Why Are 96,000,000 Black Balls on This Reservoir?

thought this was going on for a couple of years and had partially been debunked as not being as effective as planned. hyper bacteria growth for example and its not slowing evaporation as much as they thought either

Daily mail from 2015

Which is one reason you got to be careful because no doubt they hade a scientist saying this would be fine


Governing

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: Zanti Misfit

The state of California executed thousands of fish and frogs when killing off the sunlight. California isn't into caring about nature, like it used to be.

What is Terribly Wrong with that Picture Dude > ?

originally posted by: putnam6
thought this was going on for a couple of years and had partially been debunked as not being as effective as planned

No surprise there! Seeing as how thier reserch into whether the shade balls were going to be effective was to fill ONE KIDDIE POOL with reservoir water and cover it with the balls. It worked, so they went ahead with the plan! Because of course that's some real thorough research there, filing a kiddie pool.

a reply to: KansasGirl
It was three kiddie pools!
But the other two had other alternatives besides the "shade balls", so yeah one kiddie pool with "shade balls" didn't sound like the most thorough research ever. In some ways I look at the reservoir now as a giant experiment for drinking water since I don't know of the shade balls being used in drinking water reservoirs before. But they were used around airports and other locations to reduce bird populations, which by the way I'm surprised nobody commented here yet about the bird getting shredded in the jet engine in the video, since there seem to be a lot of youtube comments about that. So the balls have been used before, but for a different purpose, such as to keep bird populations down around airports.

a reply to: KansasGirl

What is Terribly Wrong with that Picture Dude > ?

a reply to: Arbitrageur

What is Terribly Wrong with that Picture Dude > ?

Lots, but I'm not sure what you're getting at, dude, because you replies the same thing to someone else with a different comment. Care to be a little more specific and clear, dude?

Legalized cannabis made this happen.

"Dude... you know what we need??? 96 MILLION balls..."

"...this could so, totally work..."

California...

originally posted by: Arnie123

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: Arbitrageur

The chlorinated water could cause the balls to decay and leech deadly chemicals into the reservoir.

Perhaps, maybe if they were chinese made with chinese material...

Since they picked one reservoir, I guess the state is attempting to lower cancer chances in one geographic area. Maybe that area is where the Governor's family lives? All other parts of the state.....tough luck.

originally posted by: madmac5150
There isn't a single comment that I want to make, that won't violate T&Cs.

I feel powerless, in the face of restraint...

Triggered, even...

Oo

originally posted by: Arbitrageur
There were some unintended, but apparently beneficial side effects. One is that the balls prevent birds from accessing the water so there's less bird poop in the water with less birds hanging around.

For such a large body of water with normal treatment, bird crap is not a problem. This benefit is overplayed. The disbenefit is that this approach makes the reservoir a wildlife dead zone. Not the most environmentally sensitive solutions.

96,000,000 plastic balls on a lake in California, where according to them everything causes cancer. They say plastic causes cancer. How long until the utility doing this is sued because somebody blames them for causing cancer?


Plastic balls good.........................plastic straws bad. Yeah right!

originally posted by: paraphi

originally posted by: Arbitrageur
There were some unintended, but apparently beneficial side effects. One is that the balls prevent birds from accessing the water so there's less bird poop in the water with less birds hanging around.

For such a large body of water with normal treatment, bird crap is not a problem. This benefit is overplayed. The disbenefit is that this approach makes the reservoir a wildlife dead zone. Not the most environmentally sensitive solutions.

If you are implying that the water gets treated again between the reservoir and the end user, it does get a "UV treatment", which may sterilize some of the micro-organisms deposited in the water via bird poop, but unless you want bird poop in your drinking water it's probably best to keep it out. There's no treatment to remove bird poop from the drinking water in that reservoir before it gets to the end users. From your post you seem to think there is when you refer to "normal treatment" but I have no idea what you think "normal treatment" is.

Anyway there's a federal regulation that drinking water in storage needs to be covered, and numerous states have such regulations. Solid covers are preferred, but apparently the balls form a makeshift cover which does meet some of the regulatory intent.

a reply to: Arbitrageur

Not sure why you would have chlorinated water stored in an open reservoir. Raw water yes, treated water beyond final disinfection no. Chlorine can react with any organic material still in the water after filtration to form THM's (I think. Chemistry isn't my area) which are monitored throughout the network and at treatment works. Well, here in the UK they are.

The black balls are there to prevent evaporation. If they contaminated the water source this is would be picked up during routine monitoring of the treatment process. Assuming the correct monitoring is in place.

originally posted by: Arbitrageur

originally posted by: paraphi

originally posted by: Arbitrageur
There were some unintended, but apparently beneficial side effects. One is that the balls prevent birds from accessing the water so there's less bird poop in the water with less birds hanging around.

For such a large body of water with normal treatment, bird crap is not a problem. This benefit is overplayed. The disbenefit is that this approach makes the reservoir a wildlife dead zone. Not the most environmentally sensitive solutions.

If you are implying that the water gets treated again between the reservoir and the end user, it does get a "UV treatment", which may sterilize some of the micro-organisms deposited in the water via bird poop, but unless you want bird poop in your drinking water it's probably best to keep it out. There's no treatment to remove bird poop from the drinking water in that reservoir before it gets to the end users. From your post you seem to think there is when you refer to "normal treatment" but I have no idea what you think "normal treatment" is.

Raw water from rivers or impounding reservoirs (shown in OP) is first allowed to settle before being filtered through either filter beds made of sand and stone or sometimes in a controlled way through a suspended sludge blanket. Once it has been filtered it is disinfected through one of a number of ways depending on scale. Sodium hypochlorite, chlorine and UV are all used. With UV disinfection you need very clean water with no particulates that reduce it's effectiveness.

originally posted by: Arbitrageur
If you are implying that the water gets treated again between the reservoir and the end user, it does get a "UV treatment", which may sterilize some of the micro-organisms deposited in the water via bird poop, but unless you want bird poop in ...

Not implying. I am saying that reservoir water is treated before it gets into the public water supply. The fact that a passing bird has shat in the reservoir is immaterial. There are a hundred and one other impurities have been added, like airborne dust, surface run-off and so on. Plus the water itself is teeming with microorganisms.

Don't know what happens in the States, but in the UK water is treated between reservoir and tap. Treatment such as flocculation, filtration, carbon absorption are all pretty standard, so as to ensure the water meets the required standards.

Understand that in California few things are NOT carcinogenic. Nearly everything causes rats in laboratory cancer.

originally posted by: RexKramerPRT
a reply to: Arbitrageur

Not sure why you would have chlorinated water stored in an open reservoir. Raw water yes, treated water beyond final disinfection no.

And yet, that's what it is, chlorinated water stored in an open reservoir. It doesn't seem like a particularly good idea, but it happens, apparently because they are legacy facilities established many years ago when regulations were much more lax than those which would apply to any new facilities being built today. Some drinking water storage facilities have very expensive concrete covers, which are no doubt better than shade balls at keeping contaminants out but a lot more expensive.

The black balls are there to prevent evaporation.

No, that is not the primary purpose. As I said in the OP that is a claimed side benefit. This is the official FAQ about the Shade balls stating the primary purpose, and it says "will also prevent the annual loss to evaporation of..." but that is clearly not the primary reason according to that explanation. The primary reason is water quality, pretty much as the video in the OP explained, and to bring the Los Angeles Reservoir into compliance with federal water quality mandates.

s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com...

originally posted by: paraphi

originally posted by: Arbitrageur
If you are implying that the water gets treated again between the reservoir and the end user, it does get a "UV treatment", which may sterilize some of the micro-organisms deposited in the water via bird poop, but unless you want bird poop in ...

Not implying. I am saying that reservoir water is treated before it gets into the public water supply.

In the case of the Los Angeles reservoir, water is treated before it goes into the reservoir, and does not receive treatment again other than just "UV treatment" between the reservoir and the users. If you believe otherwise you are mistaken, though you may be correct in saying the UK has no such open reservoirs with already treated drinking water in them, I don't know about that.

originally posted by: RexKramerPRT
Raw water from rivers or impounding reservoirs (shown in OP) is first allowed to settle before being filtered through either filter beds made of sand and stone or sometimes in a controlled way through a suspended sludge blanket. Once it has been filtered it is disinfected through one of a number of ways depending on scale. Sodium hypochlorite, chlorine and UV are all used. With UV disinfection you need very clean water with no particulates that reduce it's effectiveness.

The water in the Los Angeles Reservoir is not raw, the video says it's already treated by a water treatment plant before entering the reservoir. If there was a water treatment plant between the reservoir and the end users, that treatment plant would have detected the high carcinogen levels, but that didn't happen, the carcinogens were detected by an end user bottling facility, and the water treatment plant had records that the treated water before the reservoir had no such carcinogens levels.

originally posted by: schuyler
Understand that in California few things are NOT carcinogenic. Nearly everything causes rats in laboratory cancer.

Yes. One example I saw was that french fries have a substance called acrylamide in them. In order to get enough acrylamide from french fries to meet the minimum known levels that have been associated with cancer, one needs to eat 72 pounds of french fries a day. I think if someone eats 72 pounds of french fries a day, they will have an obesity related death long before getting cancer from acrylamide, but yet lots of foods like that are supposed to have acrylamide warnings in California.

a reply to: Arbitrageur

The primary reason is water quality, pretty much as the video in the OP explained, and to bring the Los Angeles Reservoir into compliance with federal water quality mandates.

If that is the case then your federal (drinking?) water quality standards are horrific. I'm almost certain that is a raw water reservoir and additional treatment takes place before its sent on its way to consumers taps. He's driving a boat in it.

I had a quick scan of the video and i'm willing to bet these prevent algae and stagnation of the water given the strong sunlight. That's why evaporation is also an issue alleviated.


EDIT: Just watched the video fully. Probably should have before commenting, hey, there you go. If that is how drinking water is stored in LA then I'm genuinely shocked. I'm surprised there aren't regular health issues in the area unless everyone drinks bottled water.

It looks to me that the problem was ultimately the algae which they had used chlorine to control. That chlorine use caused the bromate issue.

Its to stop the water evapouring so quick. thats all