Remdesivir ain't gonna work unfortunately

Looks like another touted cure for COVID-19 did not live up to all the hype and excitement . Full Title : The Remdesivir Study Is Finally Out: Drug Only Helped Those On Oxygen, Finds Mortality Too High For Standalone Treatment unfortunately

Remember when the market soared on several days in April on the Facui-touted Remdesivir study which, according to StatNews and various other unofficial sources of rumors, was a smashing success only for the optimism to fizzle as many questions emerged, and as the Gilead drug quietly faded from the public's consciousness and was replaced by various coronavirus vaccine candidates such as those made by the greatly hyped Moderna (whose insiders just can't stop selling company stock).

Meanwhile, those who were waiting for the official version of Remdesivir's effectiveness had to do so until 6pm on a Friday before a long holiday, and for good reason...

A visual representation of the outcomes is below; it shows that whereas there was a modest benefit only to patients who were receiving oxygen, the results were statistically insignificant vs placebo for patients not receiving oxygen, while in a surprising twist patients on high-flow oxygen or mechanical ventilator/ECMO did modestly better in the placebo group than those taking remdesivir. Also, the overall results showed a very modest, but not statistically significant improvement in the remdesivir group vs placebo (box A).

www.zerohedge.com...

a reply to: 727Sky

So far, it looks like only Hydroxychloroquine-based treatments continue to show promise.

Remdesivir costs $4,460 per course of treatment; hydroxychloroquine costs $13.00 for a months supply. Big pharma won't find or advocate any drug to treat covid that doesn't substantially increase their wealth.

Wow....4,460.00 a pop?....compared to 13.00 a pop?...……..that's sure one Hades of a Gap.....all these things do is kill bugs.

If the Remdesivir fails to work there are always more natural alternatives the Pharmacutical companies use.Lots of Pharmacuticals are made from Natural Plants….research what Wormwood has that these people use and also what green Black Walnut tinctures have that these big companies use.

I went to my local liquor store and bought a 26 oz bottle of Italian Nocino that is made from green Black Walnuts and is a multi-spectrum Anti-Parasitic/Bacterial agent.....then I picked up a bottle of Wormwood bitters while I was there....which happens to also be a top notch Multi-spectrum Anti-Parasitic/Bacterial agent and adds a nice flavor to my Covid Coffee I have daily....you see I take a hot cup of Coffee then add a1/2 ounce of Nocino then I add 3-4 drops of Wormwood Bitters which are made with Sweet Annie...then I add a 1/4 tsp honey and then I top it off with a spoonful of real whip cream....sometimes I have a Covid-Coffee every day and sometimes I skip a day and have one every couple of days.

40 bucks for the Nocino...20 bucks for the Wormwood Bitters....the rest are incidentals…..cost about 1.53 a per Covid-Coffee.

Oh yes...and 2.00 for the box of Kleenex I will need for the sniffles the powerless Covid-19 might give me if I pick it up.

originally posted by: nugget1
Remdesivir costs $4,460 per course of treatment; hydroxychloroquine costs $13.00 for a months supply. Big pharma won't find or advocate any drug to treat covid that doesn't substantially increase their wealth.

Is doesn’t cost that, that’s what they charge.

a reply to: Forensick

Actually the figure I sourced on another thread said it was $260 per course. That’s still too much especially when you multiply it by 50 million .

Verses $37 for 100 Hydroxychloroquine

It’s all about the money

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: 727Sky

So far, it looks like only Hydroxychloroquine-based treatments continue to show promise.

And perhaps the Madagascan herbal remedy, which their president says the WHO tried to bribe him $20m to contaminate:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

NO at Hydroxycholorquine, and you can't get a better study:

The Lancet, full article, full peer-reviewed

14 888 patients were in the treatment groups (1868 received chloroquine, 3783 received chloroquine with a macrolide, 3016 received hydroxychloroquine, and 6221 received hydroxychloroquine with a macrolide) and 81 144 patients were in the control group.

We were unable to confirm a benefit of hydroxychloroquine or chloroquine, when used alone or with a macrolide, on in-hospital outcomes for COVID-19. Each of these drug regimens was associated with decreased in-hospital survival and an increased frequency of ventricular arrhythmias when used for treatment of COVID-19.

Now shut the f! up about HCQ as a wonderdrug and let us rheumatics take this really needed drug! I can't believe that I have to PREORDER and HAVE TO HOPE that it will be delievered, because some idiot told other idiots what to do!

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
NO at Hydroxycholorquine, and you can't get a better study:

Actually you CAN get better studies! This wasn't a double blink study with placebos.

This was very much like the VA study - it was a look back study of hospitalized patients. You don't know if the very sick patients may have received this drug as a hail Mary type try.

The benefit of this drug maybe that it prevents serious complications but doesn't cure serious complications.

It's like giving someone dying of the flu a flu vaccine. I bet if you did that, you would conclude that vaccines aren't beneficial for the flu.

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: 727Sky

So far, it looks like only Hydroxychloroquine-based treatments continue to show promise.

Not according to a new study on the drug that's just been published in the medical journal The Lancet.

96 032 patients (mean age 53·8 years, 46·3% women) with COVID-19 were hospitalised during the study period and met the inclusion criteria. Of these, 14 888 patients were in the treatment groups (1868 received chloroquine, 3783 received chloroquine with a macrolide, 3016 received hydroxychloroquine, and 6221 received hydroxychloroquine with a macrolide) and 81 144 patients were in the control group. 10 698 (11·1%) patients died in hospital.

After controlling for multiple confounding factors (age, sex, race or ethnicity, body-mass index, underlying cardiovascular disease and its risk factors, diabetes, underlying lung disease, smoking, immunosuppressed condition, and baseline disease severity), when compared with mortality in the control group (9·3%), hydroxychloroquine (18·0%; hazard ratio 1·335, 95% CI 1·223–1·457), hydroxychloroquine with a macrolide (23·8%; 1·447, 1·368–1·531), chloroquine (16·4%; 1·365, 1·218–1·531), and chloroquine with a macrolide (22·2%; 1·368, 1·273–1·469) were each independently associated with an increased risk of in-hospital mortality. Compared with the control group (0·3%), hydroxychloroquine (6·1%; 2·369, 1·935–2·900), hydroxychloroquine with a macrolide (8·1%; 5·106, 4·106–5·983), chloroquine (4·3%; 3·561, 2·760–4·596), and chloroquine with a macrolide (6·5%; 4·011, 3·344–4·812) were independently associated with an increased risk of de-novo ventricular arrhythmia during hospitalisation.

Interpretation
We were unable to confirm a benefit of hydroxychloroquine or chloroquine, when used alone or with a macrolide, on in-hospital outcomes for COVID-19. Each of these drug regimens was associated with decreased in-hospital survival and an increased frequency of ventricular arrhythmias when used for treatment of COVID-19.
www.thelancet.com...(20)31180-6/fulltext

If Trump is taking the drug , and it is a big IF , then perhaps he should stop rather than risk giving himself heart problems.

@ManFromEurope

originally posted by: Daughter2

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
NO at Hydroxycholorquine, and you can't get a better study:

Actually you CAN get better studies! This wasn't a double blink study with placebos.

This was very much like the VA study - it was a look back study of hospitalized patients. You don't know if the very sick patients may have received this drug as a hail Mary type try.

The benefit of this drug maybe that it prevents serious complications but doesn't cure serious complications.

It's like giving someone dying of the flu a flu vaccine. I bet if you did that, you would conclude that vaccines aren't beneficial for the flu.

I would really like to know there the idea of "it might prevent complications" is coming from! - HCQ does LOWER the immun reaction of the body, which is why people with rheuma are using it to prevent flaring. How this should have the reverse reaction with COVID, I cannot understand.

Right now one of the major theories about the unusual high mortality rate is blood clogging. In Germany, many hospitals are STARTING the therapy even in light-middle cases with thromobis prophylaxis.

originally posted by: ManFromEurope

originally posted by: Daughter2

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
NO at Hydroxycholorquine, and you can't get a better study:

Actually you CAN get better studies! This wasn't a double blink study with placebos.

This was very much like the VA study - it was a look back study of hospitalized patients. You don't know if the very sick patients may have received this drug as a hail Mary type try.

The benefit of this drug maybe that it prevents serious complications but doesn't cure serious complications.

It's like giving someone dying of the flu a flu vaccine. I bet if you did that, you would conclude that vaccines aren't beneficial for the flu.

I would really like to know there the idea of "it might prevent complications" is coming from! - HCQ does LOWER the immun reaction of the body, which is why people with rheuma are using it to prevent flaring. How this should have the reverse reaction with COVID, I cannot understand.

Right now one of the major theories about the unusual high mortality rate is blood clogging. In Germany, many hospitals are STARTING the therapy even in light-middle cases with thromobis prophylaxis.

There's a popular video about this - the doctor said it works because it allows zinc to enter the cells and stop the virus from replicating. That's why it has to be taken with zinc and much like Tamaflu it has to be started early.

People really need to be careful about prevention as a opposed to cures. Something could be very useful to prevent or inhibit replication but not useful as a cure once the illness takes hold. A study showing something is not a cure doesn't prove it's not useful as drug to prevent the illness.

There's studies out there showing it is useful to prevent COVID.

Always makes me scratch my head, we have all read reports from around the globe saying if administered early enough Hydro does give benefits... then you come to US hospitals and people swear its just gonna kill people, the media repeatedly says its going to kill people.

Someone is lying all those doctors from around the globe, or the media and doctors in the US.

originally posted by: McGinty

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: 727Sky

So far, it looks like only Hydroxychloroquine-based treatments continue to show promise.

And perhaps the Madagascan herbal remedy, which their president says the WHO tried to bribe him $20m to contaminate:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Its been a fraud pulled on Humanity for Thousands of years.

Herbal Remedys like the Madagascar one abound all over this Planet if you know their secrets....and big Pharma has used those now olde secrets to action many Generations of subjugation....the Worm has now turned.Or….lol...shall we say the Wormwood has finally turned.....lol.
Go to the local liquor store and buy some Sweet Annie/Wormwood Bitters-----then a bottle of Nocino which is a green Black Walnut Tincture---stop by the store on the way home and pick up some fresh ground cloves and some Whipping cream or Coconut Oil /shredded Coconut will do fine as well,finally add some Honey to your list .

Find some legitimate directions then go for a nice Hike and harvest some Sweet Annie from Nature...its free....and make your own Wormwood remedy.....if you are lucky in your geographical area you can also stop by and gather yourself some green Black Walnuts or just look for them in a Farmers Market and then make your own Remedy.

Make a cup of Coffee....add a little Wormwood to warm up the bloodstream add a little green Black Walnut to warm up the belly add a little liposomal carrier in the Whip Cream/Coconut to slip past the bugs Lipid Fat Force-Field and add a little Honey based sweetness for bait to bring it to the heat ....fresh ground cloves are optional,and you have yourself a Covid-Coffee ...something all Front Line workers could be having immediatly after their shifts.

a reply to: 727Sky

It seems most of these "studies" are aiming to find a single, standalone treatment. Unsurprisingly, they are finding they dont work in that context.

Its like they are setting out to prove or disprove a "miracle drug." Almost like they are trying to setup a narrative..

If Remdesivir is an effective ssRNA viral inhibitor, we should see evidence of stalled viral replication. We havent really been seeing that with it. Most chalk that up to The Virus, but it might indicate that its simply an ineffective drug in its purpose.

Further, if it doesnt have ionophore activity or the immunosuppressive properties of a drug like HCQ, patients obviously wont benefit from those effects either.

The fact this drug help people who are very sick, actually does make it useful.

We are all trapped in our houses because the hospitals were supposed to be overwhelmed

Slow the spread - not stop the spread

So if this drug reduces hospital time by 30% then it's actually a big help - it's almost as good as reducing the number of people who get the illness by 30%.

originally posted by: Serdgiam
a reply to: 727Sky

It seems most of these "studies" are aiming to find a single, standalone treatment. Unsurprisingly, they are finding they dont work in that context.

Its like they are setting out to prove or disprove a "miracle drug." Almost like they are trying to setup a narrative..

If Remdesivir is an effective ssRNA viral inhibitor, we should see evidence of stalled viral replication. We havent really been seeing that with it. Most chalk that up to The Virus, but it might indicate that its simply an ineffective drug in its purpose.

Further, if it doesnt have ionophore activity or the immunosuppressive properties of a drug like HCQ, patients obviously wont benefit from those effects either.

No its simple....this is a Pleomorphic Bacteria that is a Chameleon and can change clothes and blend in anywhere.....in the belly as a normal looking bacteria in the blood as a living bacteria of viral size and in the entire body as a living bacteria charading as a fungal entity.It can be in any or all 3 areas simultaneously in 3 different forms with 3 different constellations of lifecycle markers with the only identifying factor in common being the GENETIC CODE OF THE PLEOMORPHIC BACTERIA.

Each area of the body that is infected needs to be considered on its own before it is considered from a full spectrum perspective .

Testing must be done simultaneously in all areas that can be infected by this single bug...and to be frank there are actually 4 not 3....the 4Bees the Belly-Blood-Body-Brain.....but why complicate things right now right?

An extremely high number of the general global population carries this bug INSITU in their belly in its most basic traditional bacterial presentation to some varying degree at one time or another in their lives depending on different factors.Those with virulent populations already Insitu will be providing the Gunpowder to the covids spark...…..those with a low or non-existant Insitu Pleomorphic Bacterial load will have empty barrels and no Gunpowder to blow themselves up with....covid will only be a short-lived spark to them in the form of a cold or an off-day.

Time to go my Covid-Coffee is ready to go....G'Day to all !!

It was previously stated the hydroxychloroquine was only beneficial to those with early symptoms, not for those severe cases who were already in hospital. Can't remember where that study was done or who by now...there's been so much news changing daily its hard to keep up

But if there's one thing that's come out of all this, its that "modelling" is a waste of time and is speculation and assumption

Some of these studies are designed to fail. It's been known since february/march that the treatment must be done in the beginning of the onset of symptoms (or as prophylactic). It's also known that HCQ is zinc ionophore, so zinc can interrupt RNA replication and transcription when present within a cell but it very hard for it to get into and between cells without an ionophore to facilitate the transfer, which in this case is the forementioned HCQ (also quinine).

So, most of the studies that don't show promise uses, for instance, imbalanced groups (not randomized), the most ill, more like do die patients to take HCQ, a single drug or 2, and most importantly they always leave the zinc out of the equation. They also don't specificate dose and frequency used in the study group. Not to mention flawed research methodology.

Let's take this study as example:www.medrxiv.org... #disqus_thread

The subjects assigned to the HCQ and HCQ+AZ treatment groups had the most severe disease and were predictably more likely to die. The authors even admit that subjects treated with "....hydroxychloroquine, with or without azithromycin, was more likely to be prescribed to patients with more severe disease." This represents subject selection bias and introduces a serious confounding effect that essentially renders the study meaningless.

Conveniently, the authors also ignored the fact that despite all the selection bias and over weighted disease burden in the treatment groups, the NO TREATMENT group was TWO TIMES more likely to require mechanical VENTILATION (compared to those that received HCQ + AZ). The risk of ventilation was 6.9% in HQ+AZ group and 14.1% in the no-treatment group.

The research methodology was "retrospective cohort analysis". Basically, the researchers selected cases from data found in the VA medical record system.

Last but not least, some authors have conflict of interest likely to bias their work. Jayakrishna Ambati, is listed as the inventor on a University of Virginia patent application “relating to COVID-19.” One of the study’s co-authors, S. Scott Sutton, has taken research grant money from Gilead Sciences, which is currently developing a Coronavirus drug that is likely to be much more expensive than Hydroxychloroquine (remdesivir).

Here in Brazil the protocol has been used for a couple of months already in the private hospitals, and now it's been used in public as well. Some mayors (even those opposing the president) are coming forward to show they're emptying ICUs using the protocol with patients in the early stage of the disease.

We can never ever underestimate the power of Big Pharma. They transformed a very safe drug into poison overnight.

a reply to: PhyllidaDavenport

The antiviral aspects and ionophore activity will definitely have their biggest impact if given early on. This will stand true for pretty much any antiviral in any application, due to their nature.

Whether the ionophore activity, specifically, has benefits in later progressions is still up in the air a bit.

However, a medication like HCQ also has immunosuppresant/modulating effects which can be extremely helpful in many presentations. I suspect there are other factors that come into play when cytokines start running rampant, but HCQ could help control it regardless. There are other medications that would likely be more effective in this role, but many dont have the benefits that come from the early treatment of HCQ either.