US tells Putin to choose confrontation or dialogue over Ukraine

a reply to: vNex92

Its because of the satellite images the NATO/US decided to bomb through in Iraq.
Once the US came into Iraq there were no WMDs no stockpiles compared to the alleged the satellite images.

Iraq didn't involve NATO it was an operation led by a man out for revenge along with a coalition of the "willing" consisting mainly of the UK.
Of course satellite images can be faked there's also video , Russian troop holding exercises near the Ukraine border.


I don't think the satellite images are faked , they show what is reported because Putin is playing his own brand of hard diplomacy , but I don't think he will invade.

a reply to: RAY1990

As soon as the UN resolution was passed that enabled UN member states to act offensively in Libya in the defence of civilians

I had being following Libya for quite a while. That line is pure crap. defence of civilians? you mean those rebels that were coming out of Benghazi's port during the start of the so called peaceful protest?

A number of those of so called "defence of civilians" were nothing but western backed funded protestors. Its why Russia and Egypt had being going after NGOs in recent years.


Again we try not to indiscriminately kill in the West
West/NATO had no issues indiscriminately killing Civilians and destroying Civilian infrastructure in Belgrade during 2000s.

NATO destroyed a civilian train killing innocent families which NATO claimed it was a military carrying train which it wasn't.

a reply to: gortex

So its agaisnt the law for Russia to conduct exercises near its borders? or would you prefer to see NATO/US troops marching towards Moscow in Russia?

How would you feel if Russia/China do a joint exercise near Mexico? near American borders?

a reply to: gortex

Russian troop holding exercises near the Ukraine border.
They do this ever year. Meanwhile you perfectly fine with NATO/EU/US threatening a war over them. Isolating Russia within their own borders? like a blockade?

But you are ok with NATO/EU expansion further into Eastern Europe? then you have the EU officials demanding those same countries to follow through the demands of the EU to be meet.

a reply to: vNex92

But you are ok with NATO/EU expansion further into Eastern Europe?

No.
I've already said I think Putin has a point , I also think NATO has pushed to far to the East and should pull its neck in.

Oh and I'm not American I'm British.

a reply to: RAY1990


To make things worse on what NATO did they even speed up the actual vid of the bombing on the train. NATO targeted and hit civilian settlement in city of Nis, which is bombed by cluster ammunition, banned by Hague convention, hit Chinese Embassy, used depleted uranium shells.

NATO/US had no issues on using depleted uranium shells in Serbia, Iraq.
You know that America's govt actually supported some Jihadist fighters in Bosnia during the war? they did. The Mujahedins had gained a heavy influence in the region as a result after the conflict.

a reply to: vNex92

Forgive us for not jumping straight to nuclear threats and war then! Sheesh.

How do you want to play hypothetical war games then? Can we pick armies from any period and put them together? Putin can lead.

a reply to: vNex92

There's no restriction on depleted uranium and this is hardly the thread to debate the long term affects of said ammunition, there's plenty of other threads on ATS with wonderful information though.

a reply to: RAY1990

How do you want to play hypothetical war games then?

How is that Jihadist/Mujahedin western alliance going? did you thought it would be a good idea?

a reply to: RAY1990

There's no restriction on depleted uranium

Remind us how well funding or arming Jihadists has paid off for Western Countries/NATO/US.

a reply to: vNex92

Wouldn't know I'm not a jihadist, I also don't assume too much.

I normally don't get involved with pissing matches with fanboys of Putin either, nor do I usually go compare.

We've got one too, it's also a family wrecker. It's not the size that matters either to be cliché.

a reply to: RAY1990

Wouldn't know I'm not a jihadist

I didnt mean you. I meant the US govt and admins had no issues on backing Jihadist element groups on the ground nor do they have a problem supporting right wing groups when it benefits them.

fanboys of Putin either

I suppose you are either fanboys of Trump or Biden/Clinton Obama ones.

a reply to: vNex92

I have no doubt that stuff and worse is currently happening, my own government included (UK) and in all honesty we're both kidding ourselves if we were to think any side is in the right.

I'll stand by my original post though and state that Russia is in the wrong with these drafts I linked and their approach of pushing ultimatums.

That said I'm not a politician, just another idiot on the web. I'm about 95% sure Russia is strong balling with ridiculous notions. He isn't an idiot. I'd prefer to talk about why he came out with such demands rather than the back and forth we've had so far.

In all honesty these drafts and Russia's recent stance needs attention and the topic isn't getting that. I'm talking about the MSM too not ATS.

To add: I'm not a fan of people in general, politicians or waaay down on the list of people I'd like to meet and I've never held my tongue on ATS in regards to them.

originally posted by: gortex

I don't think the satellite images are faked , they show what is reported because Putin is playing his own brand of hard diplomacy , but I don't think he will invade.

I found the video from which the material is taken - www.youtube.com...

So that you understand Voronezh is located at the same distance from the border of Ukraine as the city of York is from London (approximately 330-350 kilometers = 210 miles).

Biden's best move is to plead dementia...didn't one of his family members make a load of money with the big guy getting a huge cut? in Ukraine?

If the US pushes into war over Ukraine it's because Ukraine has Joe bent over the barrel, as well as other politicians on both sides of the aisle. They have likely been receiving huge kickbacks etc. and siphoning funds from this and many other Ukrainian and American projects. Putin probably knows this and is making Biden dance and bluster, full well knowing Biden won't do anything



War before the midterms kills the DNC, Putin can do whatever he wants. Biden putting American forces into harm's way, now with all that's going on, is gonna kill is his already stellar poll numbers.

Hell, we could go to war for a completely just and righteous cause now and we would still have 30-40% against it. Don't think for a second Putin doesn't know this, he is hoping for concessions but he will keep up the pressure on Biden. FAWK Putin has already told Biden the score and all that's left is him telling NATO they are going to this hen party alone. Then watch them cackle.

Not a military man I see. Understandable. The assets are already in place to blunt any ground thrust by Russia. They do not yet have to be boots in the Ukraine. The Ukraine in and of itself is not actually that important, beyond its sea ports, which Russia already has control of.

This is just a large scale ploy by Putin to get some concessions. He doesn’t like NATO closing in on its borders. He knows they lose a conventional war. They would get battered off the park and humiliated. Not something Vladimir wants or could afford.

There will be no nuclear exchange either. That is goodnight for us all.

You need to understand ALL the military connotations and permutations at play here. I don’t think you do.

a reply to: ARM1968

The OP isn't interested in talking about the ramifications of a Ukrainian invasion. They're interested in demonising NATO and any association aka the west in general whilst making Russia out to be the poor bully victims.

The fact he's been here less than a week suggests to me he's playing propaganda and this is supported by his notions of ridicule towards anything he deems anti-Russian.

I'm far from understanding it all and I highly respect the more informed opinions of the members here, I find this a pressing subject that deserves a little more attention than "my side is better than your side" malarkey.

a reply to: camain

I think this comes down to history and Churchill's policy of appeasement.

What 'policy of appeasement' exactly would that be?

Churchill was last Prime Minister in 1955, 66 years ago.

I suspect there may be many contributory causes to the current crisis, most of which I don't pretend to understand.....but surely more recent politicians and statesmen have had plenty of time to put things right.

No-one wants to got to war, no matter how relatively small or minor it is - the British public will never support any armed intervention at the moment, it would be political suicide for anyone to even suggest that British troops should get involved in any sort of armed conflict.

I see no reason why people from other countries would see things differently.

Not a military man I see. Understandable. The assets are already in place to blunt any ground thrust by Russia. They do not yet have to be boots in the Ukraine. The Ukraine in and of itself is not actually that important, beyond its sea ports, which Russia already has control of.

This is just a large scale ploy by Putin to get some concessions. He doesn’t like NATO closing in on its borders. He knows they lose a conventional war. They would get battered off the park and humiliated. Not something Vladimir wants or could afford.

There will be no nuclear exchange either. That is goodnight for us all.

You need to understand ALL the military connotations and permutations at play here. I don’t think you do.

US came to Ukraine and their troops are next to Russian borders but they are the one that are telling that Russia needs to move ... move where? To the moon? USA is the only country that left their troops in Europe after WW2, not Russia.