If women shoot better and are more accurate why aren't there more Women snipers?

I think the answer to your question lies in your misunderstanding of what a sniper actually does.

a reply to: JAGStorm

its a question of statistics.

it only seems like women shoot better than men (sometimes) simply because there are more men in shooting MOS to tip the scale against them.

if 100 women try out for sniper school and 40 shoot expert, and 1000 men try out for sniper and 390 shoot expert , women are better statistically....

thats all. GI Jane was fake.
men are better suited for certain things, and women are much better suited for certain things; poise and calm, aim and shoot is not (physiologically) one of them.

a reply to: odzeandennz

We'll see

2020 Tokyo Olympics to have men compete against women in shooting

www.hindustantimes.com...


Top shooter in Canada's military has a long red ponytail and says women shoot better because they're less stubborn

nationalpost.com...


www.usashooting.org...
Recent history also suggests that woman can perform alongside men in shooting competitions. At the 1992 Olympic Games in Barcelona, female competitor Shan Zhang of China became the Olympic gold medalist that year in mixed-event skeet competition.

She also became the first woman to topple the men in the history of the Olympic Games' shooting competition.

a reply to: JAGStorm

They are. Their run times don't have to be as fast. The amount of push-ups pullups, everything is lower than men. This is true for all armed services and programs.

When they announced the rangers they admitted this. I never had a problem with women serving. I have a huge problem with the double standard.

Jaden

a reply to: JAGStorm

Shooting and Sniper missions are two different animals. Sure, the latter involves the former but it is a small portion.

I do agree women (generally) are easier on the trigger, pickier with sight picture, and more patient. Obviously this is a broad brush but they tend to be.

With regards to the rest of the Sniper mission, males tend to be more physically robust. They can do the long, heavy movements with gear and still be trained to shoot well. In the US Military anyway, most of the routes to being a Sniper were male-only. This is changing so we might see women in that mission in the years to come.

BTW. If you think being a sniper is mostly shooting, you don't have a clue. Very little about being a sniper is being able to shoot accurately.

Women have physical and biological limitations that prevent them from doing things snipers need to be able to do.

Crawling for three or more days in the muck not able to make a move.

Jaden

originally posted by: JAGStorm
Just something I'm curious about.

I've heard it from many many people, women are absolutely more accurate when it comes to shooting.

Well, they told you some nice tall tales. I served in the Marines and the Army; never saw women as a whole absolutely out-shoot men, though I did on many occasions see POG units collectively score higher than infantry units on the range. I have seen many women qual as expert. My 5'1" wife (also a Marine) qualed expert on the rifle range, but here's the stipulation, shooting well in a controlled environment such as a 500 meter rifle range doesn't exactly translate to efficiency in sustained combat operations. As for snipers, they're hand selected from the best of the infantrymen and have to pass Scout Sniper school that has a very high failure rate because they only want the best. They have to not only always qual as expert on the range, but they have to be experts at land nav, be able to sit still for hours on end, blend in with the environment, be really good at math, etc.

Some of these other countries that have women in sniper positions like Israel, utilize them the same as police SWAT teams would. Israel doesn't engage in combat operations in the same manner that the US does, so they are able to accommodate women in that capacity. I've met female snipers for SWAT and I think it's fantastic, but ultimately I think it comes down to the mission. A SWAT team arrives in a big armored vehicle, drops people off and snipers get set into position while another team prepares to clear the objective. In the military, your walking/running for hours and hours with a stupid amount of unnecessary gear because Staff Sergeant thinks it's essential, plus ammo and water; most men aren't capable of this sort of stuff, let alone women who build muscle differently and at a slower pace then men. Yet the US military won't acknowledge this fact and treat women improperly by not tailoring work out routines to get women on par with the male standards. Here's something to remember: Your team is only as strong as its weakest member.

Nope, LOWER the standards, get yourself and others killed so Uncle Sam can tell your parents how honorably you served. You'll even get a nice plot at Arlington complete with a little cross and you can customize that cross with any religious symbol that you'd like. Hell, there's even symbols for atheists. But never-mind that stuff, it's about what women should be able to do because anything else is just sexist.

You guys ready for another whopper out of me?

My ex wives step dad was an American sniper in Vietnam. He would lay in wait on a mountain side for days at a time, and never move, even if they sprayed the hill with lead. He said the Vietnamese women snipers were the the best snipers of all. He shot some famous lady sniper one day.

She was on another hill, looking for him, doing the same. He spotted a glint from her scope, and shot her in the head, through her eye, right down through her scope. I guess it was a really big deal, since she had killed a bunch of American GIs, and he was honored for it. It didn't, and still doesn't bother him a bit. He said she had way more kills then he did, he just spotted her, before she spotted him. I couldn't do that, without it affecting me the rest of my life.

Ok, I lied to you. Its a true story. His name can be provided in pm for doubters

Because women are more quality over quantity. As in all other contexts, men will shoot anything. Women have to think about it for a while. LOL

(Seriously. This is a joke. I have no idea why)

My guess is that it's our very nature to NOT want to kill things. Protect our babies, that whole instinct, that radiates out to a knee-jerk repulsion for ending life. We are biologically programmed to create and nurture life, not cut it down.

Maybe? It's a good question with probably not an answer as simple and predictable as the one I proposed.

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: ManBehindTheMask
But what in the female physiology makes you think they are better at shooting?

Why are women good long-distance shooters? Our bodies are built differently than men. In sports like football this may be a disadvantage, but for sports like mountain climbing and long-distance shooting, our unique body structure actually works as a benefit. Wider hips and a lower distribution of weight provide women with more balance and control. According to expert marksman (or markswoman) Launi Mieli, head coach of the Air Force Academy rifle team and the only American woman to win an Olympic gold in small-bore rifle, “Women have a lower center of gravity and I think that gives them a distinct advantage in shooting from the standing position. I think they have better balance.”

rivetermagazine.wordpress.com...

Cool but snipers rarely, unless they just absolutely can't find a better vantage point..... Shoot standing up

Boy, you REALLY want to make sure no one thinks women could be better shooters.

There are some really good women shooters. But it has not been socially acceptable for women to get involved in wars. For thousands of years the men have fought while many of the women were kept out of the kaos. A little studying of this policy will uncover the system. The conquerers would come in and kill all the men and keep the women. Except when a society was way against the winner, then the women were also killed and sometimes the children.

When more women start to fight in wars, they loose their protection from the victor and are killed. Women are supposed to stay neutral, but that is not the case anymore.

From this I have been programmed to never shoot a doe during hunting season by my ancestors, unless of course you are starving. No fawns either. But now it is socially acceptable to shoot does just like it is acceptable to shoot women. I am not going to shoot anyone unless it is a matter of life and death for my family or Me. I also know these days that women are also toting guns to do crimes, that was rare in the old days.

I regularly shoot with a world female champion pistol shooter and take it for granted that she can shoot better than 95% of the guys including myself. I also shoot at a club level and a member there clearly beats 95% of the guys in a couple of matches so I have to concur that there is something in the female being better as you only see a few in the sport anyway.

At the Bianchi Cup level Australia has some world class shooters attend each year like Cherie Blake who took honours in 2017 and Anita Mackiewicz in 2018.

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: ManBehindTheMask
But what in the female physiology makes you think they are better at shooting?

Why are women good long-distance shooters? Our bodies are built differently than men. In sports like football this may be a disadvantage, but for sports like mountain climbing and long-distance shooting, our unique body structure actually works as a benefit. Wider hips and a lower distribution of weight provide women with more balance and control. According to expert marksman (or markswoman) Launi Mieli, head coach of the Air Force Academy rifle team and the only American woman to win an Olympic gold in small-bore rifle, “Women have a lower center of gravity and I think that gives them a distinct advantage in shooting from the standing position. I think they have better balance.”

rivetermagazine.wordpress.com...

Cool but snipers rarely, unless they just absolutely can't find a better vantage point..... Shoot standing up

Boy, you REALLY want to make sure no one thinks women could be better shooters.

Facts have nothing to do with opinion.... Sorry, not sorry if the facts offend you

originally posted by: amtracer

originally posted by: JAGStorm
Just something I'm curious about.

I've heard it from many many people, women are absolutely more accurate when it comes to shooting.

My 5'1" wife (also a Marine) qualed expert on the rifle range, but here's the stipulation, shooting well in a controlled environment such as a 500 meter rifle range doesn't exactly translate to efficiency in sustained combat operations.



Nope, LOWER the standards, get yourself and others killed so Uncle Sam can tell your parents how honorably you served. You'll even get a nice plot at Arlington t [.

Only if you're an officer. And even then, you have to have some other additional requirements to be buried in Arlington, because now that the Baby Boomers are starting to croak, Arlington is filling up.

Regarding shooting in a controlled environment not translating to efficiency in the field...well I assume that applies to the same shooters who are men, doesn't it? Or are you going to say that only the women perform differently in different circumstamces? So, in the field, men shoot just like they do at the range, but not women?

I know what you're coming back with...yes, men shoot the same in the field as they do at the range because they are better at math, navigation, and sitting still for hours.

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: ManBehindTheMask
But what in the female physiology makes you think they are better at shooting?

Why are women good long-distance shooters? Our bodies are built differently than men. In sports like football this may be a disadvantage, but for sports like mountain climbing and long-distance shooting, our unique body structure actually works as a benefit. Wider hips and a lower distribution of weight provide women with more balance and control. According to expert marksman (or markswoman) Launi Mieli, head coach of the Air Force Academy rifle team and the only American woman to win an Olympic gold in small-bore rifle, “Women have a lower center of gravity and I think that gives them a distinct advantage in shooting from the standing position. I think they have better balance.”

rivetermagazine.wordpress.com...

Cool but snipers rarely, unless they just absolutely can't find a better vantage point..... Shoot standing up

Boy, you REALLY want to make sure no one thinks women could be better shooters.

Facts have nothing to do with opinion.... Sorry, not sorry if the facts offend you

I'm not offended, but you sure seem to be a little grouchy.

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

originally posted by: KansasGirl

originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: ManBehindTheMask
But what in the female physiology makes you think they are better at shooting?

Why are women good long-distance shooters? Our bodies are built differently than men. In sports like football this may be a disadvantage, but for sports like mountain climbing and long-distance shooting, our unique body structure actually works as a benefit. Wider hips and a lower distribution of weight provide women with more balance and control. According to expert marksman (or markswoman) Launi Mieli, head coach of the Air Force Academy rifle team and the only American woman to win an Olympic gold in small-bore rifle, “Women have a lower center of gravity and I think that gives them a distinct advantage in shooting from the standing position. I think they have better balance.”

rivetermagazine.wordpress.com...

Cool but snipers rarely, unless they just absolutely can't find a better vantage point..... Shoot standing up

Boy, you REALLY want to make sure no one thinks women could be better shooters.

Facts have nothing to do with opinion.... Sorry, not sorry if the facts offend you

I'm not offended, but you sure seem to be a little grouchy.

LOL she asked questions I answered them lol she made a statement about better stability for shooting standing up, I addressed that snipers don't shoot standing....... Not sure how that makes me grouchy, but you're sure slinging a lot of allegations

I'm not aaying that women can't be excellent shooters. I've seen my fair share of them. I've spent a decent amount of time training service members and civilians in weapons handling and range coaching. Outsider than specop groups and sports shooters I've rarely seen anyone shoot expert. I've seen a great deal of sharpshooters, but unfortunatey I haven't seen that many women shoot even get marksmen. The majority of the women I've trained can't even hold an M9 punched straight out for more than a few seconds. Most of the men and women I've trained can't even keep a light M4/M16 up without getting the shakes for more than ten seconds.

Even police who handle firearms everyday have a tendency to shoot like crap. Shooting is a very perishable skill for most people. There is a special type of person who can go without shooting for a whole year and still pick a gun up and shoot like they never took a day off, and I've seen thousands of people who shoot almost every day go a few months without shooting just to pick a gun up and behave as if they forgot how to even align the sights, calibrate the sights, finger control, breathe, posture and positioning, weather conditions, atmospheric conditions, even the type of cartridge makes a difference.

Again i'm not saying women can't be better shooters than men or that they can't even be excellent shooters at all. It's just that in my experience most people suck at it in general.

originally posted by: rickymouse
I am not going to shoot anyone unless it is a matter of life and death for my family or Me.

Well, that's good because any other reason would be called murder.

originally posted by: JAGStorm
Just something I'm curious about.

I've heard it from many many people, women are absolutely more accurate when it comes to shooting.

I've haven't heard of any women snipers, why? I'm talking about the US military.

It appears in other parts of the world they do use women for that position.

Other countries don't have a problem like you said, maybe is just they are not wanted so even if they could, they will still fail by means of not being welcomed into that territory on the US military.

Is it a matter of women being better depending on which country they are from? Who knows

Kind of reminded something i heard that is like a joke in the web, about black people not being good swimmers.

Some time ago i watched that movie 'Men of Honor', could it be just the same thing all over again?