I knew it :(vaccine related hearing loss)...

originally posted by: MaxxAction

I don't care as long as it's real...

EVERY paper I have read about some horrible potential side effect of this vaccine, it is like they have to pay homage to the Pharma Gods by saying something about how many lives have been saved by the vaccine, even though they're writing a paper about death from myocarditis, or blood clots, or whatever. Weird.

But I don't think you read very deep into any of it and just go with the click bait. Let me ask you what drug doesn't have 3 pages of side effects? Don't bother looking as there are none. Even the 4000 yearold drug we call aspirin 87mg kills 4000 Americans every year. If we look at just myocarditis in young males it has the highest rate of any of the other issues, but is still like 100 per million, but still concerning. The part I think you are not looking into is out of that 100 the vast majority are a mild condition that is successfully treated as an outpatient. What most of us take from this is we really do not need even that level of risk IF the virus is no threat to this age group in the first place, so why even give young males the vaccine if the virtue will be like a simple flu to them then we can have 0 per million, right?

The vaccine is as good or bad as any other drug when we talk side effects, but the mandates and pushing the vaccine AFTER we learned the virus was really bad for the old and high risk, but nothing for the other 80%+ of the country. So this goes beyond the vaccine in we should have used herd immunity early with very short lockdowns and we should have kept all schools open to push the herd immunity and not push the vaccine.

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

The 'rare' and 'mild' explanations are not very believable as they have no evidence attached on them and are usually emenating from the establishment or from vaccine apologists and denialists of reality.

I disagree since we do have a long period of time now and 13 billion shots given. The data is there to whom ever wants it.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: MaxxAction

I don't care as long as it's real...

EVERY paper I have read about some horrible potential side effect of this vaccine, it is like they have to pay homage to the Pharma Gods by saying something about how many lives have been saved by the vaccine, even though they're writing a paper about death from myocarditis, or blood clots, or whatever. Weird.

But I don't think you read very deep into any of it and just go with the click bait. Let me ask you what drug doesn't have 3 pages of side effects? Don't bother looking as there are none. Even the 4000 yearold drug we call aspirin 87mg kills 4000 Americans every year. If we look at just myocarditis in young males it has the highest rate of any of the other issues, but is still like 100 per million, but still concerning. The part I think you are not looking into is out of that 100 the vast majority are a mild condition that is successfully treated as an outpatient. What most of us take from this is we really do not need even that level of risk IF the virus is no threat to this age group in the first place, so why even give young males the vaccine if the virtue will be like a simple flu to them then we can have 0 per million, right?

The vaccine is as good or bad as any other drug when we talk side effects, but the mandates and pushing the vaccine AFTER we learned the virus was really bad for the old and high risk, but nothing for the other 80%+ of the country. So this goes beyond the vaccine in we should have used herd immunity early with very short lockdowns and we should have kept all schools open to push the herd immunity and not push the vaccine.

If the aspirin kills 4,000 Americans per year then imagine what some very questionable vaccines could do that are untested, experimental, potentially hazardous, and are known to cause plenty of serious adverse reactions and death.

Trying to dismiss the serious adverse reactions of the Covid-19 vaccines by making reference to the several other adverse reactions of other drugs is a terrible argument. You trivialise the side affects.

There is no herd immunity with RNA viruses that are rapidly mutating and with crippled vaccines that cannot prevent transmission and infection. That was a myth which emanated from the establishment.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

The 'rare' and 'mild' explanations are not very believable as they have no evidence attached on them and are usually emenating from the establishment or from vaccine apologists and denialists of reality.

I disagree since we do have a long period of time now and 13 billion shots given. The data is there to whom ever wants it.

Yes and I will argue everyone to take a look at the data then ask for an independent investigation on vaccine deaths and vaccine injuries. Don't forget that there is plenty of underreporting in VAERS, and plenty of resistance from the establishment trying to protect itself and the products.

Once when there is an independent investigation we will know the true numbers. But 'rare' and 'mild' are not believable explanations given the numerous side effects, their frequency, and the fact that the establishment lies continuously. Remember when they argued to get vaccinated to save granny as the vaccines prevent transmission and infection...

a reply to: Xtrozero

You're wrong...

I did read it. You may need to read further into the original post. I have been examining ears, and diagnosing hearing loss for 27 years. I have done so through hundreds of new drug introductions, and a couple of other epidemic/pandemic scares. There has never been anything like this.

There have been the anomalous years where you may see 4 or 5 people with sudden huge changes in their hearing, but NOTHING like this.

Furthermore, how can you continue to say things like:" When you think about it, what drugs haven't had side effects?"
That is utterly dismissive of the gravity of the current situation.

VAERS Data through 12/08/2022

Adverse Reactions: 1,481,226 All other vaccines since 1990: 912,419

Deaths: 32,828 All other vaccines since 1990: 10,046

Permanent Disabilities: 61,065 All other vaccines since 1990: 21,626

Birth Defects: 1194 All other vaccines since 1990: 208

In two years, this "vaccine" has caused 500k more adverse reactions, 3.2x the deaths, 2.9x the permanent disabilities, and 5.5x the number of birth defects than all other vaccines combined in the last 3 decades.

2x post

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

Yes and I will argue everyone to take a look at the data then ask for an independent investigation on vaccine deaths and vaccine injuries. Don't forget that there is plenty of underreporting in VAERS, and plenty of resistance from the establishment trying to protect itself and the products.

What independent group? Many groups from many different countries have looked at the data, not sure who you might mean here. VAERS is a first level reporting system that needs each case looked into and the reality is it is well under 5% related, so I wouldn't just grab raw numbers because they fit your narrative.

Once when there is an independent investigation we will know the true numbers. But 'rare' and 'mild' are not believable explanations given the numerous side effects, their frequency, and the fact that the establishment lies continuously. Remember when they argued to get vaccinated to save granny as the vaccines prevent transmission and infection...

Who? Once again. You do not want to trust anything, OK not much I can say to that.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Asmodeus3
If the aspirin kills 4,000 Americans per year then imagine what some very questionable vaccines could do that are untested, experimental, potentially hazardous, and are known to cause plenty of serious adverse reactions and death.

Every drug follows the same protocol, so it was tested just like ever other drug and with a hell of a lot more people in the test than any other drug in history. When do you remove the experimental label or are you all just going to hang it there as some kind of continuous point long gone? My point all along to include aspirins, is that you should not give drugs to those who really do not need it.

Trying to dismiss the serious adverse reactions of the Covid-19 vaccines by making reference to the several other adverse reactions of other drugs is a terrible argument. You trivialise the side affects.

I don't dismissed anything and have talked about each one, so no clue to what you are suggesting. Once again, understand my point.

There is no herd immunity with RNA viruses that are rapidly mutating and with crippled vaccines that cannot prevent transmission and infection. That was a myth which emanated from the establishment.

Well good... then we all die to the virus or vaccine... I guess I should cash out my 401k now and party! The whole point in the beginning was that COVID was a new virus, now it is not, so just another flu, but could get serious. If/when it does to the point of killing a high number then the vaccines will be necessary again.

Starting from your last part.
You misunderstood the terms natural immunity and herd immunity. In the vast majority of cases those who were exposed to SARS-CoV-2 developer natural immunity and survived primary infection. Apart from those who died.

Herd immunity cannot be achieved with rapidly mutating virus which is also very Infectious. It means that those who have been infected can be re-infected in the future with another variant but the chances of getting sick or die due to Covid are miniscule.

In terms of the vaccines. If they have been tested can you tell me the medium and long term effects? The benefit to risk ratio in all age groups?

originally posted by: MaxxAction

There have been the anomalous years where you may see 4 or 5 people with sudden huge changes in their hearing, but NOTHING like this.

Furthermore, how can you continue to say things like:" When you think about it, what drugs haven't had side effects?"
That is utterly dismissive of the gravity of the current situation.

VAERS Data through 12/08/2022

Adverse Reactions: 1,481,226 All other vaccines since 1990: 912,419

Deaths: 32,828 All other vaccines since 1990: 10,046

Permanent Disabilities: 61,065 All other vaccines since 1990: 21,626

Birth Defects: 1194 All other vaccines since 1990: 208

In two years, this "vaccine" has caused 500k more adverse reactions, 3.2x the deaths, 2.9x the permanent disabilities, and 5.5x the number of birth defects than all other vaccines combined in the last 3 decades.

OK, I'm not disputing your claims here with hearing. It would be nice to see a wider range of data on it as with just you it is an observation with zero ability to assign causation outside of your opinion.

You have the same issue with VAERS in it is a collection of data with zero research into each case to verify what is actually just a passive reporting system

VAERS is a passive reporting system, meaning that reports about adverse events are not automatically collected, but require a report to be filed to VAERS. VAERS reports can be submitted voluntarily by anyone, including healthcare providers, patients, or family members. Reports vary in quality and completeness. They often lack details and sometimes can have information that contains errors.

A report to VAERS generally does not prove that the identified vaccine(s) caused the adverse event described. It only confirms that the reported event occurred sometime after vaccine was given. No proof that the event was caused by the vaccine is required in order for VAERS to accept the report. VAERS accepts all reports without judging whether the event was caused by the vaccine.

The problem with VAERS is that before the pandemic it was hardly used, or known. Harvard study a few years ago showed that only about 1 to 2% was being reported. Since VAERS has become a common understanding there has been a massive surge in its use that anyone and everyone can put data into it. Also the CDC has mandated its use since COVID which was not in place before. This doesn't mean the data is accurate and in most cases by a massive percentage it is not once the cases are investigated. It also doesn't mean a massive surge either in new cases since it was greatly underutilized before and now everyone and their mother can add data and do to include the mandates by the CDC for the medical world.

We are in 2023 now so we really need to get off the VAERS narrative that was incorrect when that first video about it came out that all of you jumped on and still hold as some form of reliable numbers.

a reply to: Wide-Eyes

I think I may have worded that backwards

It cuts out what seems to be inflammatories.
So no cured/aged meats (prosciutto, hot dogs, sausages, salami etc ) ,
No cheese EXCEPT For American.
No alcohol.
Less than 1500 mg of salt a day or maybe it was 2000.
No mixed dishes like beef stroganoff or lasagna .
No chocolate.
No caffeine.

I mostly follow it except on weekends I sometimes have 'forbidden' cheeses and seltzers. So my ear is slightly ringing today.

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

If the aspirin kills 4,000 Americans per year then imagine what some very questionable vaccines could do that are untested, experimental, potentially hazardous, and are known to cause plenty of serious adverse reactions and death.

Every drug follows the same protocol, so it was tested just like everyother drug and with a hell of a lot more people in the test than any other drug in history. When do you remove the experimental label or are you all just going to hang it there as some kind of continuous point long gone? My point all along to include aspirins, is that you should not give drugs to those who really do not need it.

Trying to dismiss the serious adverse reactions of the Covid-19 vaccines by making reference to the several other adverse reactions of other drugs is a terrible argument. You trivialise the side affects.

I don't dismissed anything and have talked about each one, so no clue to what you are suggesting. Once again, understand my point.

There is no herd immunity with RNA viruses that are rapidly mutating and with crippled vaccines that cannot prevent transmission and infection. That was a myth which emanated from the establishment.

Well good... then we all die to the virus or vaccine... I guess I should cash out my 401k now and party! The whole point in the beginning was that COVID was a new virus, now it is not, so just another flu, but could get serious. If/when it does to the point of killing a high number then the vaccines will be necessary again.

Starting from your last part.
You misunderstood the terms natural immunity and herd immunity. In the vast majority of cases those who were exposed to SARS-CoV-2 developer natural immunity and survived primary infection. Apart from those who died.

We had what was called a new virus, so no one had anything. No one really understood how bad it might be. That was what we originally were up against. It is no longer a new virus so call it natural, herd or vaccine immunity it all comes down to it is no longer new and just has new variants that do have some resistance compared to zero as it first was.

In terms of the vaccines. If they have been tested can you tell me the medium and long term effects? The benefit to risk ratio in all age groups?

It seems this question is asked over and over... and explained over and over....

There is not a single drug tested for med long effects... ZERO ZILCH NONE...lol Can you understand that point now?

For ALL drugs and I mean ALL... After phase 3 the FDA approves it and it is available for use within the general population. Med and long effects are then determined from monitoring its use within the general population, so there is no long term testing just monitoring. Since ALL drugs work this way why is the vaccine the only one you all label expermental? I have asked you all what are you using to determine that and what is the timeline to where you see it not expermental anymore... I have gotten nothing, so yours and others use of the word "expermental" is just some emotional labeling to suggest something not there. We are around 13 billion shots now...

originally posted by: chris_stibrany

No alcohol.

WTF!!! I can't follow that diet...

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

If the aspirin kills 4,000 Americans per year then imagine what some very questionable vaccines could do that are untested, experimental, potentially hazardous, and are known to cause plenty of serious adverse reactions and death.

Every drug follows the same protocol, so it was tested just like everyother drug and with a hell of a lot more people in the test than any other drug in history. When do you remove the experimental label or are you all just going to hang it there as some kind of continuous point long gone? My point all along to include aspirins, is that you should not give drugs to those who really do not need it.

Trying to dismiss the serious adverse reactions of the Covid-19 vaccines by making reference to the several other adverse reactions of other drugs is a terrible argument. You trivialise the side affects.

I don't dismissed anything and have talked about each one, so no clue to what you are suggesting. Once again, understand my point.

There is no herd immunity with RNA viruses that are rapidly mutating and with crippled vaccines that cannot prevent transmission and infection. That was a myth which emanated from the establishment.

Well good... then we all die to the virus or vaccine... I guess I should cash out my 401k now and party! The whole point in the beginning was that COVID was a new virus, now it is not, so just another flu, but could get serious. If/when it does to the point of killing a high number then the vaccines will be necessary again.

Starting from your last part.
You misunderstood the terms natural immunity and herd immunity. In the vast majority of cases those who were exposed to SARS-CoV-2 developer natural immunity and survived primary infection. Apart from those who died.

We had what was called a new virus, so no one had anything. No one really understood how bad it might be. That was what we originally were up against. It is no longer a new virus so call it natural, herd or vaccine immunity it all comes down to it is no longer new and just has new variants that do have some resistance compared to zero as it first was.

In terms of the vaccines. If they have been tested can you tell me the medium and long term effects? The benefit to risk ratio in all age groups?

It seems this question is asked over and over... and explained over and over....

There is not a single drug tested for med long effects... ZERO ZILCH NONE...lol Can you understand that point now?

For ALL drugs and I mean ALL... After phase 3 the FDA approves it and it is available for use within the general population. Med and long effects are then determined from monitoring its use within the general population, so there is no long term testing just monitoring. Since ALL drugs work this way why is the vaccine the only one you all label expermental? I have asked you all what are you using to determine that and what is the timeline to where you see it not expermental anymore... I have gotten nothing, so yours and others use of the word "expermental" is just some emotional labeling to suggest something not there. We are around 13 billion shots now...

You have definitely confused natural immunity with herd immunity and toy don't seem to understand the differences.


You misunderstood the terms natural immunity and herd immunity. In the vast majority of cases those who were exposed to SARS-CoV-2 developer natural immunity and survived primary infection. Apart from those who have died from Covid.

Herd immunity cannot be achieved with a rapidly mutating virus which is very Infectious. It means that those who have been infected can be re-infected in the future with another variant but the chances of getting sick or die due to Covid are miniscule.

I will ask you again

If the vaccines are safe and effective and of the Phase3 clinical trial has happened, can you tell me the medium and long term effects? The benefit to risk ratio in all age groups? Even the short term effects.

Give me a list please of the medium and long term effects. You seem to be confusing the number of participants and how long it takes to establish safety and effectiveness.

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

You have definitely confused natural immunity with herd immunity and toy don't seem to understand the differences.

I guess you missed my point in I don't care. I fully understand the difference, it just isn't really my point.

If the vaccines are safe and effective and of the Phase3 clinical trial has happened, can you tell me the medium and long term effects? The benefit to risk ratio in all age groups? Even the short term effects.

Give me a list please of the medium and long term effects. You seem to be confusing the number of participants and how long it takes to establish safety and effectiveness.

Reread my post again. Why do you keep asking the same question over and over? What is medium range what is long term? Lets try and define what you want. If you are asking what is the 3+ years data then I would say there is none just like with every other drug known to man that has been approved less than 3 years ago. I can give you 2 year data since we are past 2 years. Why is something so simple seem so hard for you to understand?

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

You have definitely confused natural immunity with herd immunity and toy don't seem to understand the differences.

I guess you missed my point in I don't care. I fully understand the difference, it just isn't really my point.

If the vaccines are safe and effective and of the Phase3 clinical trial has happened, can you tell me the medium and long term effects? The benefit to risk ratio in all age groups? Even the short term effects.

Give me a list please of the medium and long term effects. You seem to be confusing the number of participants and how long it takes to establish safety and effectiveness.

Reread my post again. Why do you keep asking the same question over and over? What is medium range what is long term? Lets try and define what you want. If you are asking what is the 3+ years data then I would say there is none just like with every other drug known to man that has been approved less than 3 years ago. I can give you 2 year data since we are past 2 years. Why is something so simple seem so hard for you to understand?

If these vaccines have been tested then you would know the short, medium, and long term effects before releasing them in the general population. You would know whether they prevent transmission and infection and whether they significantly reduce them in case they don't prevent them. You would also know the benefit to risk ratio in all age groups before giving these products to everyone.

But you don't. Hence you can't release them in the general population when the Phase3 clinical trial has never happened.

From another thread I made

www.medrxiv.org...

Boys aged 12-17 more at risk from myocarditis after Pfizer jab than Covid

As you can see these vaccines are not safe and effective. And there are age groups there are at more risk from the vaccines rather than from Covid.

www.seniorliving.org...
get some apple airpods they make great hearing aids!
a reply to: chris_stibrany

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

If these vaccines have been tested then you would know the short, medium, and long term effects before releasing them in the general population.

How do you continue to not read what I have wrote... There is no testing past Phase 3 when FDA approves for the general population. Please explain how do they test them to get your medium and long term effects?

But you don't. Hence you can't release them in the general population when the Phase3 clinical trial has never happened.

Not sure what you mean here, Phase 3 trials happened... 46,000 participants was a crazy number compared to typically 300 to 3000 people.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

If these vaccines have been tested then you would know the short, medium, and long term effects before releasing them in the general population.

How do you continue to not read what I have wrote... There is no testing past Phase 3 when FDA approves for the general population. Please explain how do they test them to get your medium and long term effects?

But you don't. Hence you can't release them in the general population when the Phase3 clinical trial has never happened.

Not sure what you mean here, Phase 3 trials happened... 46,000 participants was a crazy number compared to typically 300 to 3000 people.

It was given an emergency authorisation.
No testing for short, medium, and long term effects. No testing even for transmission as Pfizer admitted earlier this year.

There is a difference between injecting participants and waiting to see if they have an immune response and testing the potential vaccine for everything that needs to be tested. This is where the confusion begins. The fact you had participants cannot buy you the time that wasn't there.

You first test the product for everything we have discussed and then you released the product in the general population.

What are the medium and long term effects?
Nobody knows.

What are the short term effects? We have just started seeing them and they are very unpleasant.

Boys aged 12-17 more at risk from myocarditis after Pfizer jab than Covid

You don't release these products to children when the risks outweigh the benefits. As an example.

Coming back to the topic. You need to know everything even if it's a possible hearing loss or a side effect as tinnitus.

Clinical phase trials take years to be completed. They only had a few months before releasing these products in the population.

Phase 3
Clinical trials include many thousands of participants. They aim to test whether a vaccine is effective in preventing people from getting the disease – in this case COVID-19. Phase 3 trials also thoroughly assess the vaccine for safety and side effects.

Which part of the Phase3 clinical trial happened? Did they rest for transmission and infection?
Did they test for short, medium and long term effects? Did they know the benefit to risk ratio?

a reply to: Suddenly

I don't have any Apple stuff but that is interesting.

originally posted by: Asmodeus3

It was given an emergency authorisation.
No testing for short, medium, and long term effects. No testing even for transmission as Pfizer admitted earlier this year.

You keep bring up something that just doesn't exists with any new drug. The FDA does not test period, but they follow each phase and then approve the next phase up through phase 3. After phase 3 all testing is done and it goes into the bureaucratic system to be approved. Same as with Europe and any other country. We see drugs approved in Europe quicker than America because their bureaucratic system for approval is faster, so the same drug that passes phase 3 is the same drug approved in both places without further testing done in that waiting period for the paperwork to clear. To say passed phase 3, emer auth or fully approved is the same damn drug with no extra testing done.

That extra testing is called observation within the general population. Now, if you want to suggest that the mandates were completely crazy to do with a new drug then we are 100% in agreement. The bad guy here is not the vaccine, but the mandates forcing people who most likely didn't need it to get it or else. So yes, we are now seeing follow on effects from the drug like myocarditis in young men and blood clots in young women with neither group needing the vaccine in the first place.

Coming back to the topic. You need to know everything even if it's a possible hearing loss or a side effect as tinnitus.

Sure we agree, but a few here blame everything on the vaccine when they don't even know if the person actually was vaccinated. Some of you are just not helping in the whole situation and are like the same thing as the left screaming the virus will kill everyone.