State of emergency declared in Missouri preceding Verdict

originally posted by: mrsdudara

originally posted by: WCmutant

You, and anyone else that thinks this way, need to read history.

What was the Boston Tea Party? A bunch of thugs looting and destroying property. Worse, some dressed as Natives to do it. ...but now you look on it as a source of national pride.

No offence but that is a really bad comparison. The Sons of Liberty were NOT thugs, they were organized responsible men who very careful to not damage anyone or any personal property aside from the tea, and the lock that held it. The tea was chosen for very specific reasons.

What is happening in Ferguson, totally different scenario. It just happens that there are a lot of people in the country who are unhappy with the government and the cards they have been dealt though the past 10 years of economic crisis so this has become the focal point for anger. A place to put rage.
Seeing how far the government is willing to go, brings in people who could care less about the guy who got shot but want to see an end to our governments excessive/obsessive reach.
It has brought in groups of people who are tired of people thinking they can do whatever they want and not have any consequences to battle groups of people who take what they want and don't want anyone to stop them.
They have created an enormous wildfire from a that little fiery piece of hay that broke the camels back.

Not a comparison to the Sons of Liberty at all.

You know that because you knew them? You have a time machine you are hiding from the rest of us? Or you are fine romancing the stories we've all been told about the founding of the USA? The writers of the stories of what happened are the ones that created this country.

I won't pretend to know ANY of them other than judging them by their actions. Their actions are thus:
1. Entering ships they did not own
2. Throwing hundreds of chests of tea into the ocean that they did not own
3. Many doing it while dressed as Indians

And why? Because of a tax. Definitely, nothing thugish about doing that over a tax. You're romancing their actions by discussing how "careful" they were not to damage other property other than the lock.

I'm guessing if a black man was to do the same thing in the Boston harbor today (only damaging a lock) he'd be called a thug. Just a guess.

a reply to: AgentShillington

Martial Law Detroit 1967

originally posted by: AgentShillington
Oh, come on. You don't think the war will be on the moment a cop in riot gear is photographed attacking an unarmed person in the wake of a decision about whether or not a cop should be accused of a crime?

This hasn't even started.

You're right, of course.

Every protest becomes bigger and more powerful the moment the authorities overreact and attack a protestor. This is a psychological and sociological fact, proven time and time again in movement after movement - and a lot of the time the authorities know it to be true.

Last night I was wacthing a live stream of a very small gathering in Ferguson, the police arrived and after maybe 30 minutes they snatched a reporter, instantly the crowd surged forward ready to snatch him back (they didn't manage to). When you increase the numbers (there were perhaps 100 there, against maybe 30 cops) this only becomes more dangerous.

All it will take is for one person to film and show the police beating someone, being unjust, abusing people, and the crowd will grow to thousands, and likely all over the USA.

This is why no one wants to release the verdict. They know that the moment they say he's not being indicted (when all sane people know he SHOULD be) the protest movement has started all across America. Policing that, and controlling the media coming out of that, is not possible. There will be flashpoints, there will be abuses by the militarized police, and this will result in a larger and likely more violent movement.

I could never condone the kinds of things we saw in the UK a few years back, but this is what happens with mob mentality. It's not the protestors, it's individuals using that as a cover for something else (in and out of uniform). I have a feeling that unless the cop is indicted, there will be considerable protests and considerable violence across the country, with the ridiculously militarized police only fueling the problem and making it far worse.

I don't know it it's been shared here, but there are more than a hundred protests planned across the US. In addition to that, Anon has been been on a hacking spree, outing KKK members, (while the KKK has been making threats to kill) and claims to have found concrete evidence showing the cops direct links to the KKK.

originally posted by: Grovit
a reply to: Greven

nice play.
you ask for sources and when you get one, its not good enough.

I agree,

There is no denying that there are people who use protest movements to carry out crimes, this is a fact and trying to deny it is plain idiotic.

However, that DOES NOT nullify the complaint the people rightly have.

The public pays for policing, the police are there to protect and serve their EMPLOYERS - the people.
Shooting dead a teenager in the street is a crime, it is murder, regardless of how many cops are killed doing a dangerous job that they knew was dangerous when they signed up for it.

That teenager was not responsible for the deaths of police officers, no more than you are responsible for being getting cancer, or having car accidents, or falling under a forklift truck at work.

Trying to defend the actions of a (possibly) racist cop, shooting a kid in the street, for no appropriate reason, by giving stats on the crimes of others is not going to work with rational and intelligent people - it only works on idiots who simply want to justify the unjustifiable.

A grown man shot dead a teenager in the street.
In any sane country that is a crime, regardless of whether there was "suspicion", regardless of the uniform, regardless of the "dangers of the job".
Would we be quoting the dangers of the job and the fear these cops have as some kind of "excuse" if this officer had shot a baby in the head? How about a grandmother? How about a fire fighter? When does it become acceptable to kill someone because you have a gun and you're "scared"?

originally posted by: Greven

What we know of the video is that:
A) Brown was barely 18, only just able to buy tobacco, and had an expired driver's permit.
ok...so
B) The clerk gave Brown tobacco, which he passed to Johnson.
uh huh...with you so far
C) Some sort of altercation at the counter happened, which we still don't really know.
oh snap...an altercation? really...i go to the store all the time and i manage to not get in altercations with the clerk
D) Brown dropped a box, picked it up, hesitated, and began towards the door as Johnson put what he was given back.
headed for the door WITHOUT PAYING..
E) A clerk ran around the counter and attempted to physically prevent Brown from leaving, reaching for the door lock.
reaching for the door..his door. probably didnt want brown to STEAL the item..you think?
F) Brown pushed him aside and intimidated him as words were exchanged.
that would be assault and theft

what do you not get man? i didnt say anything about strong armed robbery blah blah....i said he committed a crime and he did...more than 1 actually...
you actually said the same thing you just do it in a round about long winded way...

people that commit crimes are criminals....you watched it.....i watched it..he did it.
just cause he was not convicted in 'criminal court' does not mean he did not do it

a reply to: Grovit

This will be a moot point when they announce Sunday that Wilson will not be indicted for shooting Brown. Then let the fun begin.

Al Sharpton is already organizing protests (read that riots) in 25 cities and he will be with the Brown family when they get advanced noticed so the word will be out to the rioters in advance of the police in those cities.

originally posted by: NavyDoc
Al Sharpton is already organizing protests (read that riots) in 25 cities and he will be with the Brown family when they get advanced noticed so the word will be out to the rioters in advance of the police in those cities.

That's kind of messed up. The only people who should be getting advanced notice, is the Schools & the emergency responders. That way kids & parents, are not stranded or separated ; And ambulances/Fire trucks etc. can be prepared incase something happens.

originally posted by: CrawlingChaos

originally posted by: NavyDoc
Al Sharpton is already organizing protests (read that riots) in 25 cities and he will be with the Brown family when they get advanced noticed so the word will be out to the rioters in advance of the police in those cities.

That's kind of messed up. The only people who should be getting advanced notice, is the Schools & the emergency responders. That way kids & parents, are not stranded or separated ; And ambulances/Fire trucks etc. can be prepared incase something happens.

You can't let a good crisis go to waste it seems.

originally posted by: Rocker2013

originally posted by: AgentShillington

Oh, come on. You don't think the war will be on the moment a cop in riot gear is photographed attacking an unarmed person in the wake of a decision about whether or not a cop should be accused of a crime?



This hasn't even started.

This is why no one wants to release the verdict. They know that the moment they say he's not being indicted (when all sane people know he SHOULD be) the protest movement has started all across America.

So, even if the evidence shows Wilson used lethal force to defend himself and a grand jury agrees not to indict, your judging them as not sane? Please tell me where you got your psychiatry/psychologist degree to diagnose someone's sanity.

originally posted by: WCmutant

You know that because you knew them? You have a time machine you are hiding from the rest of us?

Kind of. If by time machine you mean books and historical FACTS. Then ya, but they are not hidden silly.

I'm guessing if a black man was to do the same thing in the Boston harbor today (only damaging a lock) he'd be called a thug. Just a guess.

Goodness, that is a very racist thing for you to say. I didn't take you for such an ignorant person before. You should really work on that. Its not good to have such anger toward people because of the color of their skin.

a reply to: SheopleNation

video begins with the interruption of what was up until that point; a presumably peaceful protest?
i'll admit i watched to see if alot of feet sported the same brand of boot...

where was it that the "thugs" all wore the same boots?

originally posted by: mrsdudara

originally posted by: WCmutant

You know that because you knew them? You have a time machine you are hiding from the rest of us?

Kind of. If by time machine you mean books and historical FACTS. Then ya, but they are not hidden silly.

I'm guessing if a black man was to do the same thing in the Boston harbor today (only damaging a lock) he'd be called a thug. Just a guess.

Goodness, that is a very racist thing for you to say. I didn't take you for such an ignorant person before. You should really work on that. Its not good to have such anger toward people because of the color of their skin.

It smells like you are desperate not to lose. Calling me a racist when I am pointing out how PRECISELY you are romancing the stories (not facts), stories of the Boston Tea Party to diminish the fact that what the Sons of Liberty did over a Tea Tax wasn't thugish. (Never mind they got to write their own history of what happened.)

I'm guessing you believe the stories about Franklin Pierce in the book The Life of Franklin Pierce written by Nathaniel Hawthorne?

No comparison huh?

Can't fathom that the founding fathers had to be thugs to gain freedom from England? And worse, many did it dressed as Indians? Yet, you are all too willing to call the people of Ferguson thugs and criminals when they are standing up to decades of police brutality, and they do it by destroying some property?

You forget, not every Colonist agreed with the Sons of Liberty and others who were against England. Or did you miss that part of our history? Just as you and I sit here and I don't see people who are angry and pissed off for having to deal with police brutality in their communities as "thugs" and "criminals." I see them as human beings that are fed up.

Try to have your argument without name calling, because a couple of your previous posts were dangerously close to sounding way more racist than my simple example of how you are missing the point due to those rose colored glasses you were looking back at the founders of our country.

a reply to: murch

you're so cute

they have all the opportunity in the world to aspire to their goals,

one of their big hurdles is changing the minds that exist in their community and culture.

you cant stick some eagle wings on a squirrel and expect it to fly.

a reply to: WCmutant

Parliament at the time was an excessive control freak. Not unlike our government now. Tea (as well as sugar, and other things, but tea was the the focal point here) was a hot commodity. A big money maker. So, parliament passed a law stating that the colonists could only buy tea imported from Great Britain. Because of the taxes and excessive routes the East India company had to make, the tea was outrageously expensive. The smuggled tea from the Dutch ships, caused them to tax us extra.

It was NOT just a tax like what you pay today. This was war without the black powder.

In the 1760's Parliaments men took advantage of the colonists, using taxes and penalties to make them do what they wanted or for revenge. They were completely out of control.

People were protesting everywhere.

In 1768 it was the "Daughters of Liberty" who decided - after another tax was put on the tea - to take their stand by not drinking tea and passing the word that doing so was treasonous. Their money would not be spent on it.

The Sons of Liberty were trying to make a change instead of destruction. They passed out fliers with their intent, and they gained a lot of followers. All along the East coast at the ports, protesters successfully rejected tea and the tea was not unloaded from the ships.

In Boston, however, the Royal Governor refused to allow the tea to stay on the ships. SO while people began to worry because the protesters were becoming quite violent, the men - yes some in disguises of the time - boarded the ship and removed the tea from it in a way that made their point quite clear.

You are correct in saying that not everyone agreed with this. Some were for not rocking the boat, keep the peace no matter what, or they were loyal to Britain.

In response, Parliament decided that we were no longer allowed to self govern. Obviously that did not go over well. In 1776 a man later known as Thomas Paine wrote a pamphlet, Common Sense, that successfully encouraged everyone to come together , fight, and win the American Revolution.

NOW if you want to compare the protesters who destroyed buildings and gathered up the parliaments governors, strip them naked and poured boiling tar on them... then I will agree with you.

Comparing men and women who came together to make a change as peacefully as possible, then, no absolutely not.


As for your attempt at calling me a racist, it is a stretch made only by people who can not win an argument.

I am NOT a racist.

I judge all men and women by the content of their character never by the color of their skin, their religion, or any other quality that makes us all different. I have been on this site for 10 years. Feel free to find any of my posts that would suggest otherwise.

Now, all that being said, the argument about history repeating itself, is a good one. There are a lot of connections that can be made with the protests, government overreach, National Guard being called in and a lot of angry people.

The tea party protests pushed the government in charge into taking drastic steps that led to pain, suffering, and a lot of blood shed. But a really amazing country was born from it all.

Perhaps what happens next in Ferguson will push the government into taking more drastic steps that leads to drastic changes.

As much as I agree that some pretty big changes need to be made, I really hope it is without blood shed.

A relative of mine lives less than 10 minutes from Ferguson. She is scared to death. I hope it all just fizzles out.

a reply to: WCmutant

I agree WC mutant, first that The Sons of Libery were just that , and second this is simply an outlet for disgruntled masses to protest , but I feel they are going about it all wrong , using race doesnt help

It's kind of interesting how quickly "white" people have organized after hearing several "black" people during these last few weeks specifically state rioters would be going after "white" neighborhoods... On Reddit and Facebook, there's literally hundreds of people talking about the types of rifles they have mounted in the windows of their houses which can view their entire street. There's NFA owners that have hoarded ammunition for years for such a situation like this, and they legally own multiple collections of select fire rifles and sub machine guns. I really hope for the sake of everyone in that town that rioters don't attempt such asinine suicidal actions, it would not end well, this is Missouri folks, people are very heavily armed and fed up of being used as a scapegoat for cultural problems that exist.

originally posted by: Jocko Flocko
It's kind of interesting how quickly "white" people have organized after hearing several "black" people during these last few weeks specifically state rioters would be going after "white" neighborhoods... .

as a "person", if i heard that "people" were targeting my neighborhood for riots, i would be getting ready to rock too.
wouldnt anyone?

thats got nothing to do with race at all....

if any race/gender/religion/affiliation was targeting my neighborhood, i would be on guard.

a reply to: Greven

You're the one who claimed that the police were on the other side of town with the peaceful protesters, and not anywhere near the thugs right?

You can't even back up anything that you post, you just deflect every single time someone here proves you wrong. It's a joke guy. ~$heopleNation