The spike protein is the killer--beware mRNA vaccines

originally posted by: ThatDamnDuckAgain
a reply to: LordAhriman
What about the timespan it's in your body and how exactly it goes out of your system?

You skipped that part, have you thought about it before? How exactly do you get rid of it? Does it just vanish? You sure have some information for us all about this, that seems like reasonable knowledge to posses before taking an experimental jab.

Or two, three ...

Clearly the liver, kidneys and other organs will have to deal with it, so how exactly?

The mRNA has a longevity measured in hours. It breaks down chemically very quickly. That is why with the Pfizer vaccine is stored, frozen, at -80 degrees and after thawing, must be used within 45 minutes, or it is throw out material.

However, once the spike protein is produced, it lasts longer in the cell until it is destroyed by immune response. Peak response is in 28 days, but most of the response will be in place by 14 days.

The spike protein does not escape from the cell. Even were it to be close to the cell wall and moving outward, it would bind to the ACE2 receptors on the surface of the cell and get stuck there.

originally posted by: LordAhriman

originally posted by: ThatDamnDuckAgain
a reply to: LordAhriman
What about the timespan it's in your body and how exactly it goes out of your system?

You skipped that part, have you thought about it before? How exactly do you get rid of it? Does it just vanish? You sure have some information for us all about this, that seems like reasonable knowledge to posses before taking an experimental jab.

Or two, three ...

Clearly the liver, kidneys and other organs will have to deal with it, so how exactly?

The one and only active ingredient in Pfizer and Moderna is mRNA. It is broken down and useless after 6 hours at room temperature, and even less time at body temperature. After a few hours the mRNA is useless and secreted as waste. By that time your body has created the spike protein that mimics covid-19 and your body has begun to fight it by breaking it down. Spike protein has been shown to be present in your liver for a day or 2, and the rest of the action takes place at the injection site, underarm lymphnodes, and your spleen. Fevers are common for a day or 2 as your immune system breaks down these proteins. Mind you, after the mRNA is spoiled, you are no longer producing the proteins. Once your body breaks them down, it stores the info. The broken down proteins are then treated as any other object your body identifies as waste, and you'll sweat it out or flush it in a day or 2.

Actually, neither the spike protein itself, nor the mRNA, are what has been measured in the liver, ovaries, and spleen.

The paper produced by Pfizer was about testing the lipid coating of the mRNA, to give the mRNA longevity enough to be functional. In that paper, they replaced the mRNA 'package' with the light emitting indicator Luciferase. Then they could analyze the migration of the lipid coated nanoparticles throughout the bodies of several animals.

There was no mRNA present in the experiments done for the paper, it was purely about the safety of the lipid nanoparticles.

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: IAMTAT
a reply to: Salander

You mean the spike proteins that were SUPPOSED to stay in the deltoid muscle...and NOT circulate throughout the body and interact with major internal organs?

mRNA vaccines do not contain the spike protein.

They contain the mRNA that creates the protein inside the cell. On the outside of the cell, there is no spike protein released because the rest of the virus that allows for the creation of new whole virus, and of its release from the cell, is absent.

The only way the mRNA in the vaccine gets into the cell is by the damage to the cells caused by the needle penetration. So, its effect is extremely local.

NOT extremely local according to the inventor of mRNA tech.

Dr. Robert Malone, creator of mRNA vaccine technology, said the COVID vaccine lipid nanoparticles — which tell the body to produce the spike protein — leave the injection site and accumulate in organs and tissues.

childrenshealthdefense.org...

originally posted by: IAMTAT

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: IAMTAT
a reply to: Salander

You mean the spike proteins that were SUPPOSED to stay in the deltoid muscle...and NOT circulate throughout the body and interact with major internal organs?

mRNA vaccines do not contain the spike protein.

They contain the mRNA that creates the protein inside the cell. On the outside of the cell, there is no spike protein released because the rest of the virus that allows for the creation of new whole virus, and of its release from the cell, is absent.

The only way the mRNA in the vaccine gets into the cell is by the damage to the cells caused by the needle penetration. So, its effect is extremely local.

NOT extremely local according to the inventor of mRNA tech.

Dr. Robert Malone, creator of mRNA vaccine technology, said the COVID vaccine lipid nanoparticles — which tell the body to produce the spike protein — leave the injection site and accumulate in organs and tissues.

childrenshealthdefense.org...

He was talking about the "lipid nanoparticles". The particles do not contain the spike protein.

By the time they reach other organs, they cannot penetrate cells (the protein would bind to the cell wall anyway, but it isn't even in the lipid nanoparticles), and the mRNA content is long degraded past functionality.

And Pfizer did studies that proved the safety of the particular lipid nanoparticle formulation used in the vaccine.

The article errs in its description of what Malone was talking about, and of the function of those particles, and of the nature of the testing.

Interesting article, not really on topic, but it is good

medicalxpress.com...

Isn’t it amazing that all these Big Pharma companies could conduct so many thorough tests on an unproven vaccine ‘technology’ in so short a time and be so confident that all is well and everything is safe. I am in awe. Makes you wonder why it takes so long and so many studies for, err, ‘normal’ vaccines.

Indeed you have to wonder why Moderna said quite openly that they were effectively installing an operating system in the recipients of their vaccine. Odd you would say that for something lasting mere hours in each patient.

Time will tell, but these vaccines will achieve very little in any case as the mutations out strip them and the most deadly mutations are yet to come - and come they will.

originally posted by: ARM1968
Isn’t it amazing that all these Big Pharma companies could conduct so many thorough tests on an unproven vaccine ‘technology’ in so short a time and be so confident that all is well and everything is safe. I am in awe. Makes you wonder why it takes so long and so many studies for, err, ‘normal’ vaccines.

Indeed you have to wonder why Moderna said quite openly that they were effectively installing an operating system in the recipients of their vaccine. Odd you would say that for something lasting mere hours in each patient.

Time will tell, but these vaccines will achieve very little in any case as the mutations out strip them and the most deadly mutations are yet to come - and come they will.

They've been working on this for almost 20 years.

originally posted by: ARM1968
Isn’t it amazing that all these Big Pharma companies could conduct so many thorough tests on an unproven vaccine ‘technology’ in so short a time and be so confident that all is well and everything is safe. I am in awe. Makes you wonder why it takes so long and so many studies for, err, ‘normal’ vaccines.

Because they have been working on mRNA vaccines since the '70's (that is more than 40 years ago) and trying to develop vaccines against related viruses (like SARS and MERS) since 2012.

Sometimes you get new technologies out of science.

Indeed you have to wonder why Moderna said quite openly that they were effectively installing an operating system in the recipients of their vaccine. Odd you would say that for something lasting mere hours in each patient.

You took that literally! LOL

(Hint, our bodies aren't actually like computers. For instance, it you shut them down for the night. Then they don't just start-up again in the morning).

Time will tell, but these vaccines will achieve very little in any case as the mutations out strip them and the most deadly mutations are yet to come - and come they will.

Deaths from COVID-19 are down to about 300 per day. At the height of the pandeminc in the US, deaths peaked at 4,475 in one day. The massive reduction in numbers of deats is being directly attributed to 320,283,509 doses of vaccine being administered there.

The pandemic is almost over and specifically the vaccine has been the most effective tool against it in the US.

originally posted by: rickymouse
Interesting article, not really on topic, but it is good

medicalxpress.com...

I have a theory that some time ago (perhaps 1,000 of years ago?) the bat virus RaTG13, or an ancestor, crossed the species barrier into domestic cats who predate quite highly on bats.

Cats prey on bats around the world - The Wildlife Society

In the cats, the exposures to the bat virus were frequent and once the virus had started to infect the cats, it mutated and evolved to have a greater affinity to bind to cat ACE2.

Due to the similarities between human and cat ACE2, and the frequency of proximal contact between humans and domestic cats, there was a further zoonotic transfer to humans.

At first, the virus in humans wasn't very infectious, but over time, there were further mutations and the more infectious ones, adapted to human ACE2, evolved and established themselves among the human population.

I would assume that the human virus was at that time relatively benign, presenting only with mild cold symptoms, but that the virus began to adapt more and more to human ACE2 because that was its primary avenue of infection.

Some time about 2018, the virus mutated further and gained pathogenic traits, but at this stage, was seen as a bad cold or pneumonia of unknown cause.

In early 2019, this virus was transmitted to several places in China and Europe, where the conditions were just right for 'blooms' of cases.

At that stage, it was killing people who were misdiagnosed as being death from other causes.

These cases, although unidentified elsewhere, were detected late in 2019, in Wuhan China, which also had the largest outbreak (and densest population).

And the rest is history.

Anyway, that's my suspicion.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: KansasGirl

Them why are there so many “breakthrough” cases? Many people who have gotten the vaccine have then subsequently tested positive for covid-19; a good many of them have even died.

So what gives?

How much is "many" when 400 million shots have been given?

How many breakthrough cases of polio are there? Whatever that number is, compared to how many shots given, let’s compare that to the “covid-19 vaccines.”

a reply to: chr0naut

Your theory is debunked. Fauci and his financiers have already admitted that they were “researching” combining bat viruses with other things for bio weapons, and it “escaped” the Wuhan lab,

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: IAMTAT
a reply to: Salander

You mean the spike proteins that were SUPPOSED to stay in the deltoid muscle...and NOT circulate throughout the body and interact with major internal organs?

mRNA vaccines do not contain the spike protein.

They contain the mRNA that creates the protein inside the cell. On the outside of the cell, there is no spike protein released because the rest of the virus that allows for the creation of new whole virus, and of its release from the cell, is absent.

The only way the mRNA in the vaccine gets into the cell is by the damage to the cells caused by the needle penetration. So, its effect is extremely local.

No, that’s not true. It causes your body to make the spike protein.

See the autopsy/study of the German man who died of covid-19 after getting “fully vaccinated.”. The spike proteins were in every organ of his body. Billions of them.

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: chr0naut

originally posted by: IAMTAT
a reply to: Salander

You mean the spike proteins that were SUPPOSED to stay in the deltoid muscle...and NOT circulate throughout the body and interact with major internal organs?

mRNA vaccines do not contain the spike protein.

They contain the mRNA that creates the protein inside the cell. On the outside of the cell, there is no spike protein released because the rest of the virus that allows for the creation of new whole virus, and of its release from the cell, is absent.

The only way the mRNA in the vaccine gets into the cell is by the damage to the cells caused by the needle penetration. So, its effect is extremely local.

No, that’s not true. It causes your body to make the spike protein.

See the autopsy/study of the German man who died of covid-19 after getting “fully vaccinated.”. The spike proteins were in every organ of his body. Billions of them.

The vaccine causes the cell where it is injected to make the spike protein. The cells contain ribosomes inside them, and that is where RNA gets translated into amino acids. As the amino acids are produced, they chain together and fold into particular different chemical shapes that we call proteins. In this case, the spike protein.

Proteins – what they are and how they’re made - Science Learning Lab

The spike protein alone, made in this manner, cannot exit the cell where it is produced, because it would bind to the ACE2 on the cell wall on the way out, and get stuck there, and so it floats around inside the cell's cytoplasm until it breaks down chemically, or because it is identified by the immune system and destroyed by the 'killer' immune system 'T' cells. Which nature has provided to help us destroy 'foreign' pathogens.

Also, the spike protein alone has none of the mechanisms of the virus, that cause it to be encapsulated and ejected from the cell.

The injection itself, which does get out into the lymph and bloodstream, cannot penetrate any of other cells because it does not contain the penetrative mechanism of the spike protein, it only contains the mRNA fragments encapsulated in lipid nanospheres, in a sterile solution.

The virus, however, is also covered in the spike protein, and does have the means to proliferate through the body and enter and exit cells.

Therefore, a measurement of the spike protein being throughout someone's body indicates that they have been infected by the virus. It is the primary indicator of the virus, which can be spreading through the body's cells without any other symptoms showing.

Because the virus is a novel virus, it can get to population numbers within the body that start to do damage, before the immune system is even triggered to respond.

The vaccine is intended to prime the immune system against the virus, but it does take time and also isn't 100% effective in everyone.

This unfortunate German man may have simply been one of those for whom the vaccine didn't work in time. Or perhaps there was another error such as the vaccine being out of the fridge for too long before administration, and so it was entirely ineffective through chemical degradation of the mRNA? There are a number of unknowns in this case.

What is evident is that the daily death rate in the US has dropped from more than 4,000 per day to about 300 per day. And the main difference in dealing with the virus is that many Americans are now vaccinated, so many so, that herd immunity is in sight.

originally posted by: KansasGirl
a reply to: chr0naut

Your theory is debunked. Fauci and his financiers have already admitted that they were “researching” combining bat viruses with other things for bio weapons, and it “escaped” the Wuhan lab,

Please post supportive links to that admission. I have not seen any such admission, and I suspect that such an admission would be all over the news.

Also, as an aside, who were Fauci's financiers (hint, for the previous four years he has worked for the Trump administration)?

originally posted by: KansasGirl
How many breakthrough cases of polio are there? Whatever that number is, compared to how many shots given, let’s compare that to the “covid-19 vaccines.”

I really do not know what you are asking here. They used 1.8 million people in the testing phases for polio and 40 million vaccines were given with 50 or so people dying.

In the past they didn't analyzed ever person given a vaccine either so the oversite with the COVID vaccine is at a crazy level never done before.

originally posted by: KansasGirl

No, that’s not true. It causes your body to make the spike protein.

See the autopsy/study of the German man who died of covid-19 after getting “fully vaccinated.”. The spike proteins were in every organ of his body. Billions of them.

Well that really can't happen, do you have a link to an official site saying billions were made?

originally posted by: chr0naut

These cases, although unidentified elsewhere, were detected late in 2019, in Wuhan China, which also had the largest outbreak (and densest population).

And the rest is history.

Anyway, that's my suspicion.

Out of 200 cats tested in Wuhan 15 had COVID anti bodies, and pretty much directly linked to getting COVID from their master, so it would be hard to suggest this didn't escape the lab, or at least the lab was playing around with it. The fact that the DNA signatures are not seen in the wild kind of suggests the same.

a reply to: chr0naut
Into what chemicals does it split and how does our body handle each one?

The theory is clear, I asked for some scientific aproach, the crude picture about what happens isn't what I was asking for.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: chr0naut

These cases, although unidentified elsewhere, were detected late in 2019, in Wuhan China, which also had the largest outbreak (and densest population).

And the rest is history.

Anyway, that's my suspicion.

Out of 200 cats tested in Wuhan 15 had COVID anti bodies, and pretty much directly linked to getting COVID from their master, so it would be hard to suggest this didn't escape the lab, or at least the lab was playing around with it. The fact that the DNA signatures are not seen in the wild kind of suggests the same.

I wasn't suggesting that the virus crossed from cats recently. I was suggesting it did so at least decades ago.

The SARS-CoV-2 virus does not bind as well to cat ACE2 as it does to human ACE2. The virus in cats binds better than it does in bats, but the virus is fully human adapted. Indicating that it has been incubating and mutating in humans for, at least, decades.

The virus arose in humans, I say this because it is adapted to human hosts more than to any other species. You don't need some magic zoonoses or lab work to explain it. Its ancestor was unnoticed in humans until it acquired mutations which made it pathogenic.

In nature, you don't require other species to explain how a virus mutates. It mutates in the host that carries it.

In the space of a year, we have already seen several new strains of SARS-CoV-2 occur. All of them were in human populations. For instance, In Iceland, among a population of about 150 infected people (at the time), about 40 different minor variants were noted in less than a month.

This is precisely how a new virus occurs.

Versions that don't infect well, or don't replicate well, simply disappear over time. But the variants that do thrive and survive, spread.

Why is this so hard to believe?

originally posted by: ThatDamnDuckAgain
a reply to: chr0naut
Into what chemicals does it split and how does our body handle each one?

The theory is clear, I asked for some scientific approach, the crude picture about what happens isn't what I was asking for.

The lipids of the coating nanoparticles are processed down to fatty acids or are simply oxidized and excreted through the intestines, appearing in the fecal matter as noted in the Pfizer paper. Some of the fats may end up stored as an energy source. This explains why in the Pfizer paper they were found to accumulate in the ovaries, liver and spleen.

mRNA beaks down, usually by oxidization, very rapidly. It consists of four bases as does DNA, but DNA is more strongly linked and is protected within the nucleus of a cell. It is also replicated prior to cell division and the replication process has several mechanisms that ensure fidelity of the copies. DNA is also strongly bound up in a complex and dense winding pattern that we call the chromosomes, which gives it mechanical stability and makes it less likely that something can get in and mess with it.

RNA, however, is specifically moved constantly out of the nucleus of the cell (like on an electrochemical conveyor belt) from where it is transcripted, and cannot normally re-enter the nucleus unless it is accompanied by reverse transcriptase, such as in the case of a retrovirus (which SARS-CoV-2 is not). Once in the cytoplasm of the cell, RNA is moved towards the ribosomes which translate the RNA into amino acids, which, when chained together according to the sequence of the RNA, are called proteins - the 'building blocks' of the cell. The translation process usually destroys the RNA, pulling it apart as waste as it is chemically 'read'. Alternately, RNA that does not reach a ribosome in time, is destroyed by oxidation, which breaks apart the bases into mainly oxides, and they are removed from the cell by its internal scavenging and waste handling. It is then passed outside the cell into the blood, or to a lesser extent, lymphatic fluid, to be processed as waste and excreted via the kidneys or bowel. In the case of some wastes, specifically located in particular organs, they are excreted by the ejection of mucosa, sweat, or tears.

The spike protein is dealt with like all other proteins. If it is tolerated by the immune system, it becomes part of the structure of the cell in which it is created. If it is targeted by the immune system, firstly, antibodies bind to all chemical sites which potentially could stick chemically to the cell's constituent parts, and it is ejected from the cell, and then 'killer' T cells recognize the foreign protein at the surface of the cell, or in serum, now coated in antibodies, and envelope it, and strip its chemistry apart, rendering it down to inert chemicals to be removed as waste.

Every time I delve into the incredible organization and complexity of the cell, I am reminded why none of this is likely to have just happened by random chance. I see the hand of God in His creation. But that's just me getting all preachy.