Catholics are not Christian?

a reply to: Akragon

I find this funny, if you believe in jeebus christ, then your religion is closer to Islam than Judaism,
Because its not based on mass revelations.

True story.

originally posted by: Aedaeum
a reply to: Akragon

When you can tell me where in the bible that a "Hail Mary" will take away sin, I will oblige

That's not the point of the "hail mary"

A prestigious cannot take away your sin.

Only God can. That being the case.. we know that God will forgive all Sins.. so the priest carries out the ceremony of reconciliation to cement the idea that all mofo our sins can be forgiven. It's more symbolic than literal.

Saying a Hail Mary isn't magic, "us Catholics" refer to it as a Penzance. The idea is you make up your sin with a positive act, and showing true remorse. Certain prayers.. such as a Hail Mary are chosen because they remind us once again that all of our sins can be forgiven.. and that in turn to focus on the examples laid out before us of how to conduct ourselves.. such as the mother mary.

originally posted by: Akragon
Someone explain this to me...

I've been hearing this from people lately...

im even seeing someone that still can't grasp the idea, which is weird considering i've explained it a few times

Keep in mind im not agreeing or disagreeing with the idea...

Even though i find one side ridiculous

Anyone?

Somehow I feel the same "Christians" claiming this are those who believe this is the end-times and that we are going to get raptured in the sky and that Obama is the antichrist. Some American protestant sects


They are frightened people and they need our love and prayers so that find peace and wisdom.

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: Akragon
"The Pope is against Christ" goes back to Luther.
If one believes that Catholics are following the antichrist, then denying them the label "Christian" is a fairly natural deveopment. It just seems to have happened gradually and locally.
It doesn't make sense to people who have learned history, but who learns history nowadays?

I go with Parson Thwackum;

By religion I mean Christianity, by Christianity I mean Protestantism, by Protestantism I mean the Church of England as established by law.

I have met catholics who have a deep desire and love for Christ, in body and spirit.
Who do not worship saints or Mary
They live their lives better than many protestants I have met

You will know them not by their affiliations but by their fruits.
Book of Rags

originally posted by: solve
a reply to: Akragon

I find this funny, if you believe in jeebus christ, then your religion is closer to Islam than Judaism,
Because its not based on mass revelations.

True story.

How so?

Christianity positions itself as the fulfilment of Jewish prophesy with Jesus being the Christ saviour that they are all waiting for.

Islam is just some random dude who claims he spoke to some so called Ark Angel who told him some seriously weird crap. Not to mention the Dude who wrote it had a 6 year old wife.....

originally posted by: markosity1973

originally posted by: Lucidparadox

That couldn't be further from the truth.

Catholics are taught ton have a personal connection and relationship with Christ.

Where did you hear that we do not have direct access? Lol

Yup.....

The main difference between Catholicism and the true protestant faiths is that they are like "Jesus - lite" versions of Salvation. They fastidiously hold on to the belief that you can only talk to Jesus and God.

The older Coptic, Catholic and even Angilcan (episcopalian) faiths however all believe in the communion of Saints. i.e. Jesus has helpers. So while the holy trinity are always number one, we have loads of folks in heaven to go bug God for the odd favour when we need it

Correct.. if I'm not mistaken thats the main difference between Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Catholic.. is thst Roman Catholics believe in the communion of Saints and the ability to call on their help.. whereas eastern Orthodox is strictly the trinity (but recognizes saints lives as great examples)

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: Lucidparadox


Christianity is simply believing that Jesus Christ is the true Son of God and not merely a prophet, believing that he is a part of the Holy trinity

If you believe that then you have been deceived greatly

I would wager my life satan believes what you have stated and it isnt christian

Im sorry, maybe I should have phrased that with a lkttle.more detail. When I referenced "people who believe.." I was fereffering to "religions that believe..." that are.. Inherently Christ serving.. since that is what we're talking about

a reply to: markosity1973

Again, I don't believe that either. Christ gave us an example of how to pray: "Our Father in heaven...". Praying to "Jesus" is not what he wanted and in my opinion a dire misrepresentation to why he came in the first place. Anyone who prays outside of how he told us to pray, should be questioning why they would pray any other way. I'm sure that's not going to be a popular opinion with most Christians.

en.wikipedia.org...

After the Reformation and until at least the late 20th Century, majority Protestant states (especially England, Germany, the United States, and Canada) made anti-Catholicism and opposition to the Pope and Catholic rituals major political themes, with anti-Catholic sentiment at times leading to violence and religious discrimination against Catholic individuals (often derogatorily referred to in Anglophone Protestant countries as "papists" or "Romanists"). Historically, Catholics in Protestant countries were frequently (and almost always baselessly) suspected of conspiring against the state in furtherance of papal interests or to establish a political hegemony under the "Papacy", with Protestants sometimes questioning Catholic individuals' loyalty to the state and suspecting Catholics of ultimately maintaining loyalty to the Vatican rather than their domiciled country. In majority Protestant countries with large scale immigration, such as the United States, Canada, and Australia, suspicion or discrimination of Catholic immigrants often overlapped or conflated with nativism, xenophobia, and ethnocentric or racist sentiments (i.e. anti-Italianism, anti-Irish sentiment, hispanophobia, Anti-Quebec sentiment). In the Early modern period, in the face of rising secular powers in Europe, the Catholic Church struggled to maintain its traditional religious and political role in primarily Catholic nations. As a result of these struggles, there arose in some majority Catholic countries (especially among those individuals with certain secular political views) a hostile attitude towards the considerable political, social, spiritual and religious power of the Pope and the clergy in the form of anti-clericalism.

originally posted by: Lucidparadox

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: Lucidparadox


Christianity is simply believing that Jesus Christ is the true Son of God and not merely a prophet, believing that he is a part of the Holy trinity

If you believe that then you have been deceived greatly

I would wager my life satan believes what you have stated and it isnt christian

Im sorry, maybe I should have phrased that with a lkttle.more detail. When I referenced "people who believe.." I was fereffering to "religions that believe..." that are.. Inherently Christ serving.. since that is what we're talking about

Fair point

Though actions (fruit of the Spirit) are just as important
"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control."

a reply to: Akragon

Yes, catholics are christian by definition. However, protestant christian religious orders like the baptists do not follow catholic teachings.

A lot of baptist sects teach that catholics practice false idolatry because they pray to the virgin Mary and saints, but I think that's just a reinforcement of faith and a really petty, senseless distinction.

If you believe that Jesus was the son of the christian god, then you're a christian. Everything else is just semantics.

a reply to: Lucidparadox

No, they do. They have their own saints, but they do the same as Catholics do when they pray 'Novenas' to ask them for help. It's called the intercession of Saints.

I know that the Coptics also heavily believe in icons (holy images) - and that they venerate the Virgin Mary like Catholics do.

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: Lucidparadox

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: Lucidparadox


Christianity is simply believing that Jesus Christ is the true Son of God and not merely a prophet, believing that he is a part of the Holy trinity

If you believe that then you have been deceived greatly

I would wager my life satan believes what you have stated and it isnt christian

Im sorry, maybe I should have phrased that with a lkttle.more detail. When I referenced "people who believe.." I was fereffering to "religions that believe..." that are.. Inherently Christ serving.. since that is what we're talking about

Fair point

Though actions (fruit of the Spirit) are just as important
"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control."

Interesting that forgiveness isn't mentioned

Paul eh..

a reply to: Lucidparadox

In Christianity, you can't make up your sin with any amount of "positive" actions. Reciting anything is nothing but vain repetition.

You get on your knees with a contrite heart and spirit. There is no pope or priest giving you direction, just you and your Father in heaven. You're repenting. That's the only way to address sin for a Christian. Our Father wants to know what's in our hearts, not what's on our lips.

originally posted by: Aedaeum
a reply to: markosity1973

Again, I don't believe that either. Christ gave us an example of how to pray: "Our Father in heaven...". Praying to "Jesus" is not what he wanted and in my opinion a dire misrepresentation to why he came in the first place. Anyone who prays outside of how he told us to pray, should be questioning why they would pray any other way. I'm sure that's not going to be a popular opinion with most Christians.

You are free to believe what you will.

But I can only imagine the look of shock upon your face when you see Catholics up there in heaven along with Protestants when you make it there

ETA

Read this Coptic Explanation. It states the position of us who believe in Intercession very eloquently.

theorthodoxchurch.info...

originally posted by: Akragon

Interesting that forgiveness isn't mentioned

Paul eh..

Paul taught love, you cant love and hate in the same breath

"And be kind to one another, tender-hearted, forgiving each other, just as God in Christ also has forgiven you," (Eph. 4:32).


18 All this is from God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation: 19 that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting people’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation. 2 Corinthians 5:18-19


Well maybe some fool themselves into believing they can love and hate at the same time, hate being unforgiveness or revenge

But whatever floats your boat

a reply to: markosity1973

Teehee, the pleasure will be mine, while still on Earth we'll be wondering where heaven is...

Did I state ever, at any point, that ones salvation lies specifically on their religion? Did I say at any point that Catholics or any other religion or denomination, would not have salvation?

I believe there will be more salvation for Atheists and Agnostics, than for the religious. I pity the religious because of the great burden that they are forced to bear, self-inflicted or otherwise. It's going to be very hard for them.

originally posted by: Raggedyman

Well maybe some fool themselves into believing they can love and hate at the same time, hate being unforgiveness or revenge

A psychologist would disagree there. Sometimes love can fuel hatred.

Im sure you have met couples who obviously both love and hate each other.

Coomba98

a reply to: Akragon

Thanks for this very entertaining thread.
I feel like this:

originally posted by: Metallicus
a reply to: Akragon

My grandma always said that the Catholics were just as bad as the Jews.

is the best answer. I am catholic.

If you look at it all the other "christans" follow the politically motivated sects invented by powerplayers. Henry VIII f.e. wanted to get more divorces than the Pope would have allowed, so there comes the church of England from.
Luther was unhappy and angry with religious politics of his time, that's where the sect of protestants come from.

So yes if you call those christans, catholics are not. And that's a good thing. Especially with the American tv priests in mind which are basically just snake oil salesmen.

Hilarious

a reply to: coomba98
You are confusing two different meanings of the word "love".
Your observation seems to be true about Romantic love, as Catullus complained in his poem "Odi et amo"-
"I hate and love
Perhaps you ask
How this can be

I know not, but
I feel it and
It tortures me [EXCRUCIOR]"

Ragggedyman is talking about Christian love, which in Greek is a completely different word.
He means AGAPE, you mean PHILOTIME.