Islamic Immigration is Illegal in the US

originally posted by: awareness10

originally posted by: dragonridr
a reply to: peter vlar

Just because you wish it to be doesn't make it true. The US constotution applies to US citizens. All rights are granted through immigration laws meaning they can be changed. So do you fall under the french constitution if your not french? Don't be silly immigrants have no rights granted under the constitution but if you care to prove me wrong where in the constitution does it mention immigrants??

But what about this?

Obama Amnesty creates loophole for Illegal immigrants to Vote in Elections.

www.washingtontimes.com...

From your source:

“The president’s executive order gives immigrants the right to stay — immigrants who have been here for years, immigrants who have been working hard and whose labor we have needed,” Ms. Norton said. “

Rep. Stephen F. Lynch, Massachusetts Democrat, said he doubted illegal immigrants would risk running afoul of the law — which could get them deported — just to be an insignificant part of an election.

originally posted by: rexsblues

Or are you implying non radical Muslims don't follow the doctrine of their own religion?

Yes, they do not follow the same doctrine of others within their own religion. There are many different views of what is the correct doctrine too, just as in Christianity, Christians do not follow everything the bible tells them what to do or not do in some kind of single belief of that doctrine for every Christian. Why would feel Muslim is not the same?

originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: tony9802

I just wanted to say not to worry too much about the early starters in the thread, who say they are muslims and insist on distorting and derailing your thread which can become very irritating and frustrating.

Yes pointing out where the OP was wrong about Islam can be irritating. Did you notice when the Muslims said he was wrong he immediately said that part of their religion didn't apply? He knows next to nothing about Islam hell he claims to be raised a Catholic but never took time to even read the bible.

You have only pointed out your own ignorance. The fact that you disagree does not make you right.

What muslims said I was wrong and wehre did I say that part of the religion did not apply? Are you referring to the abrogated verses? Your not knowing what abrogated means does not change the facts.

I don't claim to be raised catholic, I was. And I have read the bible. You really need to stop making s&$t up or find someone else to obsess over. I don't mind intelligent discourse but you are engaging in anything but that.

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: Vroomfondel

Can you show where in the law it states that the government has the authority to deny immigration based on interpretation of religious beliefs or texts?

(29) Aliens with respect to whom the consular officer or the Attorney General knows or has reasonable ground to believe probably would, after entry, (A) engage in activities which would be prohibited by the laws of the United States relating to espionage, sabotage, public disorder, or in other activity subversive to the national security, (B) engage in any activity a purpose of which is the opposition to, or the control or overthrow of, the Government of the United States, by force, violence, or other unconstitutional means, or (C) join, affiliate with, or participate in the activities of any organization 54 Stat. 993. which is registered or required to be registered under section 7 of the 50 USC 786. Subversive Activities Control Act of 1950;

Islamic immigrants who would follow islam to the letter, which includes the violence. Islamic immigrants who would favor sharia law over US law. Islamic immigrants who would favor the Hadith, second only to the koran in determining jurisprudence for islam. For example, stoning adulterers to death is from the Hadith, but is not mentioned in the koran. Just a few quick examples for you to attack. I hope you come up with something more substantial this time...

a reply to: Vroomfondel

Where does is state that an immigration official can inquire as to what religion a potential immigrant follows and deny entry based upon that?

A lot of people are going to be really upset when it turns out there is no God.


Wonder what they will do then?

a reply to: RickinVa

...learn to be kind to others?

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: rexsblues

Or are you implying non radical Muslims don't follow the doctrine of their own religion?

Yes, they do not follow the same doctrine of others within their own religion. There are many different views of what is the correct doctrine too, just as in Christianity, Christians do not follow everything the bible tells them what to do or not do in some kind of single belief of that doctrine for every Christian. Why would feel Muslim is not the same?

Great job, you're right. But what is the point of continually and defensively comparing Islam to Christianity? I'm mean sure, oil and water are comparable right? ...they're both liquids.

a reply to: peter vlar

If it's a fact, it's not a not an ad hominem attack. You're calling for the exclusion of an entire religion from immigration to this country. That is xenophobic.

First, it is your opinion and nothing more. Second, I am not calling for anything. I am simply pointing out that according to US law islamic immigration can be determined illegal. THAT is the fact.

Just because a law was passed, doesn't mean that the way YOU and other fringe thinkers want to interpret it can be implemented if your personal interpretation violates others constitutional rights.

Congress, with full attention to the Constitution, created and passed that law. If you want to assert you know more about my education and knowledge than I do, you are welcome to look like a fool any time you like. If you want to assert that you know more about Constitutional law than congress, you are a fool with an agenda to heavy for your narrow shoulders to support.

Great.but we both know that you borrowed heavily from others work and provided no citations for that work That's plagiarizing. It's a violation of T&C

That is the third time you have accused me of T&C violations. Obviously the mods do not agree with you. Now to that you add the accusation of plagiarism. You are on dangerous ground. Three times you have accused me of this and not once have you shown me the text you are referring to. This law has existed since 1952. There is nothing new about it that has not been expressed before. Nothing. True credit would belong to the first person to make any given statement. I have read several texts regarding this legislation and the ideas and thoughts of people who agree with it. To expect me to not incorporate that information into my own dialogue is disingenuous.

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: Vroomfondel

Where does is state that an immigration official can inquire as to what religion a potential immigrant follows and deny entry based upon that?

I am not going to do your research for you. If you want to know if it says that somewhere in the body of that law, feel free to read it. Until then, please stay on topic.

a reply to: Vroomfondel


Lord help me...Really?

Here is your ideological ancestors fear mongering about the Catholic Church taking over the US Government through it's faithful immigrating while having allegiance to the church..

Ignorance is timeless..

That's the pope as a crocodile...



And these










Sure glad we kept those Catholics from immigrating!!!...Oh wait a minute...How did you sneak in??? And when do you plan to overthrow the US government???

originally posted by: Vroomfondel

I don't claim to be raised catholic, I was. And I have read the bible. .

originally posted by: rexsblues

Great job, you're right. But what is the point of continually and defensively comparing Islam to Christianity? I'm mean sure, oil and water are comparable right? ...they're both liquids.

I'm not comparing as much as saying all religions have different understanding and practice of doctrine. To suggest somehow Muslim faith is different in all Muslims believe the same is stupid, and that is what the OP is suggesting.

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: dragonridr

So you fall under the french constitution if your not french?

Yes; it's called "The Declaration of the Rights of Man and the Citizen" for a reason. This document has been incorporated, with some modifications, into the constitutions of the various republics ever since. The American Bill of Rights are intended to be universal. Obviously, one is required to be a citizen in order to vote or hold office, but everyone has the right to freedom of expression, the right to a fair trial, freedom from unnecessary searches and seizures, and so forth. Except for Indians and slaves, of course.

First the costitution defines a US citizen then it tells you what rights they have. NO WHERE DOES IT GRANT ANYTHING TO NON CITIZENS. However I might have missed something in law school so feel free to show me where it grants rights to non citizens

originally posted by: Vroomfondel

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: Vroomfondel

Where does is state that an immigration official can inquire as to what religion a potential immigrant follows and deny entry based upon that?

I am not going to do your research for you. If you want to know if it says that somewhere in the body of that law, feel free to read it. Until then, please stay on topic.

I have read it and it does not say that anywhere in section 212.

The section you are quoting would only apply to people in which the AG or the consular have specific information that would indicate the applicant poses a risk.

(29) Aliens with respect to whom the consular officer or the Attorney General knows or has reasonable ground to believe probably would, after entry, (A) engage in activities which would be prohibited by the laws of the United States relating to espionage, sabotage, public disorder, or in other activity subversive to the national security, (B) engage in any activity a purpose of which is the opposition to, or the control or overthrow of, the Government of the United States, by force, violence, or other unconstitutional means, or (C) join, affiliate with, or participate in the activities of any organization 54 Stat. 993. which is registered or required to be registered under section 7 of the 50 USC 786. Subversive Activities Control Act of 1950;

To deny them because they are part of a group (Islam) would mean that Muslims would have to be classified as an organization that is required to register under Section 7 of the Internal Security Act of 1950. Section seven is titled:
Registration and Annual Reports of Communist Organizations

Internal Security Act 1950

So either you have to be able to prove Islam is a communist subversive group, or you have to somehow have them added to the list of groups.

If you have them added to the group, that would require all people in the US, not just visa applicants, connected to Islam to register with the US government. That is a clear violation of the first amendment freedom of religion.

But I think we can put this to rest because Section 7 only applies to communists.

a reply to: Indigo5

So what? lets just sit back and let it all happen?

a reply to: DJW001

Taqiyya.

You simply can not trust people whose ideology not only allows Muslims to decieve and lie to to non-believers, it encourages it as as their duty, in order to protect or serve Islam. That even includes pretending to deny belief in Islam itself.

a reply to: introvert

IIRC it would also contravene articles 2 and 18 of the UN declaration of human rights but it's been a long time since I studied it.

Then ALL religions are prohibited by the constitution since it is inimical to ALL religions that have claimed God as the ruler of everything.

Judaism, Christianity, Hinduism, Scientology, Mormonism all of them maybe save Buddhism.

It’s amazing that only Islam is beholden to the literalists in their religion and not other religions.

I'd say that’s ordinary ignorance, stupidity, or just bigotry to ONLY hold Islam to literalism and not the other religions.

The Christian and Jewish Bible commands people to stone wayward children to death. Kill gays.

Catholics use to burn people at the stake

Are you worried about them?

There are Muslim literalists as well as Christian and Jewish people who still take the ancient laws of the OT to heart

What about them?

BTW you won’t find one command in the Quran ordering the death of children, stoning to death like in the Bible, death of Gays.

In fact a Christian preacher a few weeks ago claimed the Bible commands that gays be put to death

IN Africa CHRISTIANS ARE BURNING WITCHES TO DEATH

Murdering Albinos and they all claim based on biblical scripture

As well many African countries with advisers from Christian USA are putting forth laws against gays that is inimical to the constitution

What about them

So we clearly see the bigoted double standard this OP is putting forth


you're just an ordinary bigot! Or an ignorant person

Take your pick

Furthermore there is no one Islamic Shariah

Do you even know what the word means?


There are 5 major schools of though in Islam plus Shia Islam with their own many different groups, and Wahhabism is NOT even one of them. It’s a small sect made powerful ONLY by oil wealth and the US support of them.


As well bunches of smaller sects THAT ALL HAVE THEIR OWN SHARIAH!


There are as many different Shariah’s in Islam as there are denominations in Christianity and they mostly range around levels of these 5 schools of thought but still are all different and according to different interpretations.


A Black Muslim has a Shariah. An Admadiyya Muslim has a different Shariah…on and on just like other religions that have various schools of thought.


A Sufi Muslim may have a different view of all of them


The only things all Muslims agree on are the confession of faith

There’s No God but God and Muhammad is his messenger
And the 5 pillars which in themselves is subject still to different perspectives.

For example:

Muslims say the first pillar is belief in God and that is based on a Quranic verse.

BUT

The fact is that verse actually doesn’t say belief in God ‘’It says belief in the UNSEEN

The commentators interpret that as God but in fact the word is the Arabic word Ghaibi which means belief in the unseen

So much for dogma! And so much for clerics!