"Vanilla ISIS"

originally posted by: Nyiah
a reply to: diggindirt

Well, they're not standing up for squat. They are emulating the government like a boss, shoving their unwanted nose & opinions into a situation where the people it ACTUALLY effects, as well as their community, aren't giving them much beyond an eyeroll. And at this point, they're just armed squatters. Yeah, big heroes.

I'll continue to find the nicknames funny. Thanks for supporting people who do exactly what they don't want governments to do to them.

Here's the deal.

This is the continuation of the same grievance the Bundys had with the Feds. The Federal government via the BLM (Bureau of Land Management) tends to be a bad neighbor these days to whomever its lands happen to butt up against.

The Hammonds are only the latest case of abuse being sent to serve a double jeopardy sentence by the Federal government.

Now, what the group is doing is illegal, yes. But you know what? So was every single one of MLK's protests, but I'll bet none of you who dislike this one would disagree with what MLK did even though his protests were just as illegal.

What this group has done is peacefully occupy a facility linked to the very group they are protesting - the BLM. This is pretty much EXACTLY the tactic that MLK used to use, and all of you think he is a hero. I think some of you even thought BLM (Black Lives Matter) were heroic for shutting down Mall of America even though they were NOT directly protesting the government entity they had their beef with in any way, but I'm pretty sure those of you who supported their actions did so because they were peaceful about it.

So I guess I have to ask ... do none of you see the hypocrisy here?

a reply to: ketsuko

oregonlive.com

The ornate sign that used to greet visitors with "Welcome To Your National Wildlife Refuge" now advertises the headquarters of the "Harney County Resource Center" in white block letters over a blue background.

The group's leaders say they plan to stay until local rancher Dwight Hammond Jr. and his son, Steven, are released from prison and the 187,000-acre refuge is divvied up among area residents to be used for livestock grazing and logging.

In other words, the wildlife refuge already belongs to the people, but the militia is demanding its turned into private land for grazing and logging... They've made it perfectly clear they want the same to happen to all National parks.

These people aren't defending anyone's rights... the leaders of the standoff are simply trying to demand a handout from the federal government, at the expense of American citizens national heritage.

a reply to: Subaeruginosa

And they are within their rights to protest and they are doing so peacefully and they are directly protesting the entity they have a grievance with.

What part of any of that do you not understand?

a reply to: ketsuko

They have no right to break into a federal building and steal federal vehicles. But if the local police attempted to arrest them for breaking the law, they've already made threats about what will happen... so its not exactly "peaceful", is it?

a reply to: Subaeruginosa

And if they shoot, then the situation changes and you can change your label then, but how many times has BLM chanted "Pigs in a blanket, fry 'em like bacon!"

Do you label them as terrorists?

I'm not saying they shouldn't face legal repercussions. MLK and crew absolutely did, but that doesn't change the fact that at the moment, this group is following their tactics to call attention to a very real grievance. You can't pick and choose which group you approve of based on what cause you like or not. At their base, both are currently engaged in similar things for similar reasons and the 1st Amendment gives them that right, even if they break laws doing it. In the end, they will have to face the music, but right now, they are calling attention to an abusive Federal government, and make no mistake, it IS abusive in how it manages its affairs with Western lands.

Well, they're certainly not organizing attacks.

Acts of violent terrorism are done by desperate people who believe violence is the only way to spread their message. People who have armies, UN status (governments), and lots of money don't resort to crudely made bombs and suicide shooting sprees.

So, that tells me that these guys aren't that desperate. They'd rather wait for someone to show up and escalate things into violence vs. instigating it themselves.

I rarely watch television news, but I read many sources of national, regional, and local news. I've not seen any support for what the OP accuses "the media" of. That said, I'm sure there's someone in the media harping on thusly. Rachel Maddow, perhaps.

As has been pointed out by at least one other poster, the "Y'all Q'aeda" and "Vanilla ISIS" memes originated on Twitter and are essentially taking the piss with a side of seriousness: many people do think that this would be covered and labeled very differently if the exact same actions had been undertaken by BLM protestors or Muslims. I think it's naive to believe that's untrue, but I think making that point with sarcasm and further dilution of the term "terrorism" is unhelpful to put it mildly.

It was also pointed out, rightfully so, that these are not, by any stretch, "locals". The actual locals have overwhelmingly said "we agree with your argument but not with your means, please leave peacefully."

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

Vanilla ISIS,

I thought this was going to be a joke, you know...

So what do you get when a white man joins ISIS?

Vanilla ISIS



Sorry, I couldn't help myself

originally posted by: MystikMushroom
Well, they're certainly not organizing attacks.

Acts of violent terrorism are done by desperate people who believe violence is the only way to spread their message. People who have armies, UN status (governments), and lots of money don't resort to crudely made bombs and suicide shooting sprees.

So, that tells me that these guys aren't that desperate. They'd rather wait for someone to show up and escalate things into violence vs. instigating it themselves.

I understand where you're coming from. I don't think they're being duplicitous, though. When the Pacific Patriot Network showed up, Bundy quite clearly said "We want the long guns put away." I think there's a mix going on here, but that the de facto leader of this effort genuinely wants to avoid violence.

a reply to: shinethelight

Vanilla ISIS was an actual term used to describe them By some Twitter users. I thought it was hilarious, frankly, but it was used to promote a narrative. It is what they are being called by the "twitterati", the social media who think they are an actual media, who represent no more than their own political self interests. Another one was "y'all queda", which I thought was pretty clever, but clearly racist in the exact way they would call it racist if it was used against any other group. The double standards are profound.

I am the last one who would call any sort of doom and gloom, but I cannot express anything more than we are truly living in Orwellian times. Bad is good. Good is bad. Pretty soon we'll be begging for the state to oppress us.

a reply to: MystikMushroom

Rosa Parks wasn't desperate. She was just tired of the abuse. She broke the law.

Ranchers are tired of the abuse. If it weren't for the Bundy family the majority of US citizens wouldn't be aware of these abuses.

Does it not make you uneasy (at the least) to see people serve their allotted time only to be told that it wasn't enough?

A letter from your friendly judge:
Dear Mr. Mushroom,
We have recalculated the fine you've already paid for your traffic violation. We are in receipt of your $200 but find, upon another look at your infraction that you will be required to submit another $2000 to the court upon receipt of this letter.
Always at your service,
THE JUDGE

a reply to: JohnnyElohim

Read their statements and hear their intentions. it's nothing like what people are leading us to believe. Some would rather prefer a Huffpo or Time article to tell them what to think.

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: Subaeruginosa

Are you scared because you've felt the wrath of these people? Or because you're told to be? They aren't threatening to harm innocents. They're practicing civil disobedience, not terrorism.

They are practicing civil disobedience with no official government interference and as the days and weeks go by, others who are not so enraptured with peaceful civil disobedience will be coming to 'help' in the cause. And so far, with no government intervention.
If not already, the crazies will be joining up and uncle sam knows it. Once the crazies take over, then is when the fun will begin.

So do I call Bundy and the gang terrorists? Oh no. I call them fools. This is going to blow up in their faces and the feds are just waiting waiting waiting.

a reply to: TerryMcGuire

I am unable to disagree with that. I can see this getting out of hand for all the wrong reasons. But it will be the propaganda, and not the cause or the people involved, that leads them to it.

originally posted by: TinfoilTP
Bravo, you forgot to mention the dirtiest label the Left brands their victims with, those people might be......Christian.

I guess the left needs to be a little more PC as not to offend any Christian or militias delicate feelings.

a reply to: TerryMcGuire
Apparently a bunch of yahoos showed up there today and were asked to leave.
From the pictures it appears some were armed with those scary assault rifles. They were politely turned away.
So they left to go talk with the government agencies.
They say they are there to de-escalate the situation. We'll have to see how that works out.

It's reported here: www.oregonlive.com...

And a bit more about the meet-up with the sheriff here: www.opb.org...

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

This is disgusting to me. All race aside, these are people peacefully standing up for what they believe. It may not be everyone's choice of standing up, but at least they have stepped outside of their comfort zone to stand for what they believe in, on their own volition. The world would be a better place if everyone did this in their own way.

Instead people are going to sit comfortably and mock a movement that doesn't even affect most. At least people won't recognize that it affects them. These folks are standing for all of this nation right now. The people vs the machine. I'm amazed at how many people blindly follow the machine.

No, these insults hurt the average American more than the folks on the blm lands. These insults enable the general population to demean the very freedoms we should stand for. What a terribly sad day.

Oh, and last I checked not a single person involved ever lined up innocent people and executed them, or kidnapped and forced into slavery young innocent girls. The atrocities carried out by ISIS and anyone else destroying humanity as foully as possible shouldn't even be associated with a peaceful group of people.

a reply to: woodsmom

These people believe their constitutional rights are being threatened by the very institutions that should be protecting them. The fact that people are siding with bureaucracy over real people is frightening; and worse, if everyday people fail to side with them, only extreme elements will.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

And they are right! All of our rights have been trampled on over these recent years and we have let it happen. It's extremely frightening that people have allowed themselves to be brainwashed enough to follow the official word. Unfortunately, if this is any indication, this only means that the bureaucracy has already won.

The most disgusting part is that people will continue to repeat these nonsensical insults to the detriment of the very freedom that so many Americans want back.

The likely hood of a black or "Muslim" fighting over grazing tax in Oregon is very low.

The fact is mostly white people are ranchers. Not all but most. No one wants to hear it but ever relationship has to work like normal ones do. So people on opposite sides of the spectrum should find a positive way of doing so.

A sit in protest in a remote state forest is different circumstance than looting and fighting that happened post
Michael Browns death.



I recently watched the video with that sheriff and did he do the right thing? No but at the point of the media and higher ups what is he suppose to do? Personally if I was him if let me sit there all winter. Who gives a crap? They wanna freeze there asses off than go ahead.

No one wants another Waco.

And the fact is there is power in numbers. White or black or Asian or Hispanics etc. they United and stand strong and they are getting respect. Will it change grazing laws I don't know. For some reason I think it's a double edged sword cause if it does than what will this teach us? Just act out for change?

After Ferguson and Baltimore and BLM funding and organization they got a lot done. Even prick New York cops chilled with messing with people.

We work against eachother than together.

The sad thing is not one person has stood up and said look those people(Oregon) also standing up against the man. No I seen the posts and the groups doing them. See the key to racial equality has been division. Divide and conquer. The answer to everything is seperation. It's working and what can I say this nation had slavery now its reaping what it sowed.

They are experiencing white privledge?


a reply to: LesMisanthrope