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originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: sirlancelot
Funny how you start out talking about making legal immigration easier, then start talking about how bad illegal immigration is. If the borders were open there would be no such thing as illegal immigrants.
originally posted by: sirlancelot
originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: sirlancelot
Funny how you start out talking about making legal immigration easier, then start talking about how bad illegal immigration is. If the borders were open there would be no such thing as illegal immigrants.
Where in my post did I mention making Illegal immigration easier? I illustrated that is Gary Johnson's position which I oppose! Perhaps you may want to re read.
originally posted by: TonyS
a reply to: sirlancelot
Well, even if by some unforseen miracle Trump were to win, which I don't see happening, nothing will change; he'll talk a lot about closing the borders, but its all just talk. Closing the border with Mexico for example, is 1) impossible and 2) would stop only a small percentage of the illegal entries. The far bigger problem is the people who enter legally, like on an H-1B visa, a student visa, or even a tourist visa and then over stay the visa without leaving the country. Nothing can or will be done about that because Homeland (parent company of the Border Patrol) doesn't track the visa traffic.
originally posted by: conspiracy nut
Eventually the entire planet will be open borders, countries are just lines in the sand created because of our primitive tribal instincts. I would love open borders and would love a home on the Mexican or French Riviera
originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus
originally posted by: sirlancelot
Considering the average illegal immigrant crossing the southern border has at best a 10 grade education so basically we are looking at people willing to work farm and service jobs at very little wage. Wages so low they probably wouldn't pay much in federal or state income tax. Wages so low they still would most likely need some sort of of government assistance! So if it cost more per worker then their tax earns we are paying for them to be here at the expense of many other important issue's those tax dollars could be used for.
Not every person that wishes to emigrate to the United States is uneducated or will be working a low paying job.
originally posted by: everyone
But most are and that is the reality of it. Most want to come over to solve their financial situations because of that fact. So being able to say that not all of them are and trying to use that as a argument for completely open borders is a cop out and completely ignoring the actual facts and their actual consequences.
originally posted by: jellyrev
a reply to: John_Rodger_Cornman
If they were smart enough everyone would be libertarians right now. It is not some underground movement anymore.
The facts are easy to find, countries with the highest economic freedom especially in the private property rights index are the richest.
Like I said. Education and free flow of information is the key. Libertarians are not against private property.
People vote for their interest. Goverment workers are not going to buy losing their funding and jobs. People are intellectually lazy.
Which is why libertarianism is a good for all people. Government workers are going to agree to a pay raise by eliminating income taxes. Small businesses are going to be for removing the IRS(and the overhead costs)and corporate taxes so they can hire more people and make more money.
Listen I want libertarianism to work, my real world experience disagrees. I can get a lot more convincing done using irrational social dynamics than reason.
The United States was founded by classical liberals(right libertarian). That is a example.
The reason bearing ron paul has nothing on the social dynamics master donald trump.
originally posted by: jellyrev
a reply to: John_Rodger_Cornman
I discriminate based on culture. Cultures can be studied and their outcomes measured. I am not going to push any existing cultures out of the US but I can prevent other cultures from coming in. Not to mention the negative effects of multiculturalism/balkanization. Watching civic culture fall apart is quite the sight.
Discriminating based on religion is unconstitutional. Background checks(for a travel visa) and monitoring of people from a country or countries based on facts(harboring terrorists,rogue state,country we are at war with) are ok.
S. Korea and Japan are rational actors, nukes would provide counterbalance to china.
Think about what your saying. This will cause a nuclear war.
How many times will we commit amnesty? been there done this many times. Nothing solved. pathetic. I don't blame immigrants, but the government has an obligation to its citizens not to its aliens.
Is it moral to depress wages?We are competing against third world sweat shop labor and automation. We have two choices. Provide a better service/set of skills or be left behind is it moral to mass import h1b's fire the native workforce but have them train their replacements first? Is is moral to bring in millions of workers when millions of native workers sit idle. Companies used to train people. Now they only hire experienced older workers and non-natives and in the same breath blame young people for having no skills. And no this is not my story, but I see the company I work for not want to put in the time to train anyone even at the low skill jobs.
Because its cheaper for them to do so.The extremely high corporate taxes doesn't help either. Economics is immoral,predatory and exploitative. Always has been.