A Stab at the Christian Myth

Continued..

144 Carriers of merciless weapons, fearless in the face of battle.
145 Her commands were tremendous, not to be resisted.
146 Altogether she made eleven of that kind.
147 Among the gods, her sons, whom she constituted her host,
148 She exalted Qingu, and magnified him among them.
149 The leadership of the army, the direction of the host,
150 The bearing of weapons, campaigning, the mobilization of conflict,
151 The chief executive power of battle, supreme command,
152 She entrusted to him and set him on a throne,
153 "I have cast the spell for you and exalted you in the host of the gods,
154 I have delivered to you the rule of all the gods.
155 You are indeed exalted, my spouse, you are renowned,
156 Let your commands prevail over all the Anunnaki."
157 She gave him the Tablet of Destinies and fastened it to his breast,
158 (Saying) "Your order may not be changed; let the utterance of your mouth be firm."
159 After Qingu was elevated and had acquired the power of Anuship,
160 He decreed the destinies for the gods, her sons:
161 "May the utterance of your mouths subdue the fire-god,
162 May your poison by its accumulation put down aggression."

This is the first tablet. There are 7 altogether. While it is certainly not the exact same story, For those willing to look, you will see many elements of genesis included in these verses.


Here are the rest. www.ancient.eu... Also i posted an audiobook of the writings on the first page.


Also from the link.

Commentary
The Enuma Elish would later be the inspiration for the Hebrew scribes who created the text now known as the biblical Book of Genesis. Prior to the 19th century CE, the Bible was considered the oldest book in the world and its narratives were thought to be completely original. In the mid-19th century CE, however, European museums, as well as academic and religious institutions, sponsored excavations in Mesopotamia to find physical evidence for historical corroboration of the stories in the Bible. These excavations found quite the opposite, however, in that, once cuneiform was translated, it was understood that a number of biblical narratives were Mesopotamian in origin.

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: KansasGirl

But why do you believe that? You do know that there is absolutely no evidence to support that claim. And a ton of evidence showing that The stories about Jesus were pieced together from several other sources.

You are totally and completely under-informed on your last two sentences there. Embarassingly (for you) under-informed.

As to why I believe what I do, I am absolutely not going to waste my time with you on that, because it's very personal to me, and because you have absolutely no interest in considering anything besides your Enuma elish (which you seem to bank EVERYTHING on) as an explanation. Furthermore, you are very rude, crass, and worst of all: disrespectful. If I had even the slightest, tiniest indication that you were in ANY way open-minded to considering something other than your own theories, I would oblige you. But you are not interested in anything but your own "knowledge."

I have been where you are though, so I do understand. I don't blame you for believing what you do, because as I said, I was there before.

Cheers.

Well then feel free to post all of the evidence that supports the claim of a real Jesus.

a reply to: KansasGirl

I’m just going to start listing here.

Joseph Atwill, who is the author of a book entitled ‘Caesar's Messiah: The Roman Conspiracy to Invent Jesus', asserts that Christianity did not begin as a religion, but was actually a sophisticated government propaganda exercise used to pacify the subjects of the Roman Empire."

Atwill's claims are based on what he described as important and revealing parallels between a first-person account of first-century Judea (an ancient Roman province now part of Israel and Palestine) and the New Testament.
"What seems to have eluded many scholars is that the sequence of events and locations of Jesus ministry are more or less the same as the sequence of events and locations of the military campaign of (Emperor) Titus Flavius as described by Josephus," Atwill wrote in a blog on his web site.
Atwill believes that the story of Jesus was actually copied and created from the biography of the Roman emperor.

Very interesting post. I believe 2000 years from now people may view movie franchises like Star Wars & The Matrix similarly since they derive from these religious stories as well. All science also derives from religion. We would not have universities or governments without religion.

a reply to: KansasGirl

Here is a quote from Ronald Lindsey, a very competent and respected researcher. This is just an introduction to his name and his book. A great place to start.

The reality is we are unlikely ever to know the ‘facts' about Jesus," says Ronald A. Lindsay, a Senior Research Fellow at the Center for Inquiry, a non-profit educational organization. Lindsay authored an essay on the evidence for Jesus in the book "Sources of the Jesus Tradition."
"There are too many different stories about him, all of which have some serious credibility problems and which are inconsistent with one another," Lindsay told Discovery News. "For the objective historian, he will always remain a shadowy figure, with little substantive biographical content. On the one hand, we have many who will take things on faith, accepting some subset of the stories as unquestionably true. On the other hand, there are those who insist that Jesus is an invented figure, a myth or a hoax. I think both of these extremes are almost equally implausible."

He is a fair minded individual, who does not himself discount the possibility of a real jesus, but he notes that, if he was a real person, then surely the stories are plucked from other acounts and embellished.

originally posted by: JBIZZ
Very interesting post. I believe 2000 years from now people may view movie franchises like Star Wars & The Matrix similarly since they derive from these religious stories as well. All science also derives from religion. We would not have universities or governments without religion.

Possibly. But we also know that religion poisons universities and governments.

Science doesn’t derive from religion, but it could be argued that the organization found around religious institutions, such as reading and writing, and the centralization of stored information, helped promote the idea that science was indeed the best path to discerning fact from assertion.

It could also be argued that science is what proves the fictitious nature of historical religious texts.

a reply to: Astrocyte

The salvation comes from three - and hence, on the third day, in relating to the world with the logic of thesis/antithesis/synthesis, the fallen self, or egotistical self, is able to realize its unity with the universe through the logic of three.

Make sense?

Kind of makes sense. Unity with the universe though is very ambitious. Perhaps place in the World, under the protection of Father Sky is enough.
----------------------------

"Jove and Semele" (c. 1695) Dionysus by Sebastiano Ricci.


Some mothers outlive their sons.
Some sons outlive their mothers.

Dionysus ventured down
into the karstic spring of Lerna,
to retrieve his mother from hades.
Lit by the internal fire of his quest,
the clear depths revealed no bottom,
yet two great serpents swam patrol
far down below.

Some say that he evaded Thanatos
that day and victoriously led
Semele to the heights.
I wish I knew for sure,
but such knowledge is
hidden still.

Perhaps salvation from the social structure set up by elites - by the 'wanderers' who worship power.

It has been written that Jesus preached "the kingdom of Heaven". In Greek the word is οὐρανός(Ouranos), the same pre-Olympian titan, father of Kronos, father of Zeus.

The seeming impotent, emasculated Sky as compared to the power and might of the Storm. By looking and thinking, it is evident that Storm himself is subject to and subservient to Sky.

a reply to: Astrocyte

What if there exist potential intelligent life that I would describe as conscious spiritline/soul groups and or beings that may once of possibly been organic, but figured out ways to overcome the odds by becoming primarily metaphysical or conscious energy beings?

Is it possible that these beings could then come and go through time in various regions of Existence including here on EA*RTH to help brighten or darken the paths of the developing

Following this premise they could of went into a more Avatar like intentional Evolution of beaming or manifesting their souls or spirits and or consciousness into various body forms or incarnate in waves within various animal species including mankind.

Existing like this could of allowed them to possibly of been observed in the past as different individuals being piloted by the same benevolent or malevolent soul groups/spiritlines.

Sometimes I feel this is how the spirit of LORD JESUS CHRIST and other written of CREATOR GOD Sends operate.

NAMASTE*******

originally posted by: Astrocyte
Mary comes from the Hebrew word "mar" - bitter.

Hoo boy. It wouldn't be that "Mary" is a Greek translation of "Myriam?"

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: Astrocyte

Look up a picture of Isis holding Horace on her lap.

If you want The complete picture of what the Abrahamic religions are trying to portray. You should start with early Sumarian writings, and work your way up through all of the other early middle eastern teachings. You’re basically starting in the middle of the story if all you are focusing on is the Christian Bible.

So you are suggesting any woman holding a baby is because of the isis Horace thing
Really, you that brainwashed into believing your own narative

So what in relation is relevant to Sumerian and Hebrew

You been zeitgeisting way to much

Did you search for the image?

Zeitgeist is stupid

I know the image woodster, it’s not christian, it is a product of the Catholic Church.
If you understood Christianity you would know the issues
I also know christianity adopted the Easter egg, bunny, the cross, pagan solstice and many other things but it’s not relevant to who Jesus is and what He done

The Sumerian myth is nothing like the Christian one, the picture was adopted by Catholics. Catholics adopted many pagan traditions, nothing new about that.
Most protestants don’t worship or deify Mary like catholics

Yes zeitgeist is stupid but 95% of atheists gobble it all up

originally posted by: Blue Shift

originally posted by: Astrocyte
Mary comes from the Hebrew word "mar" - bitter.

Hoo boy. It wouldn't be that "Mary" is a Greek translation of "Myriam?"

Or that Miriam comes from the Egyptian name Mry jmn. well called Mr Shift, Mary was also translated as ster of the sea so the Mary=bitter link is tenuous at best
Good call

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: JBIZZ
Very interesting post. I believe 2000 years from now people may view movie franchises like Star Wars & The Matrix similarly since they derive from these religious stories as well. All science also derives from religion. We would not have universities or governments without religion.

Possibly. But we also know that religion poisons universities and governments.

Science doesn’t derive from religion, but it could be argued that the organization found around religious institutions, such as reading and writing, and the centralization of stored information, helped promote the idea that science was indeed the best path to discerning fact from assertion.

It could also be argued that science is what proves the fictitious nature of historical religious texts.

How does religion poison it, not much different from atheism. Lack of belief, Stalin and USSR, Mao and China, great leaps backwards based on a lack of faith

The “we are all animals and have no value” movement didn’t go well did it

Your problem woodie is you fail tomsee it’s a people of all beliefs or lack thereof problem not a religious issue. You are playing the blame game and blaming others you are not of. Truth is many of your own philosophy are just as bad, maybe worse

Socrates for Hebrews!?

See a Christ, kill a Christ? Sounds very familiar.

originally posted by: Woodcarver

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: Woodcarver
a reply to: KansasGirl

But why do you believe that? You do know that there is absolutely no evidence to support that claim. And a ton of evidence showing that The stories about Jesus were pieced together from several other sources.

You are totally and completely under-informed on your last two sentences there. Embarassingly (for you) under-informed.

As to why I believe what I do, I am absolutely not going to waste my time with you on that, because it's very personal to me, and because you have absolutely no interest in considering anything besides your Enuma elish (which you seem to bank EVERYTHING on) as an explanation. Furthermore, you are very rude, crass, and worst of all: disrespectful. If I had even the slightest, tiniest indication that you were in ANY way open-minded to considering something other than your own theories, I would oblige you. But you are not interested in anything but your own "knowledge."

I have been where you are though, so I do understand. I don't blame you for believing what you do, because as I said, I was there before.

Cheers.

It is you, who is unwilling to question your beliefs. I know you are not ready, but someone reading this will gladly start on the path.

Your reading comprehension is lacking. I've already said in this thread, to you, that I've already explored the "rabbit holes" you're maniacally pushing on everyone in this thread. Those and many, many, others.

Your arrogant statement to me of "You're not ready to question your beliefs" makes you look like a poor reader because I grew up in the Christian faith, which I've already stated. In fact, you and I have interacted over the topic of Christianity before, and you've tried to show me the error of my ways before.

I grew up in a loving Christian household and was a Christian all my life, until I began to openly question it in adulthood. I went from questioning it to eventually being downright hostile to it- by "it" I mean the faith and its main parts: Jesus, the bible, all of the various beliefs. I became convinced the bible was put together by men to control society, that Jesus was a myth, and that Christians, while meaning well, were gullible and sad and wasting their lives.

I was there for many years and in that time researched every rabbit hole you are going to throw at me, and I used better sources than you're doing, dude. Look into some actual scholars with this stuff.

So I absolutely am willing to question my beliefs, evidenced by what I've told you in the paragraphs above. I already did it to the extent that I walked away from Christianity.

That's all you're gonna get, so don't waste anymore of your cute effort to get me to look at your little sources. What might be good though, is if YOU do some questioning YOURSELF about why it's so important to you that every person in this thread look at your little Enuma elish. You're practically foaming at the mouth with it, and if I were you I would wonder what that is all about.

I'll keep praying for you.

originally posted by: Klassified
a reply to: KansasGirl

I have been where you are though, so I do understand. I don't blame you for believing what you do, because as I said, I was there before.

Respectfully, it is unlikely you have been where he is at. Once a person sees the Abrahamic religions for what they really are, there is no going back.

Respectfully, it is unlikely that such a blanket statement could be anywhere near accurate when you're talking about the lense through which individuals process their beliefs.

originally posted by: Woodcarver
While it is certainly not the exact same story, For those willing to look, you will see many elements of genesis included in these verses.

.

Yes, you are correct here. In fact, there are many stories in the bible which are taken from older stories and myths from many older and contemporary cultures known to the biblical authors. The creation account in Genesis is actually a mash-up of MULTIPLE myths and beliefs of which the author (or authors) of Genesis were aware.

Do you know about polemic? If not, look it up. That's what the creation account in Genesis is. Polemic. The biblical authors took aim at every creation myth that was known to them. Did you know that creation through the spoken word was part of the Egyptian's creation story? It was! So, for example, when the author of Genesis wrote "And God said, 'Let there be light'" he was taking aim at the Egyptians and their stories. But anyway, that's not the only culture and society the biblical authors were addressing. They pretty much didnt leave out any of the stories and myths of the time; they got them all.

originally posted by: JBIZZ
Very interesting post. I believe 2000 years from now people may view movie franchises like Star Wars & The Matrix similarly since they derive from these religious stories as well. All science also derives from religion. We would not have universities or governments without religion.

Agreed. And future people will definitely interpret all the crap they find of our Star Wars franchise as religious, if they don't find anything else with it that gives it proper context. And similarly, that's what a lot of us (modern people in general) have done when interpreting things in the bible: taken the words to mean something that has nothing to do with what the biblical authors would have been thinking, and thus distorted the text in all kinds of crazy ways.

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: Blue Shift

originally posted by: Astrocyte
Mary comes from the Hebrew word "mar" - bitter.

Hoo boy. It wouldn't be that "Mary" is a Greek translation of "Myriam?"

Or that Miriam comes from the Egyptian name Mry jmn. well called Mr Shift, Mary was also translated as ster of the sea so the Mary=bitter link is tenuous at best
Good call

Egypt was called "Mytsraim" in the Old Testament. I'm not arguing with your point- just adding that to the discussion.

What we call Christianity today is not what it always was but if you look around you can still find people in every nation and every part of the world whom are true Christian's.
These are Orthodox Monk's whom are walking the path and seeking our lord, that is the path for the lord is called the way and the earliest Christian's were called followers of the way.

This is the earliest known dedicated place of prayer and Judeo-Christian ceremony known of and little known to the world, it does not even feature as what it is in a search for such sites, it is first century.

This is believed to be one of the earliest Roman anti christian graffiti's mocking the God of the Christian's or Followers of the way.


I have no doubt that Jesus was and is real, I have no doubt that there may have been many archetypes of Christ like people before and after but he said it himself.
"No one come's to the father but by me", "He whom see's me see's the father", "I AM the WAY and the LIFE and the RESURRECTION".

People think the resurrection is old bone's jumping to live and while I have no doubt he can indeed to that if he wishes and the loaves and the fishes would point out that it does not matter were the remains' of the old body are that is actually not how he described the resurrection himself for he said "In the resurrection, people will neither marry nor be given in marriage. Instead, they will be like the angels in heaven."

The church with probably the oldest surviving unbroken history is the Syriac Orthodox church whom still hold there ceremony's in the language of Aramaic.