Spider-woman and the Los Angeles Lizard People.

a reply to: Kantzveldt

Wow, thats a really cool story.

I think that all these supposed cave systems arent "set in stone", meaning that anyone who can dig an underground city can just move it deeper and remove all entrances to it if another city or population pops up above it.

Like if you see an ant hill, they wont build under a path that is well traveled, even if their entire colony is there. They will just move it deeper or out of the way.

I think all these theories of underground civilizations arent too far off. People just look for "openings" to the ant hill where the path became well traveled and ants stopped building.

Makes you wonder who is really an "earthling". Them or us.

I also dont believe in "reptile people". Its a common thread that scaled skin or scaled garb was WORN by ancient gods. The clothing of Adam was said to be made from the skin of an ancient beast that God set apart for the destruction of a former creation and slayed..a reptile.

This hide or skin was said to give special power or was agreed upon by men to make the wearer have spiritual authority over people.
Maybe the cargo cult type civilizations of the past saw the clothing of different races...like our Jeans or winter jackets, to be special snake people skin...because they were made with or looked like reptile skin.

A north-face jacket would make you look like a god to ancient people.

Quatzequatel, the feathered serpent, IMO was a guy or various people from this advanced civilization who wore the little feathers and gifted trinkets over his scaly specialized clothing that the tribute cultures he set up gave to him. These ground dwelling civilizations would need water, food, and other resources from the surface. People giving offerings world wide to Gods would provide these things for a culture trying to make its home underground. It would take several thousand years to get everything you need underground to a point where the surface can become scorched earth and your civilization could survive regardless. Thats why all early cultures were made to give tribute to Gods. Neanderthal had such a relationship with early man. Man is and always will be a slave /tribute culture looking to please someone who is smarter or stronger than they.

Just look at the will of people now to have aliens "come down and fix it all for us"...We would give them anything they asked....its hard coded into certain populations. We would become a cargo cult /tribute society once again. Old habits die hard.

There are allot of kinks and complex details to work out for a venture like that of making your surface dwelling civilization to become an underground one.....from getting breeds of animals genetically and biologically stable enough for subterranean life and a specific population size, to water purification works and plain old fashioned digging.

The Chinese have been digging for MANY decades and still only made big caves and large networks of caverns with no real independence from the surface....

a reply to: tadaman

Pretty much my thoughts on this. It would appear there was an ancient culture who did indeed where some type of scaly skin and were perceived as gods.

Look at Dagon for example:

en.wikipedia.org...

He was a man who wore the skin of a fish and was revered as a god...

a reply to: raymundoko

I wouldn't be so sure the map was created by Shufelt as the reports indicated possession of an ancient map, perhaps his part was only indicating were he believed the gold to be located and how the map correlated to the streets of LA, but he was obviously just a liability.

The Chumash inhabitants of the region did believe that they were created according to the likeness of the Lizard, you have seen all those ancient painted hands from around the world hidden beneath rock crevices, here's why;

Now, in the upper world there is a sacred stone. What makes it sacred is if you leave a hand print or foot print in the
stone, that print or impression will stay there forever.

The Sky people told Coyote that he could put his paw print in the sacred stone, but when he does, the Chumash people will then, have paws as hands forever. Coyote was very proud that the Chumash people would have paws like his and he was slowly lowering his paw towards the sacred stone, enjoying the moment. Coyote however, did not notice that Lizard had quietly snuck-up behind him. Just before Coyote was about to put his paw print in the sacred stone, Lizard ran between Coyote’s legs and put his hand print in the sacred stone.

Coyote chased after Lizard but, Lizard hid in a crack in the sacred stone. Coyote was so mad he howled as loud as he could, but when the other Sky people looked at the hand print of Lizard they all liked that much better

Chumash creation stories



I'm joking somewhat, but in considering the Tongva we must keep in mind they were an Uto-Aztecan tribe and that the myth we have been considering may have involved illustrating the connection between the various tribal groups and regions associated with the Hopi.



Uto-Aztecan languages


a reply to: tadaman

Certainly the connection between Qeutzalcoatal and Pahana of the Hopi is very strong, and the Hopi made the same mistake as the Aztecs;

Tovar [the leader of the Spanish] and his men were conducted to Oraibi. They were met by all the clan chiefs at Tawtoma, as prescribed by prophecy, where four lines of sacred meal were drawn. The Bear Clan leader stepped up to the barrier and extended his hand, palm up, to the leader of the white men. If he was indeed the true Pahana, the Hopis knew he would extend his own hand, palm down, and clasp the Bear Clan leader's hand to form the nakwach, the ancient symbol of brotherhood. Tovar instead curtly commanded one of his men to drop a gift into the Bear chief's hand, believing that the Indian wanted a present of some kind. Instantly all the Hopi chiefs knew that Pahana had forgotten the ancient agreement made between their peoples at the time of their separation. Nevertheless, the Spaniards were escorted up to Oraibi, fed and quartered, and the agreement explained to them. It was understood that when the two were finally reconciled, each would correct the other's laws and faults; they would live side by side and share in common all the riches of the land and join their faiths in one religion that would establish the truth of life in a spirit of universal brotherhood. The Spaniards did not understand, and having found no gold, they soon departed

Hopi Mythology