Trump...Not GOP...Not Dem...Plutocrat

Outstanding OP!

Trump is Bush plus and Reagan Plus minus intelligence and experience


The only hope is Trump just gets luck. Because we know a dog can be president and the country can get better on its own gravity for a time.


But unfortunately as the OP indicates Trump's trickle down and Oligarchic nature will eventually ruin the country

a reply to: Annee

Then you'll need to hang these on your wall. (Copied these a few years ago, don't have source)

CAPITALIST
TEN COMMANDMENTS

1. Do unto others before they do it unto you. Beggar thy neighbor and trade their employments without offset, tariff, or compensation to secure a bountiful profit from the greater slave. Engage the most authoritarian of regimes and let no morality, nor powers of the vast majority, interfere with the greater profits to be had from preserving disparities and all the powers of predation enjoyed by the rich.

2. In all things, see that your capital-defined Efficiency shall remain the only god, and let no morality, freedom nor ecological concern interfere with your divine right to profit and enclose for your benefit.

3. Thou shalt make money and power thy only god and pursuit, and not suffer any foolish idleness opening one to other occupations or dangerous revelations.

4. To secure thy power, thou shalt not let the people own or control their central banks - despite constitutional purse powers to the contrary - for debt money is the central power and motive force before which all others pale and remain impotent.

5. Thou shalt own and control all media and news dissemination agencies. Let not any editor be elected lest the people influence what they see, hear and read. Let all books, media, and education grow our values exclusively. Let not any fairness doctrine nor any notion of labor-capital "factor" balance interfere with this, our grand design.

6. In all things, thou shalt make Growth and per-capita ruin thy only gods, and defeat Balance at every turn. Thou shalt see that humanity endlessly multiplies. Let no balance of population arise which might serve to pass on the same quantum of freedom, earthly space, natural right and pleasure even to thine own children - as this would destroy our precious and profitable Growth.

7. In all things, thou shalt resist Balance, and both factor and gender equity for I, your male SkyGod, have told you so.

8. Let no freely communal or cooperative emerge, nor non-profit venture succeed - for such competition is to be feared and prohibited. Privative everything and control the reigns of power so the vast majority own no debt-free estate or may access any means with which they might secure their domestic freedom, independence, and democracy.

9. Let Nature's realm be conquered and set to your profit purposes. Patent and own nature's pharmacopeia. Change the nature of animals and humans alike to serve your ends. Render off limits those fertile lands and plants by which the masses might enjoy leisure, acquire natural freedom, secure refuge from our Free Market, or stumble upon revelations of a non-egoic, cooperative, and spiritual nature.

10. Let enclosure reign, for the landless and dependent are fodder for thy greater objectives. Let our Interdependency forever be mediated by the rich and powerful, and secured in the name of an Efficiency serving our ends alone. Seek to destroy any remnants of natural freedom, commonwealth, and domestic independence. Let our Free Market of neo-slavery prevail and thy will profit beyond one's wildest dreams.

Copyright 2003

a reply to: Indigo5

The Reagan days were good until suddenly they weren't. Reagans trickle down economics ended with the highest unemployment since the Great Depression. The architect of Reagans econic plan and chief economic advisor admitted Reagonimics was a disaster for the economy. Trumps plan is Reagonimics on steroids...and that is a view held by far right economic analysts along with everyone else.

While we talk today of how important the Culture Wars played in Reagan's 1980 election, not much is said about voters feeling it very important that he bring a roiling economy (inflation) under control without price controls, etc. So, to do that meant to create a large pool of unemployed in order to drive wages down. That was accomplished by corporations laying off workers. Those corporations who did not lay off workers instead asked for wage concessions and got them. Unions were told a couple things, that as the corporation did better wages would see an increase and that there had to be wage tiers for especially new hires. (Only one of these things happened....)

The problem became that as new wealth was created by the corporations it did not "trickle down" but stayed at the top.

I just found this article available again online. Excellent read.

Who Broke America’s Jobs Machine?

[I]n the years after officials in the Reagan administration radically altered how our government enforces our antimonopoly laws, the American economy underwent a truly revolutionary restructuring. Four great waves of mergers and acquisitions—in the mid-1980s, early ’90s, late ’90s, and between 2003 and 2007—transformed America’s industrial landscape at least as much as globalization. Over the same two decades, meanwhile, the spread of mega-retailers like Wal-Mart and Home Depot and agricultural behemoths like Smithfield and Tyson’s resulted in a more piecemeal approach to consolidation, through the destruction or displacement of countless independent family-owned businesses.

It would only be a fool now who would promise to return all the jobs lost. The kind of fool who lives in the past and is clueless when it comes to thinking about a realistic future.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: desert
And just wait when Net neutrality is gone.

Trump picks strike fear into net neutrality backers

Of course, we'll be told it's good for us.

Sadly, I'm raising my grandson to fit into this world. To be one of the "counted ones".

Its gonna be a "Take No Prisoner" future. If you're not one of them, you're nobody.

Same here. Always prepare and always strive for a better world. My kids understand why I am for gun control and they also understand why I own guns. My 12 year old daughter is a good shot. They go to terrific schools and volounteer at shelters during the holidays. They know never to hit first, but also know how to inflict pain quickly on someone bigger than them when there is no choice. They live in a wealthy community but know that a house is just a pretty box, but a home is where the heart is.

Here is the thing about every Plutocracy...it always ends with a collapse and sometimes a revolution with people getting dragged from their palaces. The rich getting richer at everyone else's expense does not last and it ends badly. That is why I teach my kids about economic justice and equality, about truth and lies, right and wrong ..even though they are economically advantaged.

Strength, honesty and kindness. I would argue all are needed now more than ever. The next decade is going to test our democracy in profound ways. Light always wins, but no one recognizes the daylight without the night. Darkness is just an absense of light.

a reply to: Indigo5

Supremely well said, Indigo! And I very much love the American values you write about.

Strength, honesty and kindness. I would argue all are needed now more than ever. The next decade is going to test our democracy in profound waste. Light always wins, but no one recognizes the daylight without the night. Darkness is just an absense of light.

a reply to: desert

I have been thinking about one of my favorite quotes lately...
"Principles only mean something if you stick to them when it is inconvenient"

The press seems to have devolved into quietly mumbling about Trumps lies and horrific choices for his administration. A lie is still a lie when a President Elect speaks it. He needs to be held to a higher bar now, not a shrug-your-shoulders lower standard. Forces are working to normalize lies and corruption and history will remember who spoke up and who looked away.

a reply to: Indigo5

Thread title:

Trump...Not GOP...Not Dem...Plutocrat

Absolutely correct.... he is none of those things.

He is the President-elect who will be inaugurated on Jan. 20, 2017. That is all that really matters now.

a reply to: Indigo5

Indeed. "A lie is still a lie when a President Elect speaks it."

Pundits and citizens acted as if this last election cycle was "normal", just like all the others in our history. Normal input should generate the normal outcome in the same program. But it was not the same program!

New instructions had been written with Citizens United, along with fundamental change in our system of governing via creeping, then fully actualized (last eight years), asymmetric polarization. But everyone acted as if the program was still the same.

It was not even a matter of "garbage in, garbage out". The entire program had been re-written. And, unfortunately, the re-writing will continue in earnest under the Trump administration.

Here are some excerpts from the document “Revisiting Plutonomy”:

“Asset booms, a rising profit share, and favorable treatment by market-friendly governments have allowed the rich to prosper . . . [and] take an increasing share of income and wealth over the last twenty years. . . . The top 10 percent, particularly the top 1 percent of the United States—the plutonomists in our parlance—have benefited disproportionately from the recent productivity surge in the U.S. . . . [and] from globalization and the productivity boom, at the relative expense of labor.

. . . [And they] are likely to get even wealthier in the coming years. Because the dynamics of plutonomy are still intact.”

The Rule of the Rich

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: desert
And just wait when Net neutrality is gone.

Trump picks strike fear into net neutrality backers

Of course, we'll be told it's good for us.

Sadly, I'm raising my grandson to fit into this world. To be one of the "counted ones".

Its gonna be a "Take No Prisoner" future. If you're not one of them, you're nobody.

Same here. Always prepare and always strive for a better world. My kids understand why I am for gun control and they also understand why I own guns. My 12 year old daughter is a good shot. They go to terrific schools and volounteer at shelters during the holidays. They know never to hit first, but also know how to inflict pain quickly on someone bigger than them when there is no choice. They live in a wealthy community but know that a house is just a pretty box, but a home is where the heart is.

Here is the thing about every Plutocracy...it always ends with a collapse and sometimes a revolution with people getting dragged from their palaces. The rich getting richer at everyone else's expense does not last and it ends badly. That is why I teach my kids about economic justice and equality, about truth and lies, right and wrong ..even though they are economically advantaged.

Strength, honesty and kindness. I would argue all are needed now more than ever. The next decade is going to test our democracy in profound ways. Light always wins, but no one recognizes the daylight without the night. Darkness is just an absense of light.

I'm trying to do the same.

In my thinking - - you have to be part of the system to change it. Like an "Inside Man".

Being on the outside complaining - - with no real power or position to make changes - - is a waste to me - - if the person is intelligent, educated, and capable.

EDIT: I want to add - - DIVERSE EDUCATION. Learn everything. If you have a job, look beyond it within it. Can you do more. Can you help and learn from other departments. Continue educating yourself, etc.

I worked as a temp office person. In one job there was a blueprint plotter in the office. I bugged everyone who came in to show me how to use it. Someone finally did. There was a day some Biggy Wigs came in from corporate. They wanted to print a blueprint. No one there knew how to use the machine. But, I did. And I spoke up. They were so impressed they gave me a bonus.

a reply to: Annee

Your Grandson is blessed to have such a smart and caring Grandma That is so true about the need to be diverse, choosing to try something new, even if it already is in one's field/job. Be out front on the latest, finding a better way to get a job done, be curious and go for it. It's way past the days of 50 years doing the same thing day in day out.

originally posted by: desert
It's way past the days of 50 years doing the same thing day in day out.

Definitely!

You have to make yourself valuable and stand out.

People talk about the farmers.

Well, farming's gone hi-tech. You need a science degree today.

I'm so happy reading these liberal diatribes...

We've sounded insane for the last 8 years...

Now it's yalls turn...

This is pure hilarity and please keep the conspiracy theories coming....

And the protests are priceless....it's like a 3 week long cowboys super bowl parade...

-Chris

originally posted by: Annee
EDIT: I want to add - - DIVERSE EDUCATION. Learn everything. If you have a job, look beyond it within it. Can you do more. Can you help and learn from other departments. Continue educating yourself, etc.

This is what it comes down to. For the past several decades we've focused on teaching specializations, but specializations limit what you can do, and how you approach problems. Rather than having an indepth knowledge of one specific subject, you're probably going to do best by having a medium level of knowledge on a range of subjects. In doing so, you can take a solution from one field and apply it to another.

At a minimum, that's the best way to be a manager (the technical, not non technical type) rather than just a rank and file employee. It's not necessarily an easy route to go though, because it means you have to study and be proficient with a lot of jobs.

I really couldn't agree more with the title. Trump isn't left, right or center. He is the first President that is an American citizen (not politics nor military). Hes is an "average joe" if you ignore his money. So he is an "average joe" that knows the system. He used it for his benefit when he was doing it for himself...he will use it now to fix it.

Trump is a man. That is it...just a normal, average, non-politically-correct man. So look at his supporters...average American people. Not adult-children with a need for safe places, counselors for disturbing Halloween costumes, rioting and violence when they don't get their way, etc. Trump is about (roughly) the standard and stereo-type American values.

Who the Hell is surprised he won is a bit out of touch. You only push the REAL America so far. Yes...we are nice, tolerant and patient. But when you push too far...enough becomes enough and we react and reestablish our core values.

originally posted by: RickinVa
a reply to: Indigo5

Thread title:

Trump...Not GOP...Not Dem...Plutocrat

Absolutely correct.... he is none of those things.

The title clearly was intended to convey that Trump was a Plutocrat.

It's very hard to argue that he's not. We'll see how he governs, but throwing government money at big corporations to incentivize them to stay in the U.S. INSTEAD OF renegotiating NAFTA or tightening tax loopholes is certainly a move a PLUTOCRAT would favor.

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
I really couldn't agree more with the title. Trump isn't left, right or center. He is the first President that is an American citizen (not politics nor military). Hes is an "average joe" if you ignore his money. So he is an "average joe" that knows the system. He used it for his benefit when he was doing it for himself...he will use it now to fix it.

Trump is a man. That is it...just a normal, average, non-politically-correct man. So look at his supporters...average American people. Not adult-children with a need for safe places, counselors for disturbing Halloween costumes, rioting and violence when they don't get their way, etc. Trump is about (roughly) the standard and stereo-type American values.

Who the Hell is surprised he won is a bit out of touch. You only push the REAL America so far. Yes...we are nice, tolerant and patient. But when you push too far...enough becomes enough and we react and reestablish our core values.

You say you couldn't agree more with the title, but it sounds to me like you don't agree with the actual OP. Did you read it?

originally posted by: WeAreAWAKE
Who the Hell is surprised he won is a bit out of touch. You only push the REAL America so far. Yes...we are nice, tolerant and patient. But when you push too far...enough becomes enough and we react and reestablish our core values.

So are you suggesting that the more than 64 million people who voted for Hillary are not REAL Americans?

That only the roughly 25% of eligible voters who voted Trump are REAL Americans?

What does that make the rest of the populace who didn't vote Trump?

Who decides who is a REAL American? Nice piece of pseudo-nationalist rhetoric you've got going there.

originally posted by: Indigo5

originally posted by: NoCorruptionAllowed
I remember Reagan days and they were good, and Reaganomics worked, but the only problem that happened later was that Reagan expanded the size of government massively. That is what happened later to ruin his trickle down economics.

The Reagan days were good until suddenly they weren't. Reagans trickle down economics ended with the highest unemployment since the Great Depression. The architect of Reagans econic plan and chief economic advisor admitted Reagonimics was a disaster for the economy. Trumps plan is Reagonimics on steroids...and that is a view held by far right economic analysts along with everyone else.

Reagan raised my taxes for real, I lived through it...plus, aprox. 50 of his henchmen were not only indicted, but convicted of crimes involving sales of arms to Iran. the poor will multiply, and the middle class will be screwed out of the few benefits they now have. EVERY republican administration has done this since I've been alive (1952)....same s**t, different republican....if a republican was elected to be chief dogcatcher,. he'd find a way to punish the dogs

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: Annee
EDIT: I want to add - - DIVERSE EDUCATION. Learn everything. If you have a job, look beyond it within it. Can you do more. Can you help and learn from other departments. Continue educating yourself, etc.

This is what it comes down to. For the past several decades we've focused on teaching specializations, but specializations limit what you can do, and how you approach problems. Rather than having an indepth knowledge of one specific subject, you're probably going to do best by having a medium level of knowledge on a range of subjects. In doing so, you can take a solution from one field and apply it to another.

This is a little bit in my field of work.

To bottom line it...America needs to teach our kids HOW TO SOLVE PROBLEMS...Not what the answer to problems are.
The Chinese are brilliant mathematicians...abacuses in the cradle..Tell them what to do and they are off and humming like little human calculators...but given them a general open problem and they come to a screeching halt.

Americans strength has always been innovation and invention...aka solving novel (not done before) problems...we invent things and create new technology.

China?...they knock-off and copy that technology on the cheap...Speedy math and engineering...no invention mind-set.

We need to stop hammering our kids on Math like we need to beat China at being human calculators..Instead we need to teach our kids how to examine a novel challenge (the word problem has negative connotation) and come up with new and better solutions. Let China be China...we have Computers to do our heavy lifting in math...Teach kids the fundementals of math and engineering and teach them a whole lot of other stuff they can weave in to come up with new solutions to new challenges...new inventions..new and better technology.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: desert
It's way past the days of 50 years doing the same thing day in day out.

Definitely!

You have to make yourself valuable and stand out.

People talk about the farmers.

Well, farming's gone hi-tech. You need a science degree today.

I watched a story on Farmer in Iowa who farms a 1000+ acres...via sitting in his air conditioned home office monitoring and directing several self-driving autonomous tractors.