Here’s What The World Thinks About The American Response To The Oregon Massacre

a reply to: Kryties

What I think is an enabler in many of these mass shootings are the fact that the locations of these mass shootings are in either a "Gun Free" or "Gun Restricted" Zones.

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa
To address another common fallacy, of how a lot of people say "criminals don't respect laws anyway, so any gun restrictions would just be pointless.

Well, isn't that the same logic as saying criminals will always speed down a highway, drunk and unlicensed, in a stolen vehicle? So why even bother having any regulations for who's allowed to drive, or any laws against stealing cars?

I think the "fallacy" that you've bastardized is "making guns EXTRA illegal won't stop criminals."

Which isn't a fallacy at all. It's already illegal to steal cars and drive drunk. People still do it. Making it EXTRA illegal isn't going to change that.

It's already illegal to commit premeditated murder. It's already illegal to use a gun to do so. In many cases, it was illegal for the person using the gun to commit murder to have the gun in the first place. So making it EXTRA illegal for them to have a gun isn't likely to stop them.

That's nothing more than the embodiment of contract security and their "stop, or I'll tell you to stop again!" mentality.

originally posted by: Kryties

originally posted by: Vasa Croe

This was supposed to decrease homicide rates/killings in general. It hasn't.

No, it was supposed to prevent mass shootings, which is exactly what happened. The laws worked perfectly. Why do you willfully ignore this?

I don't ignore it at all...murder is murder and yours is still, even after gun regulations, on the same level or higher than it was. Gun restrictions did nothing to curb the killing.

Happy that it has prevented mass shootings, but if the same number or more people have been killed each year after the regulations went into place, then I would say that is a big fail. But I guess because there had to be MORE killings versus a couple of larger ones to make up the difference this makes it ok in your eyes....nice.

Your Albert Einstein quote comes to mind again....only this time it is in reference to gun laws stopping killings.

a reply to: johnwick

#en eh I'm glad you showed up, haha this # is getting out of control, so basically what we have is a bunch of,British and Australian people telling us we need to restrict our guns, some saying all guns, and one particular poster saying no toys guns, or even thoughts of violence, this thread SMH.The pretentiousness and the scolding is amazing.look at the thread title the whole things is just a smear, glad you showed up man I have to step away from ats for a minute.

originally posted by: Krusty the Klown

It's interesting, I was talking to three sisters between the ages of 10-15 a few days ago, family friends and they are from the U.S. All three are blonde haired,blue eyed, very nice and genuine and sincere.

I jokingly said "you all go to high school in America? What sort of gun do you carry."

The first said I'd carry a .357 for stopping power, the second said you need something with more than six rounds and the last said you need an AR-15!

I'm not that old but was a little taken aback about how flippant they were, and how serious they were as I thought I was only making a joke!!!

Sounds like they are from around here!!

Nice girls, i hope one of my sons lands a smart girl like that!!!

I bet they even know how to clean fish, cook squirrel dumplings and rabbit stew!!!

I dont get it, you are acting like their response wasnt well thought out and showed a good amount of common sense thought.

They clearly understand guns, and understand the consequences of their use.

I thought female education was important in western society?

a reply to: Agit8dChop

Our forefathers wrote the 1st Amendment too and they couldn't imagine we have the internet and computers. What is your point.

And why would we spill blood if we have not exhausted all peaceful avenues to resolve our issues yet?

a reply to: Shamrock6

Yup, you are right

Ban all guns, de arm your police and get rid of your violent attitude and life will get a lot better for you all

All police fully armed is a recipe for complete disaster and a lot of unnecessary deaths, just specialist armed response units needed for extreme crimes and a lot of deaths will be avoided

I know you and many many more wont listen and will just keep the problems you have today but if you can not look at the countries around the world that don't live in fear like you all do then there is really no hope for you all

Statistics will prove my point but they mean nothing to a nation that is the biggest killers/murderers on earth ...just wake up and stop slaughtering people

originally posted by: johnwick

Just most of the guns from most people right?

Come and take them!!

Seriously, come right now and take them or quit your bleeting, we are all tiredof hearing it.

Nothing but air and opportunity between you and our guns, here they are, ccome on, come and take them.

I mean it isnt like you would be afraid to help take the guns when you are pushing this right?

Please stop the deflection and outright lies. Nobody wants to take all your guns, just the powerful assault-style weapons that the general populace have no legitimate use for other than to kill large numbers of other humans. In addition, laws to help prevent nutters from getting their hands on weapons - both of these combined have been proven to work in many other countries worldwide.

This has been pointed out MANY times in this thread alone and yet you willfully choose to ignore it in favour of the "come and take them" tough guy nonsense.

If the US government really wanted to "come and take them", what exactly do you think your pea-shooters would do against tanks, APC's, rocket launchers, grenade launchers, airstrikes, drone strikes, etc etc?

a reply to: TechniXcality


I hope I don't come under that "Bunch", when I was trying to diffuse the argument.

originally posted by: Kryties

originally posted by: DupontDeux

But do the world really care about the mass shootings in America? To date there have been 314 mass shootings in America this year. How many of them have anyone outside the U.S. even heard about?

None.

We are fully aware of most, if not all the recent mass shootings - it's not like our media doesn't regularly talk about it and list them off.

If we didn't care it would not make international news.

Really?

On average there are about one mass shooting per day. As I understand it most fail to make it beyond local / statewide news, so I highly doubt that all but a few of them make international news.

Let me put it this way: As a paying subscriber of the New York Times I get results from the full article database whenever I do a search, so I did a search on "mass shooting" and found that there are fewer articles on in than there are actual mass shootings. 241 over the last 12 month, to be precise, 48 of which is from within the last week.

And that includes EVERY article mentioning "mass shooting" - such as pieces on the rants from Hillary and Obama (9 and 23 respectively within the last week).

Again, my information is anecdotal, and great if concern is felt in Australia (and elsewhere), but I really do not think that the average Joe of the world has more than "meh" to say about it.

US gun control threads will get banned soon. There is no way with so many heated, passionate and dedicated members on here that a civilised debate can be had.

I'm out from commenting. Will read though.

originally posted by: joemoe
a reply to: Kryties

What I think is an enabler in many of these mass shootings are the fact that the locations of these mass shootings are in either a "Gun Free" or "Gun Restricted" Zones.

Nonsense. As an example, there was at least one student at the Oregon school who had a carry-conceal license and had his gun on him but didn't want to act because he thought that when the police got there they would mistake him for the shooter and kill him.

originally posted by: Kryties
a reply to: Krusty the Klown

Personally I would never live in, or send my kids to school in, a country where students talk about what kind of firearm to own for self defense - as if that is somehow normal and not totally insane.

No, pretty standard really.

In fact any gun owner should inform and educate their children about their guns.

I think you are more tea time and crumpits, while my culture is more duck dynasty.

I never will understand you " modern " folks.

You guys are funny.

a reply to: Vasa Croe

And how many of those were "mass stabbings"? More than 4 victims of the same weapon.

How worse could it have been if the perpetrator had a full magazine in their moment of rage?

Here is what I care about what people in other parts of the world think about our internal matters ...






... I don't generally go around telling them how to live. I may protest against a policy in my own country based on my understanding of how those policies work in other places, but if you want to do them in your country, that's your business.

If you don't want to own firearms, don't own them. If you don't want them to be legal, don't let them be legal. But don't lecture the US on it when you don't live here.

a reply to: Kryties

I can only imagine all those countries that are very much interested in seen America with a gun ban.

The irony.

Is not going to happen, get over it.

a reply to: Kryties
If the rest of the world told you to jump off a bridge, would you do it?
If the answer is yes.....
What if just one ATS member asked you to do it?

originally posted by: brace22
US gun control threads will get banned soon. There is no way with so many heated, passionate and dedicated members on here that a civilised debate can be had.

I'm out.

Thanks for trying mate, I know it's a tough debate to stay the course in. Doesn't matter how civil you try to be, how respectfully you try to deal with some people they will always resort to insults, threats and intimidation rather than intelligent conversation.

For what it's worth you made excellent points, you were polite and kept it civil. Well done

a reply to: zerozero00

"Live in fear?" Who lives in fear? Certainly not this guy.

I also own a hammer. Three, in fact. Do you assume that because I own a hammer, I must have the notion that I'll need to build a house tomorrow?

I don't.

As soon as "you" and "others like you" can come up with an idea that doesn't treat me like a criminal because of the actions of somebody else whom I've never met, perhaps we can listen.

The sad thing? I'm far from one of "those" gun owners. I have no problem whatsoever with background checks and restrictions on things like automatic weapons. None at all. But the gun grabbers can't meet people like me in the middle. It's all or nothing. Yet they accuse the gun owners of being the ones that are all or nothing.

Comical. And pathetic.

originally posted by: joemoe
a reply to: Agit8dChop

Our forefathers wrote the !st Amendment too and they couldn't imagine we have the internet and computers. What is your point.

see thats the sort of thing the outside world doesnt understand.. your such a smart creative people but pretend to miss the point..

the point is... things change! life/technology evolves.

there is nothing wrong with adjusting laws as things change..

but, you psycho gun nuts frothing at the mouth at the thought of losing your c*ck extensions cant handle the idea of adjusting your current laws to make things safer..

its totally insane..

but like i said.. hopefully enough of your schools are involved in massacres that the next generation are so scarred from gun violence they do what your current generation couldnt - grow up and adapt!