Sign of the Son of Man

originally posted by: JackReyes
a reply to: Vector99

One part of the issue.

Satan's world consists of three things:

Political, Commercial, and Religious entities.

They have all been weaved to keep man enslaved. All of them. Religion will enslave you, the political system will enslave you, and the commercial empire will enslave you.

Religion, especially Christendom is especially despicable because she falsely claimed to represent Jehovah God.

So she gets her justice first, before the others at Armageddon.

And how you completely and utterly fail to see how your religion has enslaved you would be funny if it wasn't so tragic.

a reply to: JackReyes

Anyone that knows the answer can answer my question. I hope it is not too far off topic and I am not trying to be controversial. I just have a hard time understanding how prophecy is supposed to work. If it is a foretelling than there is a script that has to be adhered to.

If the Bible is the true word of God and he foretells of what is to come; how can anyone be blamed or punished for fulfilling the word of God?

Obviously for prophecy to be fulfilled, man "has" to do some wicked things. It is not within their power not to fulfill the evil that God has written has to occur. So how can the wicked and the evil be punished for following God's commands?

a reply to: NightSkyeB4Dawn

Not all prophecy is foretelling of future events. Much prophecy in the Holy Scriptures is God's commands, and also revelation of his divine purposes and what his will is.

As far as God being the causer of badness? No that is not true. We are told:

(Deuteronomy 32:4, 5) . . .The Rock, perfect is his activity, For all his ways are justice. A God of faithfulness who is never unjust; Righteous and upright is he.  5 They are the ones who have acted corruptly. They are not his children, the defect is their own. They are a crooked and twisted generation!

That is, God is perfect in all that he does. Those who rebel against him and what is good and holy do it of their own accord.

God is not responsible for the wickedness of others, although he may punish certain wicked people for their badness. It is not his fault.

Now there are certain people who claim that God has predestined everything a person does, and that our destiny has already been set. But the Bible clearly does not teach this.

For example, when God created mankind, he created them perfect and set them in the Garden of Eden, the man and woman, Adam and Eve, and then set a limit on their freedom, stating they could not eat from a certain tree. Did he already know they were going to fail? Of course not. It would not make sense to give them freewill if that were the case.

Some say, that if God did not know what was going to happen, then he could not have been God, for God can know everything.

And it is correct that he was the ability to foresee the future. But just because he was the ability that does not mean he has to exercise it at all times. His ability goes far beyond that. he can choose not to know certain things as well, allowing the free moral agents that we are liberty and also love.

It is obvious Satan knew this about his once Father, Jehovah. Because it makes no sense that if Satan knew how God was going to react, he would have continued with his plan. He obviously thought God was not going to react in the ways he did.

For example, in the Garden of Eden, there was the tree of life. And if Adam and Eve ate from it, they would have never died. Scripture tells us that before they were able to do so, and after they sinned they were banished from the Garden, and cherubs were placed at its entrance where they stood allowing no human to enter it, until the world was swept away in a global flood.

Now, after Adam and Eve sinned, and died, did that stop Satan? No! He got a third of the heavens (angels) to fall, according to Revelation. And these fallen angels materialized human bodies and mated with women and formed a hybrid offspring of giants. So perhaps Satan planned to genetically engineer humankind to find his own type of eternity on earth.

But again, Jehovah thwarted his plans, by causing the worldwide deluge that wiped that giant hybrid offspring from off the face of the earth, as well as made the wicked angels return to the spirit form, where he put them in chains under dense darkness, obviously not allowing them to materialize, and have the full limit of their powers they had before the flood.

Afterwards Satan got Nimrod to gather all mankind into making cities and warring against each other Jehovah saw that what was going on was not good so he confused the languages there and everyone went dispersing across the earth.

We can go on and on and on. You see God does not NEED to know the course a person is going to take until they take it. But he obviously knows their minds and hearts and so can give good warning for someone that is going down the wrong path to advert themselves before they sin. For example before Cain killed his brother Able, Jehovah warned him about his wicked heart, and asked him if he was going to be able to get the mastery over it and not sin, if he did not turn aside from his bad way. That loving warning and good advice went unheeded and Cain murdered his good brother, because his own heat was wicked, while that of his brother, Able, was righteous.

Let me make a simple illustration so you can understand the vast wisdom of God in easy to understand terms. Imagine you are in a huge city, like New York. You are setting out across the city to the other side. But you run into a road block. What are you going to do? Well, God, knows all of the routes in his mind to the other side. Perhaps he chose not to foresee that roadblock, so it just happened out of the blue. Well, he can look through his mind, and determine all outcomes and find the easiest way, and fastest way to his destination. And he can continue to change alter things as needed so he can reach his destination.

In the example for earth, his will has always been that people live in perfect conditions in peace, forever, without dying. Now that Satan entered into the equation, Jehovah had to react. And he has, the Bible has shown that he has set into motion a chain of events, which eventually lead to his offering his son, Jesus Christ, as a ransom for mankind. And he has established the Messianic kingdom, in his son's hands, that will soon do away with and abolish this old system of things, and bring about the world of peace he originally intended.

In the Garden of Eden, after man's fall, God made arrangements to fix things, and set the times and seasons of the unveiling, and development of his sacred purpose for mankind, all right there, instantly. We cannot understand the vastness and depth of his wisdom, but he has it beyond compare.

He has also seen that the heart of man is bad all the time. So he knows human imperfection, and knows that we cannot rule ourself, or even direct ourselves. It is only by reading his word, and praying, and looking to the chief agent and perfecter of our faith, Jesus that we can do what is right.

Anyone that is offered the opportunity to do so can take it. But no one is forced too. Unfortunately, God has foreseen, in his wisdom, that the majority of mankind, when given the offer, would reject his counsel and rule.

You yourself can chose to listen to his word and find life. You do not need to be wicked, neither does anyone else. And God is not responsible for your bad actions or mine, or anyone else. But he has put himself in charge of fixing all things. And in a way that is best for everyone.

(James 1:13) When under trial, let no one say: “I am being tried by God.” For with evil things God cannot be tried, nor does he himself try anyone.

(2 Peter 3:9) Jehovah is not slow concerning his promise, as some people consider slowness, but he is patient with you because he does not desire anyone to be destroyed but desires all to attain to repentance.

a reply to: JackReyes

Not all prophecy is foretelling of future events. Much prophecy in the Holy Scriptures is God's commands, and also revelation of his divine purposes and what his will is.

Prophecy - noun

the foretelling or prediction of what is to come.

And I don't understand your attempt to call our Father in Heaven
by his first name?

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: JackReyes

Not all prophecy is foretelling of future events. Much prophecy in the Holy Scriptures is God's commands, and also revelation of his divine purposes and what his will is.

Prophecy - noun

the foretelling or prediction of what is to come.

And I don't understand your attempt to call our Father in Heaven
by his first name?

Prophecy - An inspired message; a revelation of divine will and purpose or the proclamation thereof. Prophecy may be an inspired moral teaching, an expression of a divine command or judgment, or a declaration of something to come. Prediction, or foretelling, is not the basic thought conveyed by the root verbs in the original languages (Heb., na·vaʼʹ; Gr., pro·phe·teuʹo); yet it forms an outstanding feature of Bible prophecy. - Biblical Encyclopedia

A prophet who gave God's will or purpose, or proclaimed God's word was providing prophecy. While prophecy''s can contain predictions and foretelling of the future, and the Bible has such prophecies, not all prophecy is foretelling of future events.

To give you an example, when people of the Sanhedrin bound and blindfolded Jesus and started to bully and harass him, including slapping him in the face, they asked him to prophecy and tell them who it was doing it.

Not that they were asking Jesus to reveal the future, rather to tell them who was slapping him.

A Samaritan woman knew Jesus must have been a prophet, not for his revealing to her future events, but past events in her life.

Another example, when Jehovah wanted his divine will revealed (not future prediction) Ezekiel the prophet was told to prophecy to the wind. (that is in Ezekiel 37: 9, 10).

It is commonly thought that all prophecy has to be predictions of the future, but the Bible clearly shows that prophets were used to prophecy much more than just future predictions. While it is full of future predictions, that is not all that prophecy entails.

originally posted by: s13ep
a reply to: Bleeeargh

You'll be surprised, then.

How many languages do you speak? If only 1 or less you are a burden to this website, just realize that.

a reply to: JackReyes

I'll give you that one with one to go.

a reply to: randyvs

If you're referring to talking about "God's first name." God does not have a last name. So it would be redundant to say he has a "first name" as if he has a last one as well. He is God. He was never created and has always been. He says this about himself:

(Exodus 3:15) . . .“This is what you are to say to the Israelites, ‘Jehovah the God of your forefathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you.’ This is my name forever, and this is how I am to be remembered from generation to generation.

Jehovah comes from a Hebrew verb, ha'wah that means "to cause to become." The name means, he who causes to become.

Many people assume that when Jehovah told Moses:

. . .

"Ehyeh Asher Ehyeh" he was stating: "I am that I am." Some translations read that way. But he was not talking about his self existence, rather is ability to become what he needed to (the Savior of his people) to accomplish his word. He was really just repeating what his name, Jehovah means:

(Exodus 3:14) So God said to Moses: “I Will Become What I Choose to Become.”


Now as for the rest of people alive, both spirit angels and all humankind? Everyone owes their name (and yes, thus even their family, or last name) to Jehovah:

(Ephesians 3:14, 15) For this reason I bend my knees to the Father, to whom every family in heaven and on earth owes its name.

a reply to: JackReyes

What of all the people who lived before biblical texts? I'm sure this is probably off topic and I don't mean it to be, but I often wonder if god had all these plans for "his" people, why wait so long?

a reply to: alkalisunshine

To us it seems like a long time. But really if you look at time from his perspective, it is different.

For example, scientists say the universe is around 13.8 billion years old. God was before the universe, eternally beyond that. So the amount of time humans have been sinning really hasn't been that long.

Scripture gives us an idea of what time is like to God:

(2 Peter 3:8) . . .one day is with Jehovah as a thousand years and a thousand years as one day.

Man has been around on the planet for a little over 6,000 years now. That's in God's eyes, less than one week. To a short-lived human, it is a long time.

But Jehovah has taken into account all humanity. Jesus says that the time is coming, when he is ruling over the earth, when everyone who has ever died, whether they knew him or not, if they are in God's memory, will be raised to life again:

(John 5:28, 29) 28 Do not be amazed at this, for the hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will hear his voice 29 and come out, those who did good things to a resurrection of life, and those who practiced vile things to a resurrection of judgment.

There are no doubt millions, perhaps hundreds of millions? I don't know, maybe even billions of people who have lived in the past who never knew scripture, never knew God.

They will be raised to life in that future paradise on earth, and will be taught the truth, and then be judged on how they react to it.

Everyone who has ever lived,who is alive, or who will live, will one day know Jehovah, and be given the opportunity to serve him.

a reply to: JackReyes

That was very well said Brother.
It is enheartening to see anyone who is seeking to do God's will. I hope your words are always filled with his will. I hope mine are as well. I need it.

Stay humble and watch out for the pride the enemy will try to fill you with. I have been in that spot even after the Lord spoke to me with a generous heart.
That enemy is only as good as you allow in being tempted. No matter how wise we become, the enemy will find a leak. Keep it patched with the armor of God.
I used to be able to hear angels singing songs, until I fell out of step. I feel those voices returning with your helpful words.
I am Christian.

a reply to: JackReyes

Thank you for your well written reply. How time would work for god is quite interesting. I am (obviously) not well versed in the bible, but does it not say to not worship false idols/gods? Because time works so slowly for god he just forgot to let everyone knew he existed for a day or so? I feel like an instruction manual should have been included or at least a playable tutorial lol.

I find religions, especially the historical and cultural aspects of them, absolutely fascinating so I really do appreciate your kind reply. :]

originally posted by: JackReyes
...I am Jehovah....

Jehovahs Witnesses and Seventh-day Adventists both originate from the Advent Movement of the 1800s that was based on the time prophecies of Baptist preacher William Miller. The teachings originate from many of the same sources and so align closely in most areas.The majority of primary teachings are the same as held to by the Watchtower, the key difference being Seventh Day Adventists generally adhere to the Sabbath and Trinity, whereas Jehovah's Witnesses do not.

en.wikipedia.org...(preacher)

a reply to: Bleeeargh

Christians have all failed by raising Christ up to the level of God the father, even though he asked them to follow, not worship him.

I don't agree with all you say, but I do have to say, that I agree with you on this. This is also why I reject all religions that make God small and distant. God is the creator of all things. "All" things. He needs no middle man, no intermediary.

He can think into existence, why would he need an intermediary. He doesn't. We do. It is so hard for us to wrap our puny brains around God's greatest, that we need help in understanding. That is why those that have had a better understanding have tried to teach us, but even they have failed in helping us see the real God.

Because we are small and puny, we have in our minds and hearts, diminished God. We have reduced him to a state that we are comfortable with. We are afraid to accept his true greatest, and to do what he really wants us to do, follow his teachers to "Him".

Believers stand on the path and lift their praise and worship to an intermediary or a teacher that has no power other than what God has given them. Believers fail their teachers and they fail God, because they are too afraid or unwilling to do the hard work of following them on the path to God.

Most Believers that consider themselves devout, are Believers in man. They are not believers in God. Even though they will never admit it. They are afraid. They do not think they are worthy, so they are afraid to take the massive leap of faith and follow their teachers directly to God. Their teachers were "men" born to show them it could be done. Yet their faith remains little and weak.

a reply to: JackReyes

Thank you for our time and your response.

I was asking for clarification on the players in the role of prophecies. If God says that something is going to happen, is that a foretelling?

If God says it will be, can we change it?

If God says it will be, do any of the players in his foretelling, have a choice on carrying out their roles?

If God wants something to happen, if you get a lousy role, can you refuse?

No, no.....read the Scriptures....read them a bunch....it's the only way to get it.
The witnesses are liars and their father is the father of all lies and everything he says is a lie....

originally posted by: NightSkyeB4Dawn
a reply to: Bleeeargh

Christians have all failed by raising Christ up to the level of God the father, even though he asked them to follow, not worship him.

I don't agree with all you say, but I do have to say, that I agree with you on this. This is also why I reject all religions that make God small and distant. God is the creator of all things. "All" things. He needs no middle man, no intermediary.

He can think into existence, why would he need an intermediary. He doesn't....

According to judeo christian beliefs, God speaks things into existence ! According to christian beliefs, Jesus Christ is the spoken word of God, the truth, that makes things happen.

Is it a prophesy or an instruction book?

One does not need to fear the religious, as they fear the wrath of god.

The ones we truly should fear are the godless as they are already lost.

originally posted by: NightSkyeB4Dawn
a reply to: JackReyes

Thank you for our time and your response.

I was asking for clarification on the players in the role of prophecies. If God says that something is going to happen, is that a foretelling?

If God says it will be, can we change it?

If God says it will be, do any of the players in his foretelling, have a choice on carrying out their roles?

If God wants something to happen, if you get a lousy role, can you refuse?

God does indeed tell things before they happen:

(Isaiah 46:10) . . .From the beginning I foretell the outcome, And from long ago the things that have not yet been done. I say, ‘My decision will stand, And I will do whatever I please.’

So if God decides something will happen, he will say it will, and there is nothing, no force, either in the physical universe, or in the heavens above the heavens that can prevent it from happening. If he wills something to be, out of his good pleasure, or even purposes something, it will come to be. There is no way it will not come to pass.

Our universe will always be. Now even Jesus knew the likelihood of what Jehovah saying not coming true. There is a better chance of the universe ceasing to exist:

(Matthew 5:18) . . .Truly I say to you that sooner would heaven and earth pass away than for one smallest letter or one stroke of a letter to pass away from the Law until all things take place.

How can God assign you a lousy roll in his will though? His will is good toward all people. So, no, he does not assign certain individuals beforehand to do wicked things.

So everyone does indeed have the ability, and freewill to chose either to be good or be bad. But God does not make you be so.

Let me give you a simple example. It was foretold that one of Jesus' own apostles was going to betray him for 30 pieces of silver, the price of a Hebrew slave:

(Zechariah 11:12) . . .Then I said to them: “If it seems good to you, give me my wages; but if not, withhold them.” And they paid my wages, 30 pieces of silver.

Does that mean God assigned a certain individual to that role?

No, for Jesus prayed thoughtfully before choosing his 12 apostles, and no doubt all of them were faithful and righteous when he did chose them.

It wasn't until later on that a wicked heart condition developed within one of them, and then Jesus, being able to read his heart, knew that was the one that was going to betray him. But it wasn't before that heart condition developed that he it was going to be Judas.

So too, God has foretold the coming conclusion of our system of things, when wicked people take their stand against him. It is indeed pretty lousy for the people, not only for them to do such things, but also for them, for they will not suceed. Nevertheless, no one is forced into a certain role. While those roles have been foretold, and will come about. Everyone, including you and I have the freewill to either listen to God's word, and heed his warnings and survive, or disregard them and suffer the dire consequences because of such a foolish course of action.