Civil Liberties Groups to Donald Trump: ‘See You in Court’

I see Joe Arpaio.

He was given the green light to figure out and enact a successful program to combat illegal immigration.

So what did he do? Profiling. Round up everyone who looked Hispanic, also pulling raids on businesses. Among other things.

He was infringing on the rights of legal Hispanics in effort to catch those who weren't. There are non-Hispanic illegals who had free reign just by appearance.

Sanctuary cities means if you don't do anything wrong, you're gonna be left alone.

It seems to me what Trump wants is the Arpaio method.

And Yes, it does remind me of Hitler's Germany.

I know a guy that was in the human trafficking task force here in CA for most of the time it's been established. When asked "How bad is it really?" he'd turn kinda green, and get this sad, pissed off, horrified etc look on his face and say "It's really bad". And MOST (not all) of the people trafficked are illegal Mexicans. He said 100s of thousands of illegal Mexicans (again mostly not all, but face it, access is easier from Mexico) are forced to "pay off" their trip to CA by becoming slaves/serfs whatever the feck you wanna call it.

Or straight up 'captured' and forced into slavery during the 'crossing'. They take kids and family hostage, they rape and beat and drug them. It is pretty horrific the things that happen, these are just what he was willing to say. He said it was MUCH worse in a lot of cases.

These cities here in CA aren't helping these people, they are perpetuating slavery in more cases than not. If an illegal manages to do well in some small backwater town, like where I live, they are extremely lucky. If they end up in a "sanctuary" cesspool, more likely they are being paid pennies on the dollar, forced to work more hours than even Trump, fed slop, not allowed to leave the premises of where they are "working", and used and abused as the "employers" see fit. They are bought and sold, they are slaves.

The people doing the buying need to be in prison for life at the very least. The cities and people perpetuating this horrific crime need to punished as well. So even though I didn't vote for Trump, in this case, GO Trump! Save the people we AMERICANS are buying and selling and using by enforcing laws on immigration and giving them channels to go to for help without fearing they will be deported because they would now be legal.

Then there is the groups who go to the nearest welfare office and sign up. And yes I have seen it with my own eyes. 8 out of 10 people in the local office I went to every day for a week while helping a friend (I counted) spoke Spanish, no English. And to boot they offered her $20 a month food stamps because she made $400 a month and she lived with her sister, trying to work her way up in life and she just needed a little help so she could go to school. She was told to come back in 6 months and next time LIE if she needed more. Just say she didn't work and would lose the roof over her head and she would do better. Our system is BassAkwards in the extreme here.

Legal immigration would mean protections, rules and fair treatment to these people. The non-criminal, hard working immigrants should be given a chance for citizenship. And I don't mean just "Oh here's your card you are legal now". They need help, but they also need to come here legally, speak English and pay taxes and WANT to be AMERICAN.

We need an enforced system where those who don't want to be a citizen are still documented and pay their fair share and have health issues covered by Mexico. Otherwise, it is not SAFE for those not documented. And it turns our ERs into urgent cares. And for the few not in slavery, it is not fair or equitable to those who ARE here legally and did it the right way. They also perpetuate the system that allows the slavery to continue.

On a side note, when I went to vote I had my ID out and ready and was told "Oh that's ok you don't need that, just give me your address and name and sign here". I was shocked since in the past they not only had to see my ID, they wrote it down next to my name.

This issue needs to be fixed quickly, for way more reasons than anyone I have seen yet is even addressing. Every single person I have seen against immigration enforcement is against it for all the wrong reasons. You aren't helping these people or being compassionate, you are condemning a majority of them to hell right here in sunny So Cal. And other areas but I can't speak to them as I live here obviously, but I'll guess it is as bad elsewhere.

Lil

originally posted by: dragonridr

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: TheBulk
a reply to: Profusion

It already went to court when Obama sued Arizona for trying to enforce immigration laws. Obama won with the argument "Immigration is under federal control". So once again we see the left trying to change the rules AGAIN to suit their agenda.

I don't think you are making an apt comparison.

It is true that the federal government's laws on immigration overrule state immigration law, through the Supremacy Clause of the Constitution, but I believe the Federal government cannot deny states federal funds unless the program that is being funded specifically states that immigration status is a condition of the program.

If it's not, the states would have a case.

Not to true federal funds can be withheld for almost any reason. For example failure to comply with Obamas education initiatives would have led to a loss of federal funds. This has been the common way Washington has gotten states to bend to there will. The states choice becomes either abide by the mandate or refuse the funds.

It is common, but this is a brand new can of worms that may open up the federal government to legal reciprocation.

We will have to wait and see.

originally posted by: Allaroundyou
“Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed, to me:
I lift my lamp beside the golden door.


Emma Lazarusa reply to: IkNOwSTuff

Nobody is turning immigrants away who are coming in to the country with the proper processes. We don't want people sidestepping that process to gain entry with the intent to hide away and not recipricate what they draw from the system. People gain access to our country and all of it's perks with no intention of returning anything to the system. that is what we want to curb and / or minimize. This has nothing to do with racism and every thing to do with the security of our country. If people want to come and be a part of our society, i am all for that, but if they want to commit crimes, like coming here illegally, then they have no respect for what we are doing and what we offer here freely.

How many people here on this board know at least one person who is here in our country without the proper paperwork. I know at least 30 that i deal with around construction sites pretty regularly. All of which are pretty good dudes. They don't work for the big firms because the big firms cannot hire them outright. So they work for the subcontractors who mostly do all of the labor. Concrete, brick, roofing, drywall, framing, etc, but these are the jobs where they are found on. It's hard, #ty work. But the subs can pay them out of pocket and not provide any insurance or take taxes out. Sub work is almost always cash based. A simple check changing hands.

So they are not paying taxes, they are not paying for the insurance they have, every one of them gets food stamps, and all of their untaxed money gets sent back home via western union.

Now i know these guys. I go to their houses sometimes and hang out. Some of them want to find a girl here to marry, so they can get legal status, but the majority left their families behind to come here to work the program as they call it. It is planned out for them. All they have to do is come to work. They are given a house to live in, with plenty of mattresses on the floor, food is communal and pretty good. Alcohol is communal and plenty of it. Not the good stuff but hey, it puts them to sleep.

They get hired because they are good workers who come to work every day. They do a pretty good job, better than a lot. And they work pretty cheap. $400-$500 per week no tax. So the demand for them is high and the consequence for hiring them is low.

That money is like making almost twice as much in mexico where they plan to spend it.

Do i hate them? Absolutely not. I wouldn't do the same if i were in their place though. That money multiplied by a conservative number of 10,000,000 known illegals Could be as much as 5 billion a week leaving our shores. Let's be ultra conservative and cut that number in half. 2.5 billion, and then stretch it out for a year. 52 x 2.5b = 130 Billion a year, leaving our shores. Lets cut that in half again to be even more conservative with our numbers. 65 billion, 32 billion, 16 billion, the point is that even the most conservative numbers are huge.

originally posted by: Woodcarver
Nobody is turning immigrants away who are coming in to the country with the proper processes.

Sure they are. There are quotas.

ETA: On topic. Of course they are going to go to the courts. That is what happens in a country of laws.

originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: Woodcarver
Nobody is turning immigrants away who are coming in to the country with the proper processes.

Sure they are. There are quotas.

ETA: On topic. Of course they are going to go to the courts. That is what happens in a country of laws.

Nobody is turned away who meetes the legal requirements. They are put on a list. That list is dif depending on your status. If you have a highly sought after skill, you can get fast tracked. If you are a brick layer, that list could be ten years long.

a reply to: Annee

Are you talking about Arpaio? If so, im not going to disagree. He tramples civil rights all day, e'ry day.

If you are talking about Trump, ill need explanation.

a reply to: Allaroundyou

A poem on a French monument does not dictate law or policy. Nice image but applies only to those authorized to enter and remain in the USA, under jurisdiction thereof.

originally posted by: Woodcarver
Nobody is turned away who meetes the legal requirements.

Sure they are. That is what quotas mean. 10,000 apply only 5,000 spots available so 5,000 get turned down even if they meet the legal requirements. Next year another 10,000 apply and there are still only 5,000 spots which means the list is never going to get smaller. (numbers pulled straight out of my rear and for illustrative purposes only).

How can people want a $15/hr minimum wage and then go and say they need illegals to do these jobs for pennies on the dollar because no one else will do them that cheaply. And then they go and say lets legalize them(which would subject them to minimum wages).

How are people's brains not exploding from holding these thoughts together.

Those illegals you see in the trades are some of the most ambitious. They live like Kings back in mexico with houses better than yours. an untaxed $10-12/hr is big money in Mexico.

America robs the rest of the world of their brightest and hardest working. Setting back their development immensely. Why do these open borders folks hate other countries?
Its called the brain drain.

originally posted by: jellyrev
How can people want a $15/hr minimum wage and then go and say they need illegals to do these jobs for pennies on the dollar because no one else will do them that cheaply. And then they go and say lets legalize them(which would subject them to minimum wages).

How are people's brains not exploding from holding these thoughts together.

Different people?

Those illegals you see in the trades are some of the most ambitious. They live like Kings back in mexico with houses better than yours. an untaxed $10-12/hr is big money in Mexico.

Maybe above average but, like kings is stretching it.

America robs the rest of the world of their brightest and hardest working. Setting back their development immensely. Why do these open borders folks hate other countries?
Its called the brain drain.

This is also not true. Open or closed borders would not affect the "brain drain" since those immigrants already have the doors open to them.

I agree with all of you but we need reform in this aspect. The kind that allows those that want to be here a much more attainable prospect than it is right now. I know this isn't the past but this is still America we are talking about. a reply to: Noncents

It is a beautiful poem indeed So lets say we decided to build a moat instead filled with crocs and spikes on one side then maybe we could have a Ellis island #2! Just a comical thought. Also much more cost effective and cool. I mean explosives and crocs and spikes. Pretty cool if you ask me. a reply to: YouSir

a reply to: daskakik

Different people?

Yes, I forgot about those pesky open borders libertarians, They are such a large percentage of the population.

Maybe above average but, like kings is stretching it.

ok, common hyperbole phrase

This is also not true. Open or closed borders would not affect the "brain drain" since those immigrants already have the doors open to them.

you are right, I reread it.

originally posted by: jellyrev
Yes, I forgot about those pesky open borders libertarians, They are such a large percentage of the population.

I meant that businesses want the pennies on the dollar workers, americans want $15/hr min wage and 1st gen families want their kin to be legalized. Different people wanting different things.

originally posted by: IkNOwSTuff
Surely ignoring federal laws is also against the constitution?!?

I really dont understand the Lefty SWJ mindset, it is so full of contradictions and holes its amazing it functions at all

It doesn't. The media, Hollywood and Academia keep it afloat with non-stop propaganda and indocrination.

originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: FauxMulder

Why is the ACLU defending illegal actions? "American" is the first word in ACLU, what do illegal immigrants have to do with AMERICAN civil liberties?

Because the rights of this nation is for everyone in our borders not just citizens.

Gosh Buster can you really say that with a straight face or what? You are saying something to me that is just about like saying "the vikings coming to pillage deserve the same rights as their victims had prior to their invasion of England" and YOU don't seem to realize it. I appears as if almost all the libs here on ATS lately seem to be pretending they don't know right from wrong anymore.

The right to go back home alive is about all the right an invader might deserve. Law breaking from a defined set of laws society has drafted is it really that hard for you to understand or is this just some pretentious mess? Geeze...

IF you want to take over a country you normally invade it and if you want to lose your country you allow that. ...snipped...

originally posted by: Allaroundyou
“Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed, to me:
I lift my lamp beside the golden door.


Emma Lazarusa reply to: IkNOwSTuff

The Statue had nothing to do with immigration. It was about freedom. The French honored us with the Statue to celebrate the friendship between our countries. We were the first nation ever to make the rulers of their country aware that freedom and liberty was possible. The sonnet, "The New Colossus", engraved at the base, was written by the Jewish poet Emma Lazarus as part of a fund raising campaign. She wrote as a way of honoring those Jews suffering from anti-semitism who wanted to flee from their host countries. The original manuscript is held by the American Jewish Historical Society. The sonnet played no significant part in the celebration of the opening of the statue in 1883 and was all but forgotten. 20 years later the text of the poem was put on the inner wall of the pedestal of the Statue of Liberty. And that's how the poem ended up on a Statue that was specifically created to honor freedom and originally inscribed only with the adoption date of the Declaration of Independence (JULY IV MDCCLXXVI). And that's why we call it the Statue of Liberty and not the Statue of Immigration.

Today the true story of the Statue of Liberty is disingenuously used for political purposes to paint a gauzy picture of those happy times when we weren't so picky about who was allowed to immigrate to our country. In fact it was just the opposite, the US had (like the rest of the world had, and still has) a merit based immigration policy. Potential immigrants had to stop on the island and pass a rigorous inspection before being allowed to set foot on the mainland. If you didn't have enough money with you, if you had no job skills, or if you had a criminal record, you were rejected. If you passed that phase you were sent to the medical inspection line and uniformed military surgeons quickly culled out those with minor medical conditions. Even a case of glaucoma could cause you to be rejected. The doctors would observe the immigrants as they climbed the stairs leaving the baggage area. If you had difficulty with those stairs, that could cause you to be rejected. Ellis Island was sometimes known as "The Island of Tears" or "Heartbreak Island" because of the immigrants that were turned away.