What is knowledge?

Nothing is happening!!

To be or not to be?
Are 'you' or are 'you' not?

Can I ask you a question?

Does pride or shame factor into your functioning i.e. how you approach a situation? Do you find yourself reflexively evaluating other people, as happens in all other human beings?

If shame arises, do you compensate for it? Do you even recognize it when it occurs? Do you know by which criteria shame could be described?

When it comes to human functioning and human well being, knowledge is necessary. We are far too curious a species to recede from the cognitive and the rational. Therefore, we need to think and so 'constrain' reality in such a way that we learn to live more kindly and meaningfully with one another and the world around us.

If you cannot know what you feel, its due to a lack of motivation to know. Some belief or some other cognitive structure might prevent the orientation of the self to look, but I believe if the self doesn't look, he is acting selfishly, carelessly and arrogantly. To be human means we are part of something larger than ourselves. But this 'larger than ourselves', fundamentally means "with others do we find our meanings". Life is meaningful because its evolved with others like us. The 'other' cannot and should never be ignored lest we live and act in ways that cause suffering i.e. shame, worthlessness, a feeling of not being cared for: all basically feelings of 'not being recognized by the other'.

When people live too much in their head and too much in their own bizarre theories of things, they distance themselves from others; people begin to not like them, and they, feeling shame, but not acknowledging it, renounces the need for others and so pursues a pointless quest of meaning without then need for others; on the other hand, its a human instinct to posit an other, and even thinking and interfacing with a particular idea - such as the "now", or nothing - constitutes a sort of relationship between your self and your meaning system.

In the end, its just unfortunate that such a person couldn't extend their self towards the very means: other humans, and relate to them with love and kindness and a sense of common beingness.

a reply to: Astrocyte


Knowledge is the moment when you realize you have none.

www.youtube.com...

The sum of mankind's existance,in a word.

originally posted by: Itisnowagain

originally posted by: namelesss
Not according to my definition of Knowledge!
That says that every moment of Universal existence is a unique moment of Knowledge!
There is only One Knower, the One Universal Consciousness/Mind!
The One Knower peeks from ALL 'eyes'!

How many 'moments' are there? Are there any 'moments' at all?
A 'moment' is a 'thing'.

A 'moment' is;
Planck moment; 10^-43/sec; "almost" one billion trillion trillion trillionths of a second!!!
Too 'small' for any 'temporality'!
A 'Planck moment' is a single unit of 'perception', a 'percept'.
How many moments exist?
All of them!!
That number would be as 'close to infinite' as we can ever get!

What if there is only ever what is happening?
What is happening is not a thing - it is 'being' all there is.

Where do all the '-ing' words go, in a Reality that is absolutely UNCHANGING! EVER!
There can be no knowledge/experience/perception of existence/Reality without 'we' unique Conscious Perspectives (Souls)!

If there is Knowing, and there is, there must be that which is known, that which can be known, and that is everything!
It takes a unique individual limited Perspective (Soul) to perceive/know anything!
Without 'us', not anything can be perceived/known (quantum mechanics)!

'Knowing' is an action - it is a happening.

I guess that I can imagine that the mere act of perception can be called, loosely (and sloppily) an 'action', and a 'happening'.
All existence 'happens'. All 'perception' 'happens'.

If 'knowing' is split/divided/fragmented into 'knower' and 'known' then that is when the illusion of 'things' begins.

All that happy crappy exists in/as 'thought/imagination/ego, wherein ALL 'duality' exists!
To know an apple, perhaps, merely requites the experience of eating one, 'becoming one with it'!
All the thoughts go around in the dualism of "what is it?" 'What is it not?" (All 'identity' is imagination/ego/duality!) Tall, not short?
Etc..., not etc...! *__-
To perceive 'thought' is to experience/Know 'thought', just like everything else!
'Duality' exists that Knowledge might exist!
Everything exists!

'Things' need time and space to exist but there is no time or space - there is simply what is happening.

EVERYTHING is 'perceived'!
It is all a beautiful nightmare!
'Make-believe'!
To 'believe' it (especially the expedient duality of thought/feelings (feelings are thoughts)), is insanity!
Which also exists! *__-

a reply to: namelesss
Life cannot be split into moments - only thought divides that which is whole.
Watch closely now and see if you can see the dividing line.

A 'Planck moment' is a single unit of 'perception', a 'percept'.

Have you ever noticed a on and off?
Perceiving does not stop and start - it is the one constant.

originally posted by: Astrocyte
Can I ask you a question?

Does pride or shame factor into your functioning i.e. how you approach a situation? Do you find yourself reflexively evaluating other people, as happens in all other human beings?

I do not approach a situation - that makes two - me and a situation. If there is a 'me' and a 'situation' appearing in mind prior to an event then what has happened is that there are two things in mind that have to work together - well, the event does not exist, it is not really happening and is only a projection of mind and the person appearing in mind does not exist (it too is a projection of mind). Shame and guilt are the result of believing the projections of mind. Have you noticed that even if you plan to not say certain things to certain people or say that you won't do a particular thing in the future and then you do there is guilt or shame? It is like there is someone in there (head) telling you how to behave and when the event actually happens you fail and are judged by that 'someone in there'.
Who is judging who?
Life is happening but if it happens that there is an imagination of an event that is not actually happening (only mind projection) the body will be anxious. The fear drives one to prepare life prior to it's actuality - but in doing so the mind takes life to where there isn't life. Life is what is happening.
It is impossible to do the future now. It is impossible to do the past now.
If the mind is trying to control the future, when the event is actually happening - you will be doing it from a script - where is the life in that?
If one is never separate from what is happening there is a responding to what is - not a 'oh no this should not be happening' happening.

originally posted by: Astrocyte
When it comes to human functioning and human well being, knowledge is necessary. We are far too curious a species to recede from the cognitive and the rational. Therefore, we need to think and so 'constrain' reality in such a way that we learn to live more kindly and meaningfully with one another and the world around us.

If you are with what is present you will be kind. It is when you are with the past or future that unkindness happens. The only thing the past and future are used for is to secure yourself - to make you safe. You don't want guilt and shame so you try to avoid it by being nice. Or you want to get some thing - if you did not require some thing then you don't have to be any thing in particular.

If you cannot know what you feel, its due to a lack of motivation to know. Some belief or some other cognitive structure might prevent the orientation of the self to look, but I believe if the self doesn't look, he is acting selfishly, carelessly and arrogantly.

Feelings arise and pass but they only stick if there is 'someone in there' evaluating them and not wanting them - then they can become a problem for the mind to solve. The mind loves to solve problems - The problem of 'how do i get away from this feeling?' is denying life itself. The feeling is life - it is what is happening.
The mind does not want this feeling so comes up with strategies to avoid feelings - it speaks about how in the future it can avoid shame or guilt.
It may seem as if the road ahead is paved with shame and guilt because the mind is obsessed with avoiding it.
But life is what is actually happening right here and now - life is not happening in the past or future.

When people live too much in their head and too much in their own bizarre theories of things, they distance themselves from others; people begin to not like them, and they, feeling shame, but not acknowledging it, renounces the need for others and so pursues a pointless quest of meaning without then need for others; on the other hand, its a human instinct to posit an other, and even thinking and interfacing with a particular idea - such as the "now", or nothing - constitutes a sort of relationship between your self and your meaning system.

Because there is a disconnect from life (which is what is happening) there is a need to connect to people. The belief is that if I can connect to people to have good relationship then i will feel better. The feeling of disconnection is what is happening - it is closer than close. There is no one who has to connect - the idea that there is someone who should be connected to some thing is the issue - there is only ever what is happening - it is already complete - whole.

The separate person you think you are is the one who lives in the head in projections of past and future that is trying to save himself from whatever (shame and guilt etc.) - it is not real.
Feeling happen and words arise.
All is moving in that which never moves.

It is the recognition of That which never moves which brings a peace that surpasses all understanding.

a reply to: namelesss

Yet, a different perception or accepted knowledge/truth may be experienced in becoming one with the apple while using psychaedelics. This new found knowledge of the apple could not be considered a reality/truth to those not experiencing it in the same way. Could the same be said for perceptions/experiences being swayed by emotions, bigotry, lack of imagination (scientists), etc.?

originally posted by: InTheLight
a reply to: namelesss

Yet, a different perception or accepted knowledge/truth may be experienced in becoming one with the apple while using psychaedelics. This new found knowledge of the apple could not be considered a reality/truth to those not experiencing it in the same way. Could the same be said for perceptions/experiences being swayed by emotions, bigotry, lack of imagination (scientists), etc.?

As we experience/Know anything, so we also experience/perceive 'emotions'.
'Feelings' are 'thoughts'.
'Emotions' are the physical manifestation of 'feelings'.
Not anything 'affects' Perspective!
We perceive the sun, and the moon, and thoughts and dreams and feelings and rocks... all that exists is perceived!

We can observe vehement egoic arguments over who's correct, when one person perceives and describes the Heads of the coin, and the other the Tails!
Due to their lack of Perspective (ignorance) they argue over who's 'right' and that they must be different coins!
And another Perspective must be 'wrong'!
Man is NOT a 'rational, logical' creature!

"Nothing is easier than self-deceit. For what each man wishes, that he also believes to be true." - Demosthenes

tat tvam asi (en.wikipedia.org...)

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: namelesss
Life cannot be split into moments - only thought divides that which is whole.

'Life' exists in, and is experienced/known in 'thought'!
Thought exists.
Everything exists!
Moments exist.

A 'Planck moment' is a single unit of 'perception', a 'percept'.

Have you ever noticed a on and off?

What? Serious? You expect to perceive Planck timelessness?
Reality is perceived in quantum moments!
By the time you can even think about 'the moment experienced', it is LONG water under the bridge.
And the new moment presents your 'thought.
It might all be a dream, and it is, but it all exists and is Reality!

Perceiving does not stop and start - it is the one constant.

Do some reading on quantum.
There is no 'smooth flow of 'time', no swooping moving 'arrow'.
That is all obsolete theory!
Quantum, discrete packets, is how Reality is Known, how it is perceived!

(T)Here is One (UNCHANGING, ALL inclusive) Universal Reality!
Here! Now!

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
Nothing is happening!!

That which is not, cannot be 'happening'!
Only 'things' exist!
Every'thing' exists!
There is no no'thing' to not exist or ever 'happen'!

originally posted by: namelesss

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
Nothing is happening!!

That which is not, cannot be 'happening'!
Only 'things' exist!
Every'thing' exists!
There is no no'thing' to not exist or ever 'happen'!

If there is not two then there cannot be things.
This that IS does not consist of more than one.
All there is is this.
This is constantly appearing different but it is never not this.
This is not a thing but is all there is (everything).

Things require time and space to exist and there is only ever what is happening - which is this - timeless being.

However - if 'you' have believed yourself to be a thing then there will no doubt be a whole world of other things conquered up and lots of things for you to do as well!

a reply to: namelesss
Without mind doing the naming how can there be some 'thing' happening?
Is your name 'nameless'? Or is it unspeakable like the Tao?

The tao that can be told
is not the eternal Tao
The name that can be named
is not the eternal Name.

The unnamable is the eternally real.
Naming is the origin
of all particular things.

Free from desire, you realize the mystery.
Caught in desire, you see only the manifestations.

Yet mystery and manifestations
arise from the same source.
This source is called darkness.

Darkness within darkness.
The gateway to all understanding.

originally posted by: Itisnowagain

originally posted by: namelesss

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
Nothing is happening!!

That which is not, cannot be 'happening'!
Only 'things' exist!
Every'thing' exists!
There is no no'thing' to not exist or ever 'happen'!

If there is not two then there cannot be things.

EXACTLY!!!
That is what ego does, it makes 'two' that 'Self!' can be Known!
Unless the 'glass' possesses nasty little inclusions; crazing, bugs, dust on the surface.... it remains unknowable, invisible!
'Thought/imagination' is that 'imaginary' dust that makes it all Knowable!
It might all be exactly 'make-believe' because we know that the apparent duality of the ego/imagination is just the 'fairy dust' that allows the Universe to become 'Self Aware', to Know OurSelf!
Of course, to 'believe' it is insanity! *__-

So yes, there are 'things' and, no there aren't!

"All statements are true in some sense, false in some sense, meaningless in some sense, true and false in some sense, true and meaningless in some sense, false and meaningless in some sense, and true and false and meaningless in some sense." -Robert Anton Wilson

Every Perspective is unique every moment!

"For every Perspective, there is an equal and opposite Perspective!" - The First Law of Soul Dynamics (Book of Fudd)

"The complete Universe (Reality/Truth/God/'Self!'/Tao/Brahman... or any feature herein...) can be completely defined/described as the synchronous sum-total of all Perspectives!" - Book of Fudd
ALL INCLUSIVE!!!

This that IS does not consist of more than one.

I love the 'Enlightenment Jargon' (tm)! *__-
Oddly enough, the words that you are using, the thoughts that produce, them are all duality, all isolable that they may be known!
To even speak you have to descend from the Mountain!
And, again oddly, there seems to exist that 'place' to which we can descend in which we can converse like this, with all these imaginary dualistic, definable, limited... words!

All there is is this.

Uh, huh...
I must have said eleventy-seven times, even here, that all that exists is Here! Now!
There is no way that you can ever exhibit the Oneness of which you speak and claim, while talking about it! *__-

Things require time and space to exist and there is only ever what is happening - which is this - timeless being.

Duuuude, you're preaching to the choir!
What are you doing?

However - if 'you' have believed yourself to be a thing then there will no doubt be a whole world of other things conquered up and lots of things for you to do as well!

Now I'm starting to feel the need for a shower!
YOU have a driver's license?
YOU have a social security card (or your country's version)?
Are there any checks with YOUR name that you cash, in your day to day doings all over the place, by having to prove your identity?
Your life belies your loverly New Age Enlightened (tm) words!
That's what I meant by having to descend the Mountain!
To do so, there must be a place to 'go' in existence!


Reality is ALL inclusive!

originally posted by: Itisnowagain
a reply to: namelesss
Without mind doing the naming how can there be some 'thing' happening?
Is your name 'nameless'? Or is it unspeakable like the Tao?

The unspeakable Name is ALL names (ALL Names are Our Names!) spoken together, Here! Now!

The tao that can be told
is not the eternal Tao
The name that can be named
is not the eternal Name.

The unnamable is the eternally real.
Naming is the origin
of all particular things.

Free from desire, you realize the mystery.
Caught in desire, you see only the manifestations.

Yet mystery and manifestations
arise from the same source.
This source is called darkness.

Darkness within darkness.
The gateway to all understanding.

The Tao that can be told... Is EXACTLY the eternal Tao!!!
If all is One, if God is Omni-, my enlightened friend, then all must be the Eternal Tao (tm)!!
All must be God!
Here! Now!
There can be no 'other'!

Am I correct in thinking that he who uttered that the Eternal Tao cannot be uttered (as if there are/is 'temporary Tao'!), 'uttered' the 'Book of Tao'? *__-

a reply to: Itisnowagain

there appears to be something to be known.

there is nothing to know - there is just knowing.

And yet here you are again dipping your toes into separateness. It must be fun to play with words and not really say anything

a reply to: Astrocyte

Quite simply knowledge is power and gives a distinct advantage over others who do not possess the same.

a reply to: Astrocyte

Very wonderful and interesting post. Good Job! Thank you!

To answer your question "What is Knowledge?":

In my opinion, knowledge as we know it and as we experience every day is an Illusion that blinds us to the real Knowledge. We are under the impression that we gain knowledge by informing ourselves, but in reality we are only increasing our opinions and perceptions.
Knowledge that is gained by using our senses, by seeing, hearing, smelling, tasting and touching is based on perception and opinion. Can we really trust our eyes and ears? What we perceive to be real is just our opinion of reality and it definitely differs from millions of other peoples. The information/data we receive and perceive daily adds to the pool of knowledge, but it is only an extension of our perception of our reality and it may not be real at all. Therefore, in my opinion, knowledge is just an illusion.

originally posted by: TheConstruKctionofLight
a reply to: Itisnowagain

there appears to be something to be known.

there is nothing to know - there is just knowing.

And yet here you are again dipping your toes into separateness. It must be fun to play with words and not really say anything

'I' cannot dip my toes into separateness - there is nothing separate - therefore there is no me to dip anything into anything.
Words are just appearing - 'I' say nothing.
'I' is just a word that appears.
Knowing is happening but there is no thing to be known.