Negative Outcome in Referendums w.r.t. expand EU to Ukraine express people's concerns of WWIII

The Peace of God to all that belong to the Light,
Dear Readers,

There have been a lot of reactions in western Europe to the Negative outcome of the Dutch referendum rejecting a
free trade agreement including Ukraine.

Of course Mr. Jean-Claude Juncker, the president of the EU's executive
Commission is shocked with a result that defy all his authority and multiple menaces launched a long the last weeks
to try to intimidate the voters.

The situation is right now pretty clear, the common people have realized how irresponsible and dangerous is the
political bargaining that a so poor leadership on the EU has brought so insensate projects like the expansion of their
sphere of influence to an area that never in History has been part of it, just to satisfy uncontrolled so ambitious
economic interests that don't care at all of the risk of to have a military confrontation with Russia.

Please check:
www.foxnews.com...

Even Ukrainians today have understood that they never going to be able to join EU without pushing their nation to
a complete disaster, and the way Dutch people voted this week ( 61% against the Free Trade pact in between
EU and Ukraine) is a clear red flag.

Pls check:
Dutch people voted NO by landslide against EU pact with Ukraine

People in Kiev and other major cities of Ukraine are starting to demand the resignation of a government that has boosted
an unnecessary crisis of never before seen characteristics in that nation. They are extremely angry and upset with
the puppet President Petro Poroshenko, a decadent multimillionaire that only wants to profit of the crisis he himself
has helped to create.

Associated Press April 7th 2016:
"This is a blow to the basic and loudest promises made by Poroshenko, who promised a visa-free regime with the EU

There is no way at all that this selfish, insane, and Machiavellian policy boosted from Berlin of gradual expansion of European
influence on countries that historically were only linked with them through the means of terrible wars like WWI and WWII get
any success.

Chancellor Angela Merkel is absolutely deceived by her own mirage of false expectations if she really expects that there is a way to go head
around what the European citizens really think about her corrupt rule, based on all these series of plots , including coup d'etaits backed up
in a so dirty way, political elections that were smartly manipulated from the exterior, and civil wars that are also maliciously
sponsored to destroy the life of millions of innocents to draw new artificial borders across territories that were in peace only less than
5 years ago.

People is not stupid, politicians have underestimated their ability to take their own decisions. The average citizen in Europe knows perfectly
that to try to move to the East is to collide with Russia, a nation that has a formidable nuclear arsenal, ready to be used if there is enough provocation.

Europeans have enough cumulated scope along generations that have suffered different devastating wars in the past to see a huge risk and be able to weight it in its correct dimension. To annex Ukraine is not the same than to try to invade a small country like Syria or Iraq and think that there is something positive to gain in such a plan.

Europeans have seen along the last year terrible tragedies brought to their own major cities, Paris and Brussels, caused in great part by irresponsible policies carried out by their own leaders in much smaller conflicts of middle east than what Ukrainian Civil war can be if Russia decides to openly enter on it with all the capability of its own arm forces.

The delusion boosted from Berlin and from this side of the Atlantic is not going to prosper in the so easy way it was calculated by the powerful economic interests that are in behind it, Merkel and her allies in Wall Street and in Washington will no see achieved what Napoleon and Hitler were unable to reach, that is absolutely clear.

The Thread is open of course to the free discussion of the Topic, please remain in topic and reply at most respecting the rules of decorum
in the communication.

Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness

I think the E.U is a dead duck to be honest and many people throughout Europe either want out of the the Union, or at the very least to put an end to the expansion.

The way things are going here n the U.K with the latest scandal relating to Call me Dave's offshore investments, he is making a lot of people angry and I am sure many who are on the fence currently will join the out campaign, particularly if it continues to be led by a person/s who can't help but lie.

If the E.U does break up, I am certain that the elite will take their revenge in some form. Will that be a war in Europe? Who can honestly say? I wouldn't like to think it would lead to that, but if the E.U is the only reason there has not been one since the 1940's, then that alone speaks volumes about how delicate it all is, despite all the talk of unity.

a reply to: Cobaltic1978

Well, Dutch people has read very well the facts of the Panama papers scandal, they have seen the real face of this crisis, that is the game of the powerful politicians playing a Machiavellian chess game with the life of millions, when under the table they are even investing their money in the same banks, like it was found this week when ironically the world have known that the Presidents of Ukraine and Russia have their personal funding in the same financial institutions.

latino.foxnews.com...

So it is clear that the Great Capital, the bankers are the only ones that are winning with all these political conspiracies.

Now, we are going to see if the voters here in America this month of April are going to understand the so clear message that their partners in Netherlands have sent to them, to vote NO to the people that have pushed the world to the present crisis of terrible international instability since WWII ended.

Angela Merkel has received a terrible bad news this week, we are going to see if her principal Associate in this country, her partner Hillary Clinton, also will be surprised by the way New York electors will vote in the Primary she is absolutely convinced that she is going to win.

Former State Secretary Hillary Clinton is the worst choice by far to pick up for whoever is concerned with the world peace, she was in behind the coup d'états in Kiev that caused this crisis, as well as the US support to all the fundamentalist revolutions in North Africa that opened the path that now ISIS is happily using to smash western countries.

There is something Clinton has forgotten: New York was New Holland before to have such a name, and the day of the primaries chances are that the voters remember that very well.

Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness

a reply to: The angel of light

Frisian freedom prevails, great news indeed.

Merkel and her allies in Wall Street and in Washington will no see achieved what Napoleon and Hitler were unable to reach, that is absolutely clear.

Now or not? I'll go with not, the Europeans won't fight the oligarchs wet dream of a WW3. Don't think so.

a reply to: The angel of light

62% of Ukrainians want to join the EU. Moscow times
And the rest of your OP is equally wrong. Nobody in Europe wants war.

originally posted by: The angel of light
Of course Mr. Jean-Claude Juncker, the president of the EU's executive Commission is shocked with a result that defy all his authority and multiple menaces launched a long the last weeks to try to intimidate the voters.

He's disappointed, but he's far from shocked. This is not the first time the European plan has experienced difficulties and it wont be the last.
And his "attempts to intimidate voters"... care to elaborate on that with any ACTUAL reality?

originally posted by: The angel of light
Even Ukrainians today have understood that they never going to be able to join EU without pushing their nation to
a complete disaster

What utter and complete drivel.
If I didn't know you were a staunch Putin propagandist before I certainly do now.
Ukraine has repeatedly wanted closer ties to the EU, because it knows it wants partners, it knows it needs support from other states, and the Ukrainian people do not want to side closer to Russia.
Of course, you would reject this despite the fact that the government there was overthrown by the people for this very reason.

originally posted by: The angel of light
People in Kiev and other major cities of Ukraine are starting to demand the resignation of a government that has boosted
an unnecessary crisis of never before seen characteristics in that nation.

No, some people are demanding the resignation of the government in the same way some people in every nation on Earth demands the same thing of theirs. This is meaningless.

originally posted by: The angel of light
There is no way at all that this selfish, insane, and Machiavellian policy boosted from Berlin of gradual expansion of European influence on countries that historically were only linked with them through the means of terrible wars like WWI and WWII get any success.

The European project came about because of WW2, indeed. But you fail to grasp the fact that it has been a success in that regard. The entire point of economic and political involvement with each other was DESIGNED to prevent another catastrophic war, making it unfeasible for any potential combatant nation.

The European community has achieved what it planned to achieve. Europe is safer now and more peaceful now than it ever has been in the past, and that's because of the European interconnectedness we now have.

You stalwarts of regression and backward politics will not win. States will continue to enjoy the benefits of our European partnership no matter how much you scream and rant about how awful it supposedly is. The people of Europe know better than you.

I voted against the treaty and I am pleased to see the anti EU movement growing.

The treaty itself was being sold as a "trade agreement" and for "human rights", but when you read the actual thing it is clearly all about getting the Ukraine prepped for a future EU membership and it even includes military cooperation.


And as far as I know there is such a thing as Veto-power in the EU, so technically, if our government decides not to ratify it, they could stop this treaty from happening. At least that's the rules.

a reply to: DutchMasterChief

May I ask why you're against a Ukrainian membership?

a reply to: Rocker2013

European Commission chief Jean-Claude Juncker urged Dutch voters today (9 January) not to oppose the EU association agreement with Ukraine, saying such a move “could open the doors to a continental crisis”.

Juncker warns Dutch voters over major consequence of Ukraine referendum

Intimidating - check. Consider Europeans easily intimidated if ya like, especially with regards to Dick Cheney Juncker.

No, some people are demanding the resignation of the government in the same way some people in every nation on Earth demands the same thing of theirs. This is meaningless.

Ukraines "democracy" is pretty fragile, with the army on the streets eager to prevent a second coup. Just saying, google "Ukraine on her knees" to get a feeling on why offshore Richie Poroshenko struggles with some difficulties.

You stalwarts of regression and backward politics will not win. States will continue to enjoy the benefits of our European partnership no matter how much you scream and rant about how awful it supposedly is. The people of Europe know better than you.

Some states may profit in the short term, sure. And what about the people in southern Europe? Anti-EU resentments are a reality and part of our culture, but that doesn't imply we Europeans didn't form at least some melting-pots over the last decades.

Growing anti-bureaucracy sentiments regarding Brüssels idiotic is no new bendy banana law story either. Europe will be better off if we would see a real partnership between all members states, but some (mainly Germany's politicians) still have to learn that lesson the hard way I guess. Just look at Greece and how Realpolitics actually ignored their referendum completely.

Yes, we Europeans know better...

Jean-Claude Juncker is the worst thing that happened to the EU, then Angela Merkel and finally Mario Dragi..

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: DutchMasterChief

May I ask why you're against a Ukrainian membership?

Would you want millions of Ukrainians moving to your nation, same as the millions of piss poor Eastern EU nationals have done so already...with absolutely no sovereign government control over who enters the country?

If so, may I ask you why?

a reply to: Substracto

Don't underestimate Victator Orban, Monetario Rajoy or James Bondage Camera-on either. Fricken Dicksyland...

a reply to: PublicOpinion

What do you think of Poland at the moment? They are going the opposite way, just like Hungary is.

a reply to: Peeple

Yes, because I am against the EU and EU expansion in general, the country is corrupt as hell, possibly another Greece financially, and I am not going to support elitist world domination plans.

I've seen enough to know that in the end, we end up paying the bill.

Firstly, well done the Dutch!!! Not only for kicking the EU in the balls, but for getting the referendum in the first place. I really like the idea that if you get 300k signatures, it triggers a referendum.

I don't think it would work so well in the UK because we would get a referendum every week with the massive facebook/twitter herds who will sign anything without actually thinking (Donald Trump ban for example).


Now the Dutch has voted a resounding No and the 300k vote threshold was achieved, this will become a seriously situation for the EU. I personally think they will try to bribe/blackmail your leaders, and if that doesn't work I have read that they may exclude the Netherlands from the EU/Ukraine deal altogether.

If the Dutch people continue to have referendums on other EU deals and vote No, then eventually the EU may even get so fed up and kick the Netherlands out (or change their leader like in Italy and Greece was it?). That's not if the EU hasn't already collapsed after Brexit of course.

a reply to: Substracto

How was his name again? I'll find something equally legitimised, promise!

This refugee-'crisis' just nailed it, the FN is growing strong in France as well and anti-EU resentments are widespread. We'll see how people react if those folks mis-lead them equally bad, but there's a lot of silent protest in those election results as well. I don't like this development at all, but their votes stirred up a lot of fuzz and that's precisely what we need imho.

All for one or everyone for themselves, we can't have both. Can we?

The EU is a cancer on the European continent. The sooner the failed experiment comes to it's inevitable end the better if you ask me. The orchestrated coup in Ukraine that brought Poroshenko to power was just one of many nails in its coffin.

a reply to: PublicOpinion

Beata Szydło of Law and Justice party, I think.



I agree with you, things are being stirred up, the solutions however lack "balls" if you know what I mean.


Indeed we can't, and we know how the UE doesn't respect national sovereignty either.

a reply to: Substracto

Ahja. Beatabortion Szydlo from the PiS_sed party, yeah... the non-excommunicated one. Szyssypussie respects catholic pressure, no offense ladies! I'm pretty religious myself.

a reply to: Peeple

Really?

Let me post this that is coming from the own About US page of The Moscow Times, the Press that you are using to base your fantastic claim that suddenly, after more than 1000 years of common History, Ukrainians have discovered that they are not Slavic after all, but central or western European, and of course of the most pure Germanic or French linage!

Q: What is The Moscow Times?
A: The Moscow Times is the only English-language weekly published in Russia. Our mission statement is to provide foreigners and internationally oriented Russians with balanced, well-researched journalism and practical information that helps them understand Russia.

Originally the newspaper was created for foreigners living and working in Moscow, but in recent years it has attracted a Russian readership as well.

You have the cynicism to bring "information" from a propaganda magazine sponsored from Wall street and from Berlin to be published with the mission of to spread misinformation in Eastern Europe and think we are going to eat such a imaginary numbers of support?

The USSR was ruled the major part of its History by Ukrainian ethnical leaders ( N. Khrushchev, N.Podgorny, L.Brezhnev, N. Tikhonov, N. Ryzhkov, M.Gorbachev) and now you are claiming that Russia is trying to suffocate a so old Nationalism?

Please History can't be rewritten in modern times, that strategy does not work now at all, perhaps in medieval ones it was feasible.


Thanks,

The Angel of Lightness