Good = Evil

Does good and evil even exist?

In my opinion, I don't think so.

I believe these are man-made concepts that are relative to one another. An illusion.

Wait, I know what you're thinking... please bear with me as I try to express my thoughts as cogently and coherently as possible without losing you along the way.

Just think about, can one exist absolutely as a separate entity without the other? Would we be able to recognize good without the contrast of evil? Much like darkness is only the absence of light, I believe evil is just the absence of good.

We need to look no further than nature itself to realize there isn't any real concept of good or evil. When a lion pounces a baby gazelle and begins to eat it alive, we may think to ourselves "poor gazelle", but never do we go "man, this lion is evil". Or when Mother Nature herself decides to wipe an entire city in a blink of an eye, we don't even blink twice about it.

We understand it's just nature taking its course.

Maybe these are harsh comparisons, but why do we as humans get to create boundaries and transcend the natural laws of nature?

Please don't mistake this as an excuse to freely kill whoever you wish or an excuse for all the "evil" that exists in the world. This is an honest question.

If there's one thing I know that does rule the universe absolutely, it is the law of balance. Yin and Yang. Up and down. Right and left. Good and (D)evil.

All relative and would cease to exist without each other.

Not really sure the point I'm trying to make, maybe just offering some food for thought, as I believe asking yourself these questions will only open up a myriad of other very important questions. But for the sake of simplicity, let's just scratch the surface.

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

I think the concepts of good and evil apply only to humans, not the rest of nature, mostly because nature is innocent and doesn't know any better.

On the other hand, we do know better and can choose our course of action. This puts us in the position to be able to label things or actions "good" or "evil".

Maybe these are harsh comparisons, but why do we as humans get to create boundaries and transcend the natural laws of nature?

What we do is natural insofar as we are still a part of nature. It's just the kind of creatures we are.

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

Good and evil is a concept that was birthed from religion, and myths. Same as order and chaos, creation and destruction, etc, etc, all mythologies tackle good versus evil. The good is generally for the 'greater good' the most commonly accepted concepts from a society, and the evil is an outside force or influence that comes or slowly diseases the concepts.

A virus to the human body is the evil, the human body is the good.

In nature there is not 'good or evil' as you said, it's a man made concept. It's just evolution at that point, and how it works.

a reply to: TheSteppenwolf

Good point. But that only reaffirms that it is a man-made concept.

Maybe our intelligence does make a difference.

But I think moreso than anything, the question I wanted to ask was, can one exist without the other?

originally posted by: knowledgehunter0986
a reply to: TheSteppenwolf

Good point. But that only reaffirms that it is a man-made concept.

Maybe our intelligence does make a difference.

But I think moreso than anything, the question I wanted to ask was, can one exist without the other?

Of course it's a man made concept. They are descriptive terms, adjectives, used to describe. Humans do the describing. Though I suppose we will never know if a cow or horse describe things in the same way.

I think good and evil are necessarily antagonist to one another, like the concept of life and death, two ends on a single spectrum.

While good and evil can be subjective based on philosophy, I don’t think we would find many philosophies that don’t recognise evil in some form

Take the moral vacuum that was communism, while killing millions was considered acceptable, Western ideology was corrupt to the core as was any type of faith and had to be avoided if not purged

God in the Old Testament passed on a series of laws because of humanities moral ambiguity, it got to the point where the law itself, declared to protect the innocent and victims was used as a force of evil.

We have courtrooms where peers decide our fortunes based on circumstances. It’s not evil on trial it is the reason that the actions were carried out we face judgement.

Evil exists, just subjective to our philosophy


There is no denying evil exists when we write a thread on what evil is, the question is where does the gray become definite.

The question then becomes, do we face judgement for our selfish actions

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

Trying to get ideas in the world, as it seems, apparently my time is up.

There are two basic forces, evil or good? do not know, most likely not important, everything we experience is the friction between them.

I call it the eternal lovers.

They exist in a state of suspension.


The Black triangle, just remembered i had dreams, or nightmares for years before it appeared to me, why would it come so close only to force me look the other way, i do not understand.

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

Let me tell you a story.

80,000 years ago, a species developed that was first able to ask, "Why".

"Why".

Why did the Sky God take my favorite spear?
Why did the Rain God not let it rain?
Why did Ooomgla, my favorite woman die?

Something bad must have happened. Something that hurt me. Hurt is evil.

A full belly is good.

That is the "Why".



Man created "Good" and "Evil" to answer the "Why".

a reply to: DBCowboy

Why, or how did that species even have the capacity to ask "why?"

Questions, questions, questions....

originally posted by: knowledgehunter0986
Does good and evil even exist?

From a relativistic subjection perspective, yes, good and evil exist. From an objective universal reality perspective, I doubt it as good and evil would simply be the opposite poles of some form of energy. From an abstract virtual reality construct perspective, no. It's like saying, do good an evil exist in a movie? No, it's a plot construct.

Is good=evil and evil=good? In our present bizarro world, yepper. Just like right is wrong, wrong is right, truth is lies and lies are truth, empirical evidence is false and consensus is science.

Cheers - Dave

originally posted by: knowledgehunter0986
a reply to: DBCowboy

Why, or how did that species even have the capacity to ask "why?"

Questions, questions, questions....

Reasoning, it was a result of problem solving.

Problem; Spear did not kill moose.

Reason; Evil Moose God hates me.

Solution; Appease Moose God, because Moose God is evil.

a reply to: bobs_uruncle

That's a lot of perspectives. All of it made sense too.

a reply to: DBCowboy

So I guess relativity is a result of reasoning?

And reasoning is a result of problem solving?

And problem solving is a result of asking why?

And asking why is a result of reasoning?

Round and round we go... or maybe it's all relative.


Brb my brain.

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

It probably wasn't so linear.

laughs*


It probably involved pooing and using the wrong leaves.

It was 80,000 years ago! So I don't remember when it happened or exactly . . . . . why.

Evil a strong word I will say that much, like hate an love which would probably lead to cognitive dissonance or a fork in the road moment or blind rage.

Pros an cons, civilized or savage, honorable or dishonorable. Socially agreed on social constructs.

Appearances can be deceiving, the more sweet the more deadly.

It all a pov an utilitarian really, tweedle dee an tweedle dum.

I think what divides things you mention as the course of nature from “evil” is the human consciousness and it’s intent to inflict pain upon another human consciousness.

We create the evil with our intent.

The same event occurring with lack of conscious intent to harm, would just be the unlucky course of nature.

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

It probably wasn't so linear.

laughs*


It probably involved pooing and using the wrong leaves.

It was 80,000 years ago! So I don't remember when it happened or exactly . . . . . why.

Having good judgement is generally based on making a lot of bad judgements lol.

Cheers - Dave

a reply to: bobs_uruncle

It's true. Mistakes is your greatest teacher.

I'd argue those who never make them never learn anything worthwhile. Some of the most valuable lessons in life are only attainable by #ing up.

You seem to be unable to make up your mind whether or not good and evil exist in the OP. One moment you refer to these things as an illusion (which I assume you understand means they don't actually exist) and the next moment you talk about "all the "evil" that exists in the world" and that good and evil "would cease to exist without each other" (implying they exist now, which you described as part of the "one thing I know" concerning balance).

Simply or generally put, evil is that which results in pain, sorrow, or distress. Goodness is the quality or state of being good; moral excellence; virtue. Goodness is solid through and through, with no badness or rottenness. It is a positive quality and expresses itself in the performance of good and beneficial acts toward others.

The pages of history are filled with accounts of hatred and bloodshed. Yet, from the ruins of tragedy often arise extraordinary acts of human kindness and self-sacrifice. Why does one person become a cold-blooded killer and another become a warmhearted humanitarian? Why do animalistic traits sometimes surface in human behavior?

Most people do not realize that to do good requires effort, like rowing upstream against the current. Nevertheless, we are also endowed with a conscience. This inborn sense of right and wrong influences most of us to act within the bounds of human decency. However, our inclination toward wrongdoing can cause a conflict to arise within us.

Furthermore, evil may reach into our home through the media. Video games, television programs, and movies often glorify violence and acts of vengeance. Even regular doses of world or local news may desensitize us to the evils of human suffering and anguish. The Bible writer Paul admonishes us at Romans 12:2: “And stop being molded by this system of things, but be transformed by making your mind over, so that you may prove to yourselves the good and acceptable and perfect will of God.”

With ideas circulating such as the idea that evil does not exist, that it's an illusion, and shaping our attitudes and actions, some may reason that they are not to blame for their evil acts. What, though, is the reality? Just as a steering wheel controls the direction of a car and a rudder controls the direction of a ship, the mind controls the body.

Every deliberate act, good or evil, is preceded by a thought. Thus, it could be said that man is as good or as evil as he chooses to be.

Happily, the Bible indicates that goodness can be learned. (Isaiah 1:16, 17) Love is the compelling force to do what is good, since “love does not work evil to one’s neighbor.” (Romans 13:10) When we cultivate love for people, it is unthinkable for us to act in an evil way toward anyone. Paul also wrote: “Let your love be without hypocrisy. Abhor what is wicked; cling to what is good.” (Romans 12:9) One particular manifestation of love is mentioned by Paul again and again. He states: “Keep on blessing those who persecute; be blessing and do not be cursing.” “Return evil for evil to no one.” “Do not avenge yourselves, beloved.” “Do not let yourself be conquered by the evil, but keep conquering the evil with the good.” (Romans 12:14, 17-19, 21)

We refrain from returning evil for evil not only because it is the right course but also because it is the loving course. Showing love to others is a basic mark of true Christians. (Mark 12:28-31) Paul exhorts us to make sure that the love we show is sincere. Further, Paul notes how love without hypocrisy is shown, stating: “Abhor what is wicked, cling to what is good.” (Romans 12:9) “Abhor” and “cling” are strong words. “Abhor” can be translated “hate exceedingly.” We must hate not merely the consequences of evil but also the evil itself. (Psalm 97:10) A thing that would be hard to accomplish if one fools themselves into thinking or convinces themselves that evil is merely an illusion. The word “cling” is a translation of a Greek verb that literally means “to glue.” A Christian who has genuine love is so firmly glued, or attached, to the quality of goodness that it becomes an inseparable part of his personality.

Anyone with a motive to prevent that from happening to as few people as they can manage (preferrably none at all), would benefit (get what they want) from teaching, promoting and convincing people with the notion that good and evil are merely illusionary concepts or that there is no clear demarcation line between the 2 or that every act is neutral, neither good nor evil (and similar notions/ideas/philosophies).

The Bible says that Satan is “the god of this system of things.” He controls the world’s standards, that is, what the world thinks is right (good) or wrong (evil) and what becomes popular. (2 Corinthians 4:4; 1 John 5:19) He is the one responsible for such ideas and teachings about good and evil as expressed in this thread and eagerly gobbled up by those whose ears it tickles.

2 Timothy 4:3,4:

3 For there will be a period of time when they will not put up with the wholesome* [Or “healthful; beneficial.”] teaching, but according to their own desires, they will surround themselves with teachers to have their ears tickled.* [Or “to tell them what they want to hear.”] 4 They will turn away from listening to the truth and give attention to false stories.

a reply to: whereislogic

My point was they cannot exist as separate entity's. Not absolutely. I believe they only exist by virtue of one another, products of relativity.

If you were falling down from the sky right now, you'd be falling "down" yes? But if we removed "up" from the equation, are you still falling down?

Just take a look at space for example, all of your movements are completely arbitrary and only relative to your perspective. Without gravity to pull you down you cannot technically go "up".

This is the illusion I was alluding to.

This same philosophy applies to good and evil too, in my opinion. Just like lightness to darkness, right to left, yin to yang.