Cops need to be taught their priority is to protect citizens even when they are being bad.

a reply to: TorqueyThePig

sorry i took the time to put the whole thing in there and apparently the "system" stripped it. . . .i do not have all of the typical things here to post a link. grr

ok.. . .article is titiled "New police training puts fewer limits on use of police force" from santafenewmexican dot com sunday feb 16 of this year.

worth a read. . . .should google easy . . .sorry i couldnt make it easier to do.

-LP

a reply to: launchpad

LOL my Google search only resulted in this thread.

a reply to: TorqueyThePig

i edited the post again so more details are there if you cut and paste- check for typos. this is frustrating not being able to see even half the "tools" for posting.

aurthur is Uriel J. Garcia

sorry i don't know how else to cope with the unfriendly browser. my typing is sucking pretty bad today too.

maybe a more connected person will help us out?

sorry agian
-LP

a reply to: launchpad

I found this article from Mar 22, 2014 and updated Mar 25, 2014. Santa Fe New Mexican

Really good article, that gives some great insight into the problems in New Mexico police training. The new director of the New Mexico Law Enforcement Academy, Jack Jones, pushed for, and received, the sole responsibility for the curriculum taught to all of New Mexico's police recruits. Mr. Jones is a retired Army Colonel and former state police officer.

When The New Mexican first filed a public records request for a copy of the academy’s training material in February, Jones said, “I’ll burn them before you get them.” But State Police Chief Pete Kassetas said March 5 that the Department of Public safety, which oversees the academy, had intended to release the training materials.

I thought this was kind of funny. Kind of shows where the problem starts. At the top is always a good place to find the problems.

a reply to: retiredTxn

Oddly enough, when I mentioned it being more of a "top down" problem instead of a "bottom up" in another thread, I was told that was incorrect and the problem started at the bottom.

a reply to: Xeven

I think while the police are being taught to do something that isn't exactly in their job description the way you want it to be that people should be taught not to resist arrest or commit crimes.

Good luck with that!

There are always going to be bad people, bad cops, bad citizens, bad politicians.. the sooner people realize it the better.

There are over 400,000 police officers in the US... if all of them, like a lot of people seem to believe were bad then the NWO would have their population decline.

Over 400,000 cops in the US and less than 5000 people killed by police every year. Yeah they are strong arm power tripping bastards hell bent on killing blacks and everyone else. RIGHT? err.. . NO

a reply to: Shamrock6

Hope that wasn't me. Depending on the situation, either could be true. I caught some of my officers running a game and hiding it from me. They weren't happy when I found out. And, I've been instructed to enforce directives some of my officers didn't like, but had to do it anyway. So yeah, it could be both ways.

a reply to: retiredTxn

Nah it wasn't. Totally agree with you: there are bad cops, just like there are bad people. The profession is not without it's bad apples. But the systemic issues typically come from the top down. Guy may be the greatest patrolman in town, but he doesn't set policy.

a reply to: Xeven

You need to learn what actually a cop does. A cop doesn't need to protect the citizens outright. The cop works for the state or the city to enforce the laws provided by said state or city. They do NOT need to protect citizens as most will believe but rather ENFORCE through whatever means they have been given to prevent those said laws being broken. They are there to respond to an event after it happens, normally.

You should really understand how the police forces have been set up and that for instance...if a woman calls 911 and says she is about to be raped the cops respond....they head to the scene and if possible prevent the crime from taking place or react to the crime after it has taken place......they DO NOT actually respond to protect the woman but rather to uphold the law of NO RAPING!!!

Its an eye opener for those who want to cry about police protecting them....its a fanatsy invented by media and propaganda over time.

Hell maybe the problem is we all need to be taught some compassion for our fellow human beings.

originally posted by: rickymouse
I've seen a huge increase of people who will run or confront a cop when they are doing their job. There used to be a few when I was younger, but even bar fights broke up when the cops came without much need for the cops doing anything. We were taught to respect the cops when I was young and because we ceased doing what we were doing when they came, there was little need for their getting violent. Now society has changed and so has their attitude towards things. Because of people twisting the rules and lawyers getting people off without punishment ,other than paying high legal costs, they get frustrated easier.

I think you are bang on. People think they can challenge the badge. There is zero respect for authority and this has led to LEO'S defending and not protecting as they never know how the interaction will play out. They are people too they are a son, they are a father they are a brother and don't know when going on a call if they will make their way back home, not knowing the intent or mindset of the citizen they are dealing with. That being said I don't care the color of your skin,if you are bad with no respect for the law you are going to face direct sequence of your actions.

a reply to: launchpad

Interesting article and I understand the message that it is trying to convey.

We definitely are taught to be vigilant at all times. We are definitely taught to prepare for the worst but pray for the best.

I don't think there is anything wrong with that.

That being said, since each officer is a unique individual they will react differently to such training.

Some will be able to remain vigilant "with their head on a swivel" at all times and still perform their job in a courteous, respectful and safe manner.

I truly feel and believe that I perform my job that way, as I feel my coworkers do as well.

However, we have had new hires that could not balance being extra vigilant, yet still perform their jobs in a courteous, respectful, and safe manner. They did not make it through training. Seasoned Field Training Officer's (FTO) discovered their faults and did not pass them.

That goes back to a couple of reasons as to why I believe we may be seeing an increase (if we truly are seeing an INCREASE) in over zealous, over reacting police officers who are shooting too soon or at the wrong people, and getting physical too fast or too much.

The reasoning IMO is as follows, "good" officers are leaving the job because they are over the hate, stress, risk (physical and mental), and mediocre pay. This leaves departments scraping the bottom of the barrel to place people in the open positions. Right off the bat there is a decline in the quality of candidate available.

Then since the "good" experienced officers are leaving agencies are having issues finding and promoting "good" qualified FTO's. There are many agencies (including mine) that now have FTO's with less than 3 years law enforcement experience! We had a female at our department that had only one year experience! There is no way in hell that one should be an FTO with that little experience.

The result of these subpar FTO's is poor training of new hires, and the lack of ability to determine who would truly make a "good" cop. This of course results with the newly trained officers being less than stellar candidates, who have improper and insufficient training, and maybe shouldn't even be cops in the first place.

I am afraid that until things change this will only become more of an issue. Hell, there may be a day when agencies can only hire violent felons because that is all they have left to choose from...

originally posted by: projectbane
a reply to: Xeven

You need to learn what actually a cop does. A cop doesn't need to protect the citizens outright. The cop works for the state or the city to enforce the laws provided by said state or city. They do NOT need to protect citizens as most will believe but rather ENFORCE through whatever means they have been given to prevent those said laws being broken. They are there to respond to an event after it happens, normally.

You should really understand how the police forces have been set up and that for instance...if a woman calls 911 and says she is about to be raped the cops respond....they head to the scene and if possible prevent the crime from taking place or react to the crime after it has taken place......they DO NOT actually respond to protect the woman but rather to uphold the law of NO RAPING!!!

Its an eye opener for those who want to cry about police protecting them....its a fanatsy invented by media and propaganda over time.

If this is true why have the police perpetuated the idea of protecting and serving by putting that slogan on their patrol cars?
In my opinion they are there to generate revenue for the city, county, and state.

If the police were held accountable for their actions, abuse of power would stop overnight. Right now police can get away with anything they want and so they do whatever they want, whenever they want. In the current system it would have to be a pretty serious violation to get any kind of legal action taken against a cop.

I think that there are laws that are there to prevent abuse of power, but they are not enforced. If a cop wants to arrest someone, they, legally, need to have have probable cause. They can't just go around arresting anybody they feel like, but it seems they do anyways. In the eric garner situation I doubt a judge would have accepted any excuse the police would have given for probable cause and that would have made the arrest illegal.

The only way to fix the situation we find ourselves in is to start from the top down. No more judges turning a blind eye to bad evidence or just going off the word of the officer. No more conflict of interests and collusion between the district attorney/prosecutor and police. No more unlawful arrests.

If the police were to actually fear the consequences of breaking the very law they claim to uphold, many of the problems we face today would not exist.

a reply to: xDeadcowx

So good cops don't arrest bad cops that violate the law and the court system doesn't hold them accountable for their crimes?

What of these cases then?

abc7news.com...

www.wbaltv.com...

www.cleveland.com...

www.foxnews.com...

I could list plenty more cases where good cops acted appropriately by arresting the bad cops and the judicial system followed through properly but I am sure people would claim some kind of conspiracy...

Look, I get the system is not perfect and bad people slip through the cracks, but the whole "all cops cover for other cops" and "cops are never held accountable for their actions" memes are becoming a little stale.

originally posted by: guitarplayer

originally posted by: projectbane
a reply to: Xeven

You need to learn what actually a cop does. A cop doesn't need to protect the citizens outright. The cop works for the state or the city to enforce the laws provided by said state or city. They do NOT need to protect citizens as most will believe but rather ENFORCE through whatever means they have been given to prevent those said laws being broken. They are there to respond to an event after it happens, normally.

You should really understand how the police forces have been set up and that for instance...if a woman calls 911 and says she is about to be raped the cops respond....they head to the scene and if possible prevent the crime from taking place or react to the crime after it has taken place......they DO NOT actually respond to protect the woman but rather to uphold the law of NO RAPING!!!

Its an eye opener for those who want to cry about police protecting them....its a fanatsy invented by media and propaganda over time.

If this is true why have the police perpetuated the idea of protecting and serving by putting that slogan on their patrol cars?
In my opinion they are there to generate revenue for the city, county, and state.

The protect and serve "motto" shall we call it is merely a term to keep citizens at ease and feel that false sense of security. Dont get me wrong...there are some very good officers out there who act like the motto says but legally it is no more valid than Mcdonalds' slogan.

Having the average no no better citizen feel safe and clam is what they want. Its why grand juries are so inclined mostly not to prosecute a cop because they always give the benefit of the doubt.....!!