Family estrangement: Why adults are cutting off their parents

a reply to: Itisnowagain

This may be true, but at least the vast majority of parents actually love their kids. When the state wants to step in and play mum and dad and people suck on its teat. That’s when we should sound the alarm.

originally posted by: ElGoobero
I feel like there are a lot of ungrateful kids that, now they are grown, don't need their parents so they're cutting them off as a nuisance.

I think you assume the wrong cause here. I think it is more people are able to see what a normal healthy family looks like, and a lot of people that grew up with nut jobs for parents, now know they are nut jobs. I think in the past it was a lot harder to realize you may have a crazy family, go your own way, and separate yourself from the crazy people that will screw you up.


I think the internet let a lot of people look more objectively at how they live, and many of them realized it was a pile of crap. That's why once they realized how bad it was, they cut off family, because nothing else was going to work. I would also bet money that the ones who completely cut off family member, did all the other less aggressive things more than once before completely cutting off family.

Then their crazy parents blame the victim child and go get more pills from their shrink with more pity and sob stories. You got parents, "Woe is me, I abused my kid, when they got big, they realized it, and now I am alone forever."

Booo hooo hoo

In reality, the kids are breaking the cycle and cutting the cancer out from what they will be building with their own healthy families.

Thats what progress looks like for people who grew up with crap parents.

a reply to: TrollMagnet

High-five to you. I think that's exactly what's going on for the most part.

a reply to: TrollMagnet

think the internet let a lot of people look more objectively at how they live, and many of them realized it was a pile of crap.

Really? By that you must mean sites such as FB where people are only seeing a very one sided manipulated reality. If your upbringing was a pile of crap you don’t need the internet to tell you. It’s one of those things that’s kind of obvious.

What FB and such are very good at is making you feel inadequate and then have you blaming others for this feeling rather than taking responsibility for yourself. Another lie is the perfect happy family that gets portrayed in advertising, again to make you feel inadequate and buy stuff.

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: putnam6
'This be the verse'

They # you up, your mum and dad.
They may not mean to, but they do.
They fill you with the faults they had
And add some extra, just for you.

But they were #ed up in their turn
By fools in old-style hats and coats,
Who half the time were soppy-stern
And half at one another's throats.

Man hands on misery to man.
It deepens like a coastal shelf.
Get out as early as you can,
And don't have any kids yourself.

By Philip Larkin.

Thank you I had never heard the whole song, though my brother and sisters and I used to sing this rather frequently about our parents and we sing this to our kids when they complain now.

and I think I have my saying for the Christmas card this year, perfect for all those family get-togethers

originally posted by: EventideExpanse
a reply to: ElGoobero

This is precisely how the powers that be like it. It's important to sever familial and community ties so all a person has to rely on is the state.

My daughters love me and I love them very very much, but yea if there was a vaccine mandate they both would turn me in in a heartbeat and not give 2 seconds thought about it.

Im actually conflicted Im proud of their independence from family, but dammit

a reply to: surfer_soul

I never said FB or any type of social media. That's a straw man argument.

I said internet. Understanding how to recognize psychosis can be revolutionizing. Being able to look up different types of mental illness. Seeing examples of abuse. Seeing videos of normal families doing normal things. Learn what a normal punishments are. What family is supposed to make you feel like when you win, or when you fail. See how normal people interact during holidays, birthdays, etcetera.

I think assuming FB or Twitter have much to do with any of it is laughable. If the internet is all it takes to destroy a family, they were doing a pretty poor job in the first place.

Once you realize the problems in your life are amplified by a toxic family, do you really think intelligent people would keep themselves in that situation? In the 60's all day long. They would never leave. They would be abused. They would have had to read stacks of books to figure out a fraction of what was going on.

NOW? No way. An intelligent person can now inform themselves, and follow a horrible but effective path laid out by others to get rid of the problems they were born into. I guarantee, 99%, with the exception being kids rescued by police, every person to isolate their families first left and returned multiple times, same as an abused spouse. There is no difference. There are people in this country in their 30s that are still treated like teenagers who would do much better in their lives if they got rid of their family members who told them they will fail at this, cant do that, aren't attractive enough for this or that, shouldn't have kids, shouldn't try at this because they will fail. ON and on an on.

And every time this happens, the parent plays the victims. Woe is me every single time. My kids abandoned me. Same story every set of abusive parents put out.

People are tribal. They do not leave their tribe unless there is good reason. It is built in to stay with your group. Its evolution. They are not leaving because they want to, but because they have to. Painting these people in a negative light when they are doing the right thing even though it sucks is appalling. Very very rarely does any of this have anything to do with social media, unless the person was a victim of someone manipulating them, which should not be classified as the same thing this thread argues.

originally posted by: surfer_soul

There are also a lot of poor patents who do not work hard enough to make life work when their kids go through hard or confusing times, eg as a teenager.

Being poor/growing up poor has nothing to do with morality or ones beliefs and cultural values.

Kids behaviour past the age of 7 is largely influenced by their friends and peers much more so than their parents. It’s generally the system that fails people who are poor.

Turning this around and blaming the parents for “not working hard enough” to make life work for a (often never satisfied) teenager is a cop out and bs.

Uh, you are not interpreting that comment correctly -- stop automatically associating the word 'poor' with money. I read his comment to mean poor parents (as in sub-par or #TY PARENTS) not financially broke ones.

Otherwise he'd have been MUCH more direct about financial constraints there.

a reply to: and14263

Don't work hard enough to make life work?! Perhaps you are too old to recall being young when you were you were absolutely certain your parents couldn't possibly understand a thing you were going through because 19-dickety-2 was nothing like the super-evolved and enlightened times *you* were growing up in, so nothing they had to say really mattered.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: and14263

Don't work hard enough to make life work?! Perhaps you are too old to recall being young when you were you were absolutely certain your parents couldn't possibly understand a thing you were going through because 19-dickety-2 was nothing like the super-evolved and enlightened times *you* were growing up in, so nothing they had to say really mattered.

Ok, that's two jumping the gun. And14..etc is British, is he not? Read it again with that in mind, I'm pretty certain he's saying not that poor parents need to clock in at work more, but that poor means cruddy here (not penniless) & they need to stop being lousy parents and "clock in mentally more at home" as it were, and be an active parent that teaches kids how to navigate the world and mitigate it's obstacles.

How am I the only one seeing that plain as day? I mean, I converse with a family friend in the UK often, am I starting to think/interpret like a Brit now? lol


Edit: And keep in mind that I don't often come to And's defense, we seldom agree on anything.

a reply to: Nyiah

You might be right, but I picked up on the “don’t work hard enough” which people often use an excuse for being poor.

You are certainly right about poor parenting as a thing though, I’m not disputing this. What I’m against is the state stepping in to do the job, or more precisely the state causing division in the first place. For me a good parent loves their children more than anything else and will try their best for them. Thankfully for most parents this is a natural instinct.

I’m British and over here a working class minimum wage level mother is better off financially being single, the more kids they have the more so. Anything the working class father contributes financially will be taken away by the state. Because the state needs to step in to cover the cost of living and a low income earner can’t cover that for a small family. So right there we are seeing one of the main factors that keep relationships going being taken away. The break up of the family unit.
Going back historically it took both parents to raise children, taking on different roles in doing so, it’s also true of much of the animal kingdom. But today the father simply isn’t needed, the state has taken his place instead.

That might sound sexist but hopefully you see my point.

originally posted by: ElGoobero
BBC article about adults 'cutting off' their parents

Formally known as ‘estrangement’, experts’ definitions of the concept differ slightly, but the term is broadly used for situations in which someone cuts off all communication with one or more relatives, a situation that continues for the long-term, even if those they’ve sought to split from try to re-establish a connection.

“The declaration of ‘I am done’ with a family member is a powerful and distinct phenomenon,” explains Karl Andrew Pillemer, professor of human development at Cornell University, US. “It is different from family feuds, from high-conflict situations and from relationships that are emotionally distant but still include contact.”

not surprisingly a lot of this is about politics

experts believe at least part of the context for this is increased political and cultural polarisation in recent years. In the US, an Ipsos poll reported a rise in family rifts after the 2016 election, while research by academics at Stanford University in 2012 suggested a larger proportion of parents could be unhappy if their children married someone who supported a rival political party, which was far less true a decade earlier. A recent UK study found that one in 10 people had fallen out with a relative over Brexit. “These studies highlight the way that identity has become a far greater determinant of whom we choose to keep close or to let go,” says Coleman.

personally I'm seeing a huge value rift between old / middle aged persons and kids over values, traditional / Christian vs 'progressive' anti-traditional anti-Christian.
shame we can't better agree to disagree.

I feel like there are a lot of ungrateful kids that, now they are grown, don't need their parents so they're cutting them off as a nuisance.
very sad.

In my family all it takes is clamato juice and beer.

a reply to: TrollMagnet

Yeah I assumed FB and social media because besides YouTube and porn, the fact is that’s the vast majority of where internet traffic is.

Once you realize the problems in your life are amplified by a toxic family, do you really think intelligent people would keep themselves in that situation? In the 60's all day long. They would never leave. They would be abused. They would have had to read stacks of books to figure out a fraction of what was going on.

What are you talking about in the 60’s all day long? How old are you? There are many reasons why people endure abusive relationships and not knowing they are in such is hardly a factor. Come on, you don’t need to know about mental health problems and such to know something isn’t right. Even a dog when it’s not being treated right it doesn’t need to go on the net to find out.

I have some personal experience in this due to nearly cutting off my sister from my life. My cousin cut off his own mother and so did a friend. The reason why people keep going back is an attempt to put things right or work things out, not because they aren’t intelligent or uneducated as you’d have it. It may be that they are better off walking away for good. But it’s much more nuanced than you seem to think.

a reply to: Nyiah

I grew up poor with a sister. My parents worked hard at every level, but the results could not be more different. One of us is fairly successful and the other is a dysfunctional wreck. At some point. It is the kids too.

a reply to: ketsuko

Hmm I’d never considered you to be a dysfunctional wreck.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: Nyiah

I grew up poor with a sister. My parents worked hard at every level, but the results could not be more different. One of us is fairly successful and the other is a dysfunctional wreck. At some point. It is the kids too.

Ok, Ket, that's nice and all, but I think you're still missing the entire point. It's not poor form to point out a poor interpretation of something, nor is is poor form to consider one may have missed a mark.

It's almost like you'd prefer it be about money and not just poor effort on the part of absent parenting.

originally posted by: surfer_soul
a reply to: Nyiah

You might be right, but I picked up on the “don’t work hard enough” which people often use an excuse for being poor.

Part of the downside of the English language is our penchant for multi-use words & phrases. In this case, we're arguing about what context "poor" has been intended in. In the poor/poverty equation, I think that's probably more a popular informal use, rather than a proper formal use. We would sit here and pick everything apart for days, I love examining the redundancies & pretzel logic of the English language structure, but that's for another thread!

You are certainly right about poor parenting as a thing though, I’m not disputing this. What I’m against is the state stepping in to do the job, or more precisely the state causing division in the first place. For me a good parent loves their children more than anything else and will try their best for them. Thankfully for most parents this is a natural instinct.

Indeed a parent is usually going to fall back on their instincts and want the best, but we cannot discount that parents are also subject to outside influence & peer pressure, too. in other words, what I'm saying is there are plenty of people who will shirk being a parent to look cooler as the Friend Parent, or who will ignore everything negative and never implement any kind of discipline or corrective measure because Lil Prince/Princess Can Do No Wrong doesn't need thaaaaat, come onnnnn (note the exaggeration is in a mocking manner of those parenting types, not you)

I’m British and over here a working class minimum wage level mother is better off financially being single, the more kids they have the more so. Anything the working class father contributes financially will be taken away by the state. Because the state needs to step in to cover the cost of living and a low income earner can’t cover that for a small family. So right there we are seeing one of the main factors that keep relationships going being taken away. The break up of the family unit.
Going back historically it took both parents to raise children, taking on different roles in doing so, it’s also true of much of the animal kingdom. But today the father simply isn’t needed, the state has taken his place instead.

That might sound sexist but hopefully you see my point.

And I agree, the more solid & whole the family unit, the better off the offspring. I'm not against moms staying home & raising what we gestated & birthed, and being active in their lives, and being ok with the choices made to do so -- I AM that stay-at-home mom, right down to the homeschooling. But ultimately, even resisting the flashy lure of government doles has to be something taught generation-by-generation. Anything else is deliberately failing pre-emptively by not teaching that those choices relating to those shiny lures matter.

a reply to: Nyiah

I'm reading it the same way you are, that they are doing a poor job of parenting.

I'm 53 and still struggling with a shocking phone call from my parents two days ago. I don't know what to do.

My parents, in their 70's, called me. They were extremely drunk but denied it. My mom started badgering me because I've been depressed over what's happening in society as I'm not on board with any of the mandates. I've developed anxiety over being in public due to masks, as I need to see the face to understand intention. She started treating me like a child, ie encouraging me to just try to be brave. I asked her if she has ever heard the quote about it not being a sign of health to be adjusted to a sick society.

She said "of course" but my dad heard on speaker phone and wanted to argue that I'm not following science. I said I've read scientific papers that are showing evidence of heart disease in young men and as a mom of two at that age it was a huge concern for me. He bellowed that the boys should get vaccinated and so should I. I said I had to go and hung up.

The phone rang a couple times before I had the courage to face it. Then it was all about how cold and uncaring I am with my mom saying they won't live much longer and are really ill. My dad is hollering about how I'm putting my mom at risk with upsetting her as she has high blood pressure.

Now, the only medical things I know about my parents is mom's long term fluctuating blood pressure that I thought she had under control and my dad has very mild copd but has since he was young. This week my dad was treated for a painful calcium buildup in the shoulder. Yet, here they are dying? and drinking? and apparently I don't care?

My mom was crying and saying they don't have long to live and if I care I'd get vaccinated. My dad is hollering that the more shots get into arms the better. Damn confusing. I don't think I'm a cold person. There are times I can't connect with people and I'm off in my own mind but I don't not care.

So, it all brings me to think that there is a fundamental problem when the elder generation is clinging to life so hard they cannot enjoy it and cannot let go of their fear in order to let younger, healthier people get back to normal. I find it shocking that they'd accept endless lockdowns which are destroying the economy and culture for the young and that all us older people need to accept that age comes with risk and enjoy it while you can. I hate the damage that is going to be handed back to the youth.

Sorry to vent.

a reply to: Atsbhct

My father was a very bad person and a very crappy father and when my parents got divorced it was the best day of my life . I was 17 at the time and didn't talk to him for for 45 years until he called me and said he was broke and needed a place to stay . My wife got him into a senior living center that he could afford , got a call a year ago that he had died and I need to clean out his apartment . Everything including his ashes went into their dumpster and I still hate him to this day . I did learn how to be a better father by doing the opposite of what he did . Sometimes dumping family is a good thing and the best way to live .