Tired Of The Propaganda - "Support The Troops"

a reply to: MALBOSIA

When they decide to ETS and not reenlist I suppose. That's how it was for me. After three years, I had enough of the nonsense and got out. But that doesn't mean I won't support the people who came after me (and before me).

a reply to: Krazysh0t

I actually agree with the OP regarding Vietnam Vets especially those who were drafted. I feel uncomfortable when people thank me for my service because I volunteered. I'm grateful that they think of us Vets though.

And that is why I also thank others who are not Vets for their service to their community. Be it LEO's, Firemen, EMT's Doctors, Nurses, Linemen, etc, etc. Everybody who plays a part in keeping my community functioning.

originally posted by: MALBOSIA

originally posted by: projectvxn

originally posted by: MALBOSIA

originally posted by: projectvxn
a reply to: TheSpanishArcher

Funny, I thought the reason I had freedom of expression is because of the constitution.

And the United States Army.

They have lost every conflict they have been in for the last 50 years.

Freedom comes easy, I guess.

How so?

Just because politicians tie the hands of the Army and make political decisions in war doesn't mean we lost. The problem with modern day political thinking, and the Hollywood view of war is that people think there's a nice way to go and kill people. There isn't. And when it isn't palatable, politicians run away from it.

Every time they send you to war.... every time they are wrong... at what point does a military man say "enough is enough!"?

Never.

If the Army starts making its own decisions then every fear of tyranny you and I have will come to fruition.

a reply to: IShotMyLastMuse

I swore to support and defend the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic.

And to this day I still mean it, but no matter what I or any other oath keeper wants nothing can be done until the people awaken from their slumber to reclaim the nation.

Until such a time I will continue to use the system so I am better prepared when/if the house of cards falls.

Also I love my job.

a reply to: TDawgRex

Nope, not lazy just tired of the propaganda the media spews that ssays I'm a bad american for not supporting troops fighting wars that are not necessary nor are they fighting for any kind of freedom for me or anyone else.

I'm always pissed at my government for the crap they pull and these wars are just one of the things I'm pissed about. This is not about that, really, it's about the media telling me I should support troops unequivocally. No, no and NO!

Maybe if you read the words I typed, but no, that's no reason to take me seriously as you will never agree. Use logic, not strawmen, not emotions.

Oh, and voting is rigged before it ever happens,. The choice between the evil behind door #1 or the evil behind door #2 isn't voting, decided by those who have the money to join the club, even if I did vote does not mean I'm participating in actual voting for our representatives. It just means they have me fooled into thinking my vote counts, and it doesn't and never has.

a reply to: NavyDoc

Pretty much what I read into that as well. I think his answer will be that the soldiers in Vietnam were drafted, but he is in for a surprise when he finds out that only 25% of the soldiers in Vietnam were drafted. Which means that a three fourths of the soldiers signed up willingly and went through the same crap as the draftees.

Draftees vs. volunteers: 25% (648,500) of total forces in country were draftees

originally posted by: MALBOSIA

originally posted by: projectvxn

originally posted by: MALBOSIA

originally posted by: projectvxn
a reply to: TheSpanishArcher

Funny, I thought the reason I had freedom of expression is because of the constitution.

And the United States Army.

They have lost every conflict they have been in for the last 50 years.

Freedom comes easy, I guess.

How so?

Just because politicians tie the hands of the Army and make political decisions in war doesn't mean we lost. The problem with modern day political thinking, and the Hollywood view of war is that people think there's a nice way to go and kill people. There isn't. And when it isn't palatable, politicians run away from it.

Every time they send you to war.... every time they are wrong... at what point does a military man say "enough is enough!"?

Firstly, I disagree with the statement "every time they are wrong."

Secondly, you don't want the military to stop obeying the lawful orders of the politicians because when you do, you get what you do not want--a military dictatorship. There is a reason why the US is one of the few countries that has never, in it's entire existence, had a military coup and civilian control of the military is it.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: NavyDoc

Pretty much what I read into that as well. I think his answer will be that the soldiers in Vietnam were drafted, but he is in for a surprise when he finds out that only 66% of the soldiers in Vietnam were drafted. Which means that a third of the soldiers signed up willingly and went through the same crap as the draftees.

Well. Sympathy for Vietnam vets has been a cause celebre' for a while now. It is not cool or hip to be mean to them anymore.

a reply to: TheSpanishArcher

Daily I ignore what the media spews, you should be able to as well. And I believe that your vote does count at the local and State levels.

Stop concentrating on the Big Picture and start looking at all the little things that prop up the Big Picture. A Dam bursting always starts with a small crack.

I'm not saying ignore the Big Picture as that is the thing that gives you focus at the local level to change things.

originally posted by: TheSpanishArcher
This had been pissing me off for a while now. I'm really tired of being told that our troops are fighting for our rights, that they are fighting to bring Democracy to other nations, that they are fighting to keep us safe when nothing could be further from the truth.
.

Cos thats how I see it..

Any Troops that lost their life in the last 2 wars are simply stupid children who had the wool pulled over there eyes.

To die in vain.

a reply to: daaskapital

No one stands in place to protect the constitution. The government doesn't even follow the damned piece of paper.

Disrespectful is telling me I'm not a good American because I won't take their lies and bull crap as truth, and there's no way in hell I'm going to support ignorant fools (even if the media and society tell me I'm wrong and ruin me) that fight for a government that would rather have them dead. Why the hell do you think they don't fight the wars themselves? Because they don't have to, other idiots will do it for them. It's a rather easy way of killing people off, wouldn't you say?

As for being disrespectful, who are you to tell me I'm being disrespectful? Offended? Well, you don't have the right to not be offended as I have the right to say whatever the hell I want to and if you really want to get into it, I'll cite facts for days that support my thoughts.

Again, stop trying to guilt me, ain't a gonna happen. Try and use logic and facts to refute what I say but you can't, you can only come up with emotional arguments(sort of like when they throw out the "It's all about the children" line).

a reply to: TheSpanishArcher

dick move bro....dick move...

happy veteran's day to myself and other veterans out there and thanks for all the support through thick and thin that we have received...

I usually don't get involved in these types of conversations. I am an Army veteran, as was my father, who was a WWII veteran. My oldest son is an Army veteran. You say you are educated in the truth, but yet you say ALL soldiers kill. You are incorrect sir. If you truly have the knowledge you say you do of our armed forces, then you would know that there are hundreds of jobs that are non-combat related. We have doctors, lawyers, carpenters, veterinarians, cooks, mechanics, heavy equipment operators, surveyors, etc...I shouldn't need to go any further. Google is your friend. Do a search of military jobs in the Navy alone, and you'll be amazed at all the jobs they have that doesn't involve killing the enemy. There are even jobs that aren't deployable. So calling me an idiot for joining the military just to kill is, well ,showing that you aren't quite as educated in the military like you thought you were.

a reply to: TheSpanishArcher

OP? You have every right to say, think whatever you want.

I'd like to take the time and say thank you to everyone who did serve. That is my right.

*salute*

originally posted by: TheSpanishArcher
a reply to: WanderingSage



I don't have a job as I'm persona non grata pretty much everywhere in the corporate world and am not allowed to make money in this rigged system. Believe me, I'd love to go to work yet no one will hire me because the corporation has more rights than I do as a American citizen.


I'm paying a price far more than you are, I'm losing what little sanity I have left because the world has gone insane and there is no place for me because of y idealism. Yet I'm supposed to be happy this Veterans day and celebrate all those who have gone to fight for corporate interests instead of mine or any other American citizen. If you think what you are doing is noble because you are providing for your family, well then I have little to say to that as I find that as equally reprehensible as the Nazis claiming they were just following orders(Godwin's Law invoked only three pages in, yay for me).

If you don't have a job then what price are you paying? We are all contributing to society where as you are just one of those welfare people we have to pay for. If you're not collecting welfare then you're still a tumor. I remember when I was homeless I had no price to pay. Just wandered around stoned, ate, and slept. So what price are you paying exactly? Sanity? My ass. You're doing this to yourself. Your life sucks and you're looking for someone to blame. Stop blaming the government for your life and the choices you've made.

a reply to: Irishhaf

I swore to support and defend the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic.

Projectvxn said something about defending the U.S., if and when the time comes. Well, I'd like to know this. That's all well and good, so why are we fighting over there, for oil and whatever the hell else we are really fighting for? When the time comes that someone invades America, I'd like to see the armed forces do something about that.

It ain't happening, though. So yeah, I'd like to see, and I'm not necessarily talking about overthrowing the government, but I'd like to see those guys do something about EVERY DAMNED POLITICIAN WE HAVE RIGHT NOW who is in violation of their oath.

I see no reason to fight foreign enemies as they have not invaded our shores. There's the rub, see, we went and started wars based on events where the truth is shaky, at best and we KNOW FOR AS FACT that Vietnam was a result of lies told about what happened at the Gulf of Tonkin and the first and second desert Storms were based on lies.

They are fighting the wrong "enemies".

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Crikey, got reading comprehension? I said I don;t hold it against them as the information age had not arrived at that time. Geez, man, you are smarter than that. Read my bloody words.

a reply to: TheSpanishArcher

You are misguided. Military forces are required for the continued substance of nation-states. Without them, your state would be destroyed. As would your constitution and your rights. The military does actually stand in place to protect you, your way of life, your country and your freedoms.

It is quite clear that you are being disrespectful. You are deliberately slighting all service members on a day of remembrance. No one has to tell you that you are being disrespectful. You know you are.

In 'using logic and facts', i have concluded that our service members do serve to protect us and our freedoms. That they have stood up to forces in the past, and will do so in the future, in order to defend our liberties. That they are fundamental to the continued existence of our society. I'm sorry if you are too blind to see that.

a reply to: TheSpanishArcher

There is a veterans party starting, I'd link it but I suck at that using a phone.

Also for the record I hate being thanked.