Rick Santorum Quotes WBC To Defend Indiana's Religious Freedom Law

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: Krazysh0t

It's actually a nice misdirect, but not really germane. The definition of marriage is the core issue.

Dictionaries have already updated and changed the definition of marriage.

From the LINGUISTIC SOCIETY

Is the English language changing?

Yes, and so is every other human language. Language is always changing, evolving, and adapting to the needs of its users. This isn't a bad thing; if English hadn't changed since, say, 1950, we wouldn't have words to refer to modems, fax machines, or cable TV. As long as the needs of language users continue to change, so will the language. The change is so slow that from year to year we hardly notice it (except to grumble every so often about the 'poor English' being used by the younger generation!). But reading Shakespeare's writings from the sixteenth century can be difficult. If you go back a couple more centuries, Chaucer's Canterbury Tales are very tough sledding, and if you went back another 500 years to try to read Beowulf, it would be like reading a different language.

www.linguisticsociety.org...

a reply to: Annee

Yes, I've seen that. That includes the definition of discrimination, as well.....

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: Annee

Yes, I've seen that. That includes the definition of discrimination, as well.....

OK.

Elaborate.

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: Krazysh0t

It's actually a nice misdirect, but not really germane. The definition of marriage is the core issue.

Pretty hard to blame forefathers for that one. Societies on their way out had plenty of homosexuality. None had raised the bar to 'marriage' like these guys have.

It's not a misdirect. Government redefined what a marriage was when it took over responsibility for marriage rights. Definitions change, so your point here is kind of pointless.

A new level...

Still, I don't care about a 'bakery'.

Once the self-righteous pontificate on what an individually owned business should or shouldn't do, despite 1St amendment rights, the door is now open for even more choices removed under the name of social justice.

The slope will continue...if I have gatherings at my home will I have to prove the 'correct' percentile of visitors via race or sexual preference?

What? Stop with the hyperbole.

Knock off the personal right, as mandated by law, of an individual business, it will continue.

Don't forget all this started with "the gov't has no business in the bedrooms of the nation". The slope has been fast.

My fear and prediction is there will be a backlash...sooner rather than later, unless I miss my guess.

No, what's more likely is that since with each new generation each generation is more open to things like this, the haters will just grow old, die and society will move on.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

I love how you use the quote option to cut out points in my post. Hyperbole?? Really?

Gay marriage unheard of in any civilization previous to this is FACT. Not hyperbole.

The redefinition of marriage occurred now, under this Judicial Branch with the approval of an extreme liberal socialist elite that uses redefinition as it's means to redefine this nation. FACT.

Not hyperbole whatsoever. This one incident has woken a few more folks up.

Where it all ends up? Your guess is as good as mine....

originally posted by: nwtrucker

Gay marriage unheard of in any civilization previous to this is FACT. Not hyperbole.

Gay Marriage ---- nothing new under the sun

Gay marriage and homosexuality were part of the moral landscape faced by the first Christians in Ancient Rome. Benjamin Wiker

Given that the gay marriage agenda will be increasingly pressed upon Catholics by the state, we should be much more aware of what history has to teach us about gay marriage—given that we don’t want to be among those who, ignorant of history, blithely condemned themselves to repeat it.

Contrary to the popular view—both among proponents and opponents—gay marriage is not a new issue. It cannot be couched (by proponents) as a seamless advance on the civil rights movement, nor should it be understood (by opponents) as something that’s evil merely because it appears to them to be morally unprecedented.

Gay marriage was—surprise!—alive and well in Rome, celebrated even and especially by select emperors, a spin-off of the general cultural affirmation of Roman homosexuality. Gay marriage was, along with homosexuality, something the first Christians faced as part of the pagan moral darkness of their time.

What Christians are fighting against today, then, is not yet another sexual innovation peculiar to our “enlightened age,” but the return to pre-Christian, pagan sexual morality.

www.catholicworldreport.com...

a reply to: Annee

The original definitions has been changed.

Usually, the original definition is listed first. As the "number one" definition.

EG. 'Romance'. The first definition is 'adventure'.
'Nice'. first definition is stupid , ignorant....
if one looks in the 'big book', The Ne Plus Ultra of dictionaries, The Oxford English Dictionary, full version, the definition is the ability to differentiate between two items, objects, etc. (I paraphrase, to show an understanding of the word/concept rather than a rote reply.)

Now the newer , 'on line' sources, as you accurately point out, have been revised....

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: Annee

The original definitions has been changed.

Original definition from where, by who?

And the definition of atheist was devil worshiper.

So what.

a reply to: Annee

You can spin...LOL. Utterly irrelevant to redefining marriage in the here and now. Especially when done by a minority, yea a minority against the wishes of the majority...the vast majority.

That's the way it is, though. Hear these words, this will happen to you somewhere down the line. An imposition on what you hold as basic. It will be changed without consultation or voice. You won't like it any more than the Christian base does now.

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: Annee

You can spin...LOL. Utterly irrelevant to redefining marriage in the here and now. Especially when done by a minority, yea a minority against the wishes of the majority...the vast majority.

That's the way it is, though. Hear these words, this will happen to you somewhere down the line. An imposition on what you hold as basic. It will be changed without consultation or voice. You won't like it any more than the Christian base does now.

Your mini rant is like a puff of smoke, because it does not matter.

America is a secular government. Americas government marriage license is a contract and also secular.

How you feel about it is not relevant, except personally.

----------------------------

Oh, please --- hear these words --- I'm almost 70 --- like I've escaped impositions in my life. I don't sweat the small stuff.

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: Krazysh0t

I love how you use the quote option to cut out points in my post. Hyperbole?? Really?

You should go over the text better. I didn't cut out a single word from your post. I just separated the points so I can address them individually. Try again.

Gay marriage unheard of in any civilization previous to this is FACT. Not hyperbole.

Just because you put "fact" in capital letters after the sentence doesn't make it a fact.
A History of Gay Marriage

The redefinition of marriage occurred now, under this Judicial Branch with the approval of an extreme liberal socialist elite that uses redefinition as it's means to redefine this nation. FACT.

Not hyperbole whatsoever. This one incident has woken a few more folks up.

Well you are right on the previous one. That one is extreme political rhetoric. So extreme that it is laughable.

Where it all ends up? Your guess is as good as mine....

It all adds up to a bunch of right wing bigots crying and whining while freedom gets extended to more people that didn't previously have it. As it should be.

a reply to: Annee

www.mrctv.org...

a reply to: Krazysh0t

www.mrctv.org...

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: Annee

www.mrctv.org...

Your point?

That self righteous man has corrupted a once spiritual and pagan type accepting belief system ---- with the influx of Christianity.

From your link:

One Native American said reservations didn't always use to be this way.

"John Hawk Co-Cke' (co-KAY), an enrolled member of the Osage Nation who's gay, said that before reservations were created, many tribes had no problem with men who embraced their feminine side and women who lean toward their masculine side, inspiring the term two-spirit people. Two-spirit people were sometimes given special ceremonial roles because of their ability to go into both the masculine and feminine world," he said.

Mr. Co-Cke says Christianity's’s influence on the tribes ever since the reservations were formed has influenced their stances on homosexuality.

Why Marriage Matters to Native Americans Just as the United States debates whether or not to end the exclusion of same-sex couples and their families from marriage, Native American tribes are addressing the same issue. Native American tribes are federally recognized sovereign nations—thus they can create their own policies around marriage for same-sex couples. Native American tribes have historically accepted LGBT/Two-Spirit same-sex relationships, and in 2009, the first tribe in the nation, the Coquille Tribe of Oregon, approved the freedom to marry for same-sex couples. Since then, several other tribes have extended marriage to same-sex couples to same-sex couples, with several proactively approving resolutions in favor of the freedom to marry and others newly realizing that their tribal code does not reference gender and thus, permits marriage between same-sex couples.

These Native American tribes have approved the freedom to marry:
The Coquille Tribe in Oregon (2009)
The Suquamish Tribe in Washington (2011)
The Tribal Council of the Little Traverse Bay Bands of Odawa Indians in Michigan (2013)
The Pokagon Band of Potawatomi Indians in Michigan (2013)
The Santa Ysabel Tribe in California (2013)
The Colville Tribal Council of the Confederated Tribes of the Colville Nation in Washington (2013)
The Cheyenne and Arapaho Tribes in Oklahoma (2013)
he Leech Lake Tribal Court in Minnesota (2013)
The Puyallup Tribe of Indians in Washington (2014)
The Central Council of Tlingit and Haida Indian Tribes of Alaska (2015)

www.freedomtomarry.org...

a reply to: Annee

So what? It's the backlash. It's started....

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: Krazysh0t

www.mrctv.org...

From your link:

"John Hawk Co-Cke' (co-KAY), an enrolled member of the Osage Nation who's gay, said that before reservations were created, many tribes had no problem with men who embraced their feminine side and women who lean toward their masculine side, inspiring the term two-spirit people. Two-spirit people were sometimes given special ceremonial roles because of their ability to go into both the masculine and feminine world," he said.

Mr. Co-Cke says Christianity's’s influence on the tribes ever since the reservations were formed has influenced their stances on homosexuality.

Shocker...

a reply to: Annee

P.S.

Actually, I agree with you on the original belief system of Native Americans.

The point I'd make is that belief system would never have enforced the 'preferences' of a small minority onto the rest of the band.

That is why the need to counter this imposition on the remainder. Completely understandable as an attempt to regain balance...

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: Annee

So what? It's the backlash. It's started....

You and others like you, think it is your right to deny others rights you already have.

Not going to happen --- not in the long run.

Christians are kicking and screaming because they are losing the power and dominance they've had over America. A power and dominance they never should have had.

Tough cookies.

originally posted by: nwtrucker

The point I'd make is that belief system would never have enforced the 'preferences' of a small minority onto the rest of the band.

You keep talking about a minority. America is not a democracy. It is a Republic. Minorities are guaranteed the same equal rights as the majority.

Current polls show a 50+ percent support, nationwide, for Marriage Equality.

The minority is now those against it.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Are you deliberately avoiding the point??

It's same sex marriage, not the same sex activity that the bands are saying 'too far' to.

The native community sees the feds trying to homogenize everyone into the same standard and status. They're saying bull to that as well.

Spin, spin, spin.

Not everyone is going to agree either way. Their call.