Virginia Dept. of Ed. Possibly Eliminating Advanced Math Until 11th Grade

a reply to: ketsuko

We have bad universities making bad teachers making bad students.

Our nation probably spends more per capita for students and education than any other developed nation on the planet.

It's a systemic illness that has invaded all levels of education.

If we cannot teach the teachers, how in the hell can we ever have institutions teaching our children.

a reply to: dandandat2

Ask a cancer patient whose life was just saved by a singular act of brilliance advanced by one of those who was not held back if it was worth it or not.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: dandandat2

Ask a cancer patient whose life was just saved by a singular act of brilliance advanced by one of those who was not held back if it was worth it or not.

That's a simplistic anecdote. No mater what technical level a society is at there will always be people who die due the fact that the last mile of technologically advancement has not yet been crossed. It's a constant in the world no matter what education system you choose.

a reply to: ketsuko

I have seen this logic at work elsewhere...now where was it? Oh yeah, if we ban guns then criminals won’t have guns...

Seriously, having someone watch you manually factor out square roots (cube roots, etc) makes them think you are some sort of wizard because it simply isn’t done anymore. When you teach them how easy it is, there is an awakening within them of why don’t they teach people how to do this?

a reply to: DBCowboy

Ever compared a hand carved table leg to a mass produced flat pack piece of furniture at Walmart? Kinda the same thing going on here.

originally posted by: dandandat2

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: dandandat2

That's not what I am saying. I am saying that those who can learn faster should have the right to do so and the opportunity. They will absorb more and quicker and go on to do the bigger things. That doesn't mean the rest don't do at all. It does mean the rest do what they can as they can.

But ask yourself ... If you understand a thing right away, how patient are you with having to go over it multiple times as if you don't get it? And that happens constantly.

Not only that, but how do you think you get the best and brightest scientists in a society? Do you hold them back to relearning the basics or do you let them fly past the basics and into the advanced curriculum as soon as they're ready so they can go on to bigger and better things?

Why are you stuck on the idea that someone as brilliant as Leonardo da Vinci ought to be learning basic math until 11th grade because it will make other kids feel badly to know they aren't learning at his pace?

How much better would society be if Leonardo da Vinci was able to use his brilliance to help rise all people rather than produce singular acts of brilliance?

Sure technology and sciencetific advancement might be slower; but what rule is there that technology and sciencetific advancement must occur at the quickest pace possible? And if society as a whole benefits from a more intelligent work force all around, and not just pockets of brilliance, would it than be worth the wait?

It'd be pretty pissy, actually. That completely devalues and nullifies the concept of individuality, and personal growth. both of which are not someone else's responsibility to foster in you, it's YOUR job to discover what you like, and find like minds from there as tutors.

It is not, however, normal to take on the teacher mantle oneself, and expect everyone else to do the same, as if they are all robots with no individuality to them.
Like if you get screwed over and are inappropriately schooled with the slow kids when all you needed was a different approach (different teaching methods, maybe different school type entirely, ie. Montessori, etc) And then grow up with a screwed up hero complex for it.

Your start in life wasn't a good one psychologically there.

a reply to: dandandat2

Simplistic or not, many of our greatest achievements are there because we have the idea of a meritocracy. What you want is 180 degrees against it.

The best go on to be the best at what they're best at, and because they can do that, society is improved for everyone in various ways. Every single thing sitting on your desk now owes its existence to a flash of brilliance had be someone who was allowed to excel, not held back to others and forced to try to make them what they may not be.

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: dandandat2

Simplistic or not, many of our greatest achievements are there because we have the idea of a meritocracy. What you want is 180 degrees against it.

The best go on to be the best at what they're best at, and because they can do that, society is improved for everyone in various ways. Every single thing sitting on your desk now owes its existence to a flash of brilliance had be someone who was allowed to excel, not held back to others and forced to try to make them what they may not be.

Yes many of our greatest achievements are there because we have the idea of a meritocracy. Buy so are many of our worst failures. People living in poverty for example because society left them behind as we strive to achieve our vision of meritocracy.

As we see on the news every night these days there is a material cost in ignoring the needs of the less fortunate. A cost that will be paid one way or another by those on the winning side of meritocracy. Unless of course they plan to build big walled enclaves for themselves and keep everyone else out.... you know the kind thing everyone on this message board complains about everyday.

originally posted by: Ahabstar
a reply to: DBCowboy

Ever compared a hand carved table leg to a mass produced flat pack piece of furniture at Walmart? Kinda the same thing going on here.

I don't like to actually brag, but our son (now 18) is in college, a full "Oregon" free ride for two years. The funny thing is, he's packing as much as he can in one year because he's been accepted to an intership program for a major corporation that is starving for STEM kids.

He'll actually be working, 40hrs/wk making 60K/yr just for learning. Once he's done and has completed everything, a full-ride for further education WHILE working at a median of 88K/yr.

No student loans. No debt.

And he'll be in his early 20's making serious bank working serious work that no one else can do!

a reply to: dandandat2

So in your world, those people exist merely to carry everyone else? Do for them?

They already do. More than you know or are willing to admit.

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: Ahabstar
a reply to: DBCowboy

Ever compared a hand carved table leg to a mass produced flat pack piece of furniture at Walmart? Kinda the same thing going on here.

I don't like to actually brag, but our son (now 18) is in college, a full "Oregon" free ride for two years. The funny thing is, he's packing as much as he can in one year because he's been accepted to an intership program for a major corporation that is starving for STEM kids.

He'll actually be working, 40hrs/wk making 60K/yr just for learning. Once he's done and has completed everything, a full-ride for further education WHILE working at a median of 88K/yr.

No student loans. No debt.

And he'll be in his early 20's making serious bank working serious work that no one else can do!

The absence of debt is key. Not only is he ahead of the curve financially, but if he wanted to go back to school to take up some other study/discipline, or get an advanced degree, he will have flexibility without the burden of existing student loans.

lol

how they going to learn 2 code?

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: dandandat2

So in your world, those people exist merely to carry everyone else? Do for them?

They already do. More than you know or are willing to admit.

No, I said those more fortunate, wealth or intellectual, will have to pay for the less fortunate one way or another. They won't exist merely to carry everyone else. They will have no choice but to carry everyone else in order to exist ... that or get ride of them.

I am not sure how much you know of how much I know of so I can't disagree nor agree with the last part.

What is “advanced calculus”? 🤓

a reply to: xuenchen

I hope it isnt any thing like their addition or subtraction

Anyone who claims 2+2 doesnt always and irrevocably equal 4 is a deluded liar

2+-2 = ?????
0!!!!!

Ok, great, but that doesnt mean you should hold back people who can achieve higher

It is the dumbest thing i've heard

Just because one bum cant do basic trig/calculus/alg doesnt mean the entire class should be held back

Kick the low achiever out of the advanced classes so they arent weighing anyone else down