Should UK accept thousands of refugees because 423,000 people signed a Petition?

a reply to: Gothmog

Thing is Goth, that the long game has never suited our politicians because the public are so random in voting...

In the U.S. I'm sure you can appreciate the two party political spectrum is not how it works here.

It would serve no party to pander in this situation also because the refugee vote (in 5 years say if they're still here and eligible) would not make the slightest difference in the polls.

originally posted by: Learningman
a reply to: Boeing777

But the thing is, its not unthinkable for Britain to accept partial responsibility for the after effect of war and weapons sales. Can you imagine the States making such a statement? It would be political suicide for them.

And Australia, if you arrive by any way other than birth canal its acceptable to be sent to a 'containment' center.

You are 100% correct, of course, I'm just mentioning that while you should teach a naughty child to share, if the child is that naughty then they wont care anyway.

Agree. Only a million dead Iraqis later were the yanks able to admit that Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11.

a reply to: seeker1963

I think a lot of it belongs to The Crown.

But I'm sure there are many landlords overall.


I've nothing against an organic and rural backdrop...
But 97%???

That's excessive in my opinion...

Especially when 10% of the population live in London alone.

I can appreciate its the business center & capital, but it's 2015 for crying out loud.
Asking for a further 5% development isn't much I feel.

Look at the list of names of the people who want them in and find out where they live, then drive one of the refugees over to their house and they can live there.

a reply to: anxiouswens
If I recall UK already has enough refugees, from what I understand and UK folks can correct me but you all are having the same problem we are, you let them in, pay to support them, they demand equal rights when it fits their cause, you don't go to neighborhoods were the live in fear, and you have your own folks that need more help.

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs
And meaning no disrespect , I totally disagree. You have millions of "undocumented workers" that one party pushes to become citizens. This group of people have literally no concept of politics in this country . They dont know Obama from George Washington. All they know is who pushed for their citizenship. Now , think and put yourself in their position. Who do you vote for ?
Nuff Said

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Its not, but I feel it would be resisted until it was inevitable.

' We want affordable housing, yes sir, but what?
You want to renovate MY golf course?
You want to build on OUR parkland?
You want to build where I look out of MY window?
Oh okay, maybe we don't need it that bad...'

originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: Soloprotocol
Signing petitions seems to be the new Get up of yer arse and do something.

It's a step up from whining on discussion forums I guess

Yeah mate, that's right. Bunch of 3rd world degenerates put it on themselves by being born in another country. That's just how it is, right?

As long as you've got your birth certificate that establishes you as a first world citizen, then that's all that really matters... I suppose!

a reply to: anxiouswens

Here's the thing, this is a pretty similar issue to the US and illegals in the US. You have a segment that screams we have to keep going, come one come all, media does the same thing then the truely enlighted and smart throw out hate/racists/etc for anyone saying no. To these people they are better, more compassionate, have better concept of humanity, etc. Anyone else who doesn't joyfully go along is just full of hate. Blah blah blah.

Now reality. There are a limited number of resources , money, housing, medical facilities, schools, etc. This infrastructure is setup and growth need is planned based on current population and predicted population of what you currently have. Even on that level I assume you like the US already have segments of the population of say hungry children, homeless, etc. Now you add millions or large numbers to the mix, refugees, illegals just coming, whatever.

Not only was the current system not setup for the cuurent population evident by hungry and homeless, but now you added a bunch of people that weren't even planned on. If they don't speak the language it's even harder. Houston we have a problem. Now we have an emergency situation , we now need more schools, we now need more housing, we now need more teachers, police, fire, etc. We need it now, and if a language barrier exists we have even more problems. We need all this stuff , we need it now, we didn't plan, we don't have the resources for all the required increases until say next budget year and that's even if we can get it.
All these new problems are creeping up, can't respond quick enough, even if the money for the required services was sitting there, New facilities take time to build, so does housing, etc. On top of that say we have some serious medical related sickness outbreak. Hospitals weren't equipped with the required medicine because they were stocking based on planned numbers, not large influx, food in the grocery stores as well and so on.

Remember we had people that weren't getting help before, now we don't have enough to help them or the newly arrived. What's this lead to? More crime, more homeless, more lacking services. Etc this leads to even more problems. Take schools, we need more teachers and have to cram more students into classes, and until we get bilingual teachers and have the space to seperate out students the overall quality for all students drop because the pace slows down because everyone is crammed in, trying to get all students that same basic lessons, less time per students, language barriers, etc. You can forget teachers raises and benefit increases..we have the same amount of money and need more of you with different skill sets and so on. We just hurt our teachers earning potential and that creates a new set of problems and it keeps going and spreads into just about everything.
This all started because a bunch of people who thought they were moral and humane and everyone else was evil and full of hate attempted to lecture and shame. The problem was neither evil or hate, rather these moral social people haven't the first clue as to the concept of proper planning and now we took a single external problem and turned it into 50 internal problems. The follow up goes the evil hate filled among us don't want to pay our teachers, provide basic housing, etc. They now float from problem to problem that was created by the initial actions they helped make happen, obviously it has to be mean people, it can't be because they lacked the concept of planning and logical integration plans. After all they are enlightened and loving and moral. Piss poor planning on their part can't be it. It must be the same evil haters who wanted to deny these poor refugees and immigrants entry in the first place.

Rather than getting the infrastructure in place ahead of time, and being able to absorb an influx, successfully integrate. The answer to your question is no, 400,000 people who obviously don't do a good job of thinking or understand planning shouldn't matter. If it was a one-time emergency thing, ok. But it's not. It's constant. The wise social justice warriors everywhere need to push to have things in place then based on what we have allow more people. Instead the thought is pack them in, get them in, we created 50 problems to solve 1 but the enlightened and compassionate can't be the problem...Now we have poltical and social fights to go along with the problems...madness.

a reply to: Gothmog

Then we do not disagree...

That's exactly how it works, in the U.S.


But it's different in UK, Goth.
That's the point I've been making.


I've not heard of the UK having millions of undocumented workers, and their numbers, even if eligible to vote, would not sway our polls.

The youth vote is the one they pander to over here.

a reply to: Learningman

Yes you're absolutely right buddy.

The aristocrats would have a fit if this was a parliamentary proposal and not my internet ramblings.

originally posted by: Subaeruginosa

originally posted by: grainofsand

originally posted by: Soloprotocol
Signing petitions seems to be the new Get up of yer arse and do something.

It's a step up from whining on discussion forums I guess

Yeah mate, that's right. Bunch of 3rd world degenerates put it on themselves by being born in another country. That's just how it is, right?

As long as you've got your birth certificate that establishes you as a first world citizen, then that's all that really matters... I suppose!

What the deuce?! Lol, all of that is your invention and your words alone, nowhere have I said that. Perhaps quote me and argue against the quote instead of making things up.
Sheesh, it's getting like facebook here sometimes.

We are a mongrel nation 99% of our ancestory began overseas It has helped in making GREAT Britain It is the right and moral thing to do letting in people in need.
I think having people from different countries spices things up also It helps us learn about the world when we meet and talk to them.
Heck my family tree came from france during the revolution (I know I know ).
So yes let the people who need help in and let them either go back when it is safe to do so or If they want to contribute to keeping us GREAT let them.

Also lets have a bit of empathy eh?.
We would all do the same in their position.
Also I would raise taxes...for the banks let them pay for it for once.
But If needs be I would pay a few P more per pound to help these folk.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: Gothmog

Then we do not disagree...

That's exactly how it works, in the U.S.


But it's different in UK, Goth.
That's the point I've been making.


I've not heard of the UK having millions of undocumented workers, and their numbers, even if eligible to vote, would not sway our polls.

The youth vote is the one they pander to over here.

You know , I did not think about that. But there again , what is the best way to play on young voter's hearts ? They are still under the fairy tale world where evil does not exist and we should do everything possible to help out no matter the cost. Yeah , I was like that once. So very long ago.They called us the hippie movement .

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: anxiouswens

If only 106,000 said no and 423,000 said yes how is the minority winning?

Or did I read your post wrong?

They're both minorities.

Almost 65 Million people in the UK.

The other 64 million people probably cursed out the people trying to get signatures, lol.

At most you could argue for this to trigger a vote. Not an immediate change in policies.

originally posted by: seeker1963

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: Boeing777

Only 3% of the UK is developed.

The rest is empty space.


I say this not just to highlight how much we can afford to help refugees...

But also our own here at home who are homeless while 97% of the country is unused shrubbery.

Developing even 5% more (still less than 10% overall) would fix the UK and be one of the greatest economic boosts we could use to our advantage.


That's still leave 92% untouched so the antiquated can still look at fields on the train and motorways.

Wow! I never realized that. They got ya'll packed in pretty tight then? Who owns all that property?

A lot is by farmers, minei g companys and qurreys gone out of buisness ,some the government's and some the crown.

I know a guy that owns a big chunk of Norfolk.

Problem is that land is "wothless" as there is no building permits for it.

Hell you can buy acres of it off the government for penuts. Problem is you cant do anything with it!

Round my area alone, the south east that is one of the most expensive and densly populated places in the world there are millions of arces empty in abandoned quarys, disused farmland, decommissioned MOD land and shut down industrial sites

a reply to: crazyewok

Could I build a Yurt on it?.

a reply to: Gothmog

Well that is a great point, this could ultimately be pandering to the sensibilities of the youthful liberal movement as well as any fence sitters.

The young are inherently the activists, the bullhorners, the ones who "care"...


So this could be pandering to them.


But if all parties agree on this, it'll just go back to randomness.

Excellent observation, Goth.

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: crazyewok

Could I build a Yurt on it?.

Ha not unless you want a overzelous council beurocrate knocking on your door.