suicide cannot go to paradise.

Islamic laws oppose the practice.

This religious prohibition has had the intended effect. According to Franz Rosenthal, a scholar of the subject, ''suicide was of comparatively rare occurrence'' in traditional Muslim society. In contemporary Egypt, statistics bear out that suicide is exceedingly rare.

But those spokesmen are not telling the whole story, for Islamists consider suicide as not just legitimate, but highly commendable when undertaken for reasons of jihad (holy war). Going into war knowing with the certainty that one will die, they argue, is not suicide (intihar) but martyrdom (istishhad), a much-praised form of self-sacrifice in the path of God, a way to win the eternal affection of the houris in paradise.

So basically, the Qur'an forbids suicide, but the suicide bombers are convinced that they will be martyrs for committing suicidal bombings and that this overshadows the Qur'an's teachings about suicide.

This is why I call them extremists, not devout Muslims. They are deluding themselves by obscuring the teachings of the Qur'an to fit their brainwashing leaders' agenda.

Zip


[edit on 18-5-2005 by Zipdot]

Originally posted by Zipdot
So, what are you saying, Islam is just a giant suicide cult?

Of course not. You don't have to kill yourself in the name of Allah in order to reach him. But it is a method.

Originally posted by Zipdot
Islamic laws oppose the practice.

Islam does not oppose the practice of 'suicide bombings'. They oppose the practice of 'suicide', which is entirely different. If a soldier were to give his life for what he believes in, then his/her death would be a respectable and honorable one. Same with Islam.

Originally posted by Zipdot
So basically, the Qur'an forbids suicide, but the suicide bombers are convinced that they will be martyrs for committing suicidal bombings and that this overshadows the Qur'an's teachings about suicide.

Islam, as with any other religion is full of contradictions. In order to better interpret the Quran, different levels of Hadith were created in order to verify the Isnads that came from the prophet.

If anyone believes that the war between USA and Iraq isn't a religious one then they are blind. Warlords in Iraq are using religious propaganda to justify terrorist actions. Politicians in the states are using theocratical methods in order to justify their political standpoints.

Regarding the purported religious war that is presently taking place, I think that's an interesting point of view, and there are enough arguements to support it on many levels, but I completely disagree.

Many people claim that George Bush is such a religious zealot that he may think, in historical Japanese emperor style, that he was divinely chosen to rule the U.S. I think that's complete horse-hockey. I have serious doubts about the religious nature of the president.

Basically, I think he's totally faking it and the fact that so many people accuse his leadership of being a theocracy just shows, to him, how good he is at what he does.

Undoubtedly, many of our political manuevers and international stances are backed up by Christian morals - conveniently, if you ask me. I don't think that our political machinations are an effect of our collective religious morality. I see no cause and effect relationship there, when so many clear objectives are within our sight.

Zip

[edit on 18-5-2005 by Zipdot]

Serious ditto's here. How do I go about voting on this post.
Just like the whole "Bush is a moron" thing. I bet he spends *hours* working on that. Just so suckers underestimate him.

Originally posted by Zipdot
Regarding the purported religious war that is presently taking place, I think that's an interesting point of view, and there are enough arguements to support it on many levels, but I completely disagree.

Many people claim that George Bush is such a religious zealot that he may think, in historical Japanese emperor style, that he was divinely chosen to rule the U.S. I think that's complete horse-hockey. I have serious doubts about the religious nature of the president.

Basically, I think he's totally faking it and the fact that so many people accuse his leadership of being a theocracy just shows, to him, how good he is at what he does.

Undoubtedly, many of our political manuevers and international stances are backed up by Christian morals - conveniently, if you ask me. I don't think that our political machinations are an effect of our collective religious morality. I see no cause and effect relationship there, when so many clear objectives are within our sight.

Zip

[edit on 18-5-2005 by Zipdot]