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ATS: Knights Templar Seek Papal Apology

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posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 10:10 AM
The Knights Templar was once one of the most influential organizations in Europe. It had the full blessings of the Vatican until Philip IV of France pillaged the organization of its monies to help fund France's war with England. It was the Pope Clement V who gave the nod to topple the organization. Now what little is left of the Knights Templar is seeking an apology from the Pope for what it views as unjust accusations that occurred 700 years ago.
Seven hundred years after they were denounced as heretics and condemned to torture and death, the Knights Templar are calling for a public apology from the Roman Catholic Church.

The secretive organisation which was formed at the time of the Crusades has written to Pope John Paul II requesting that the Vatican officially atone for the persecution of the order.

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.

If the knights had been doing the will of the Vatican, how was it that they were turned upon in this manner. Perhaps the Knights Templar had outlived their intended use, and had become more powerful than the Vatican had wanted them to be. More than likely it was the wealth that that the organization had collected that brought it under the envious eye of King Philip IV. Maybe they should ask France for an apology as well.

Related News Links:

Related Discussion Threads:
Knights Templar asking vatican for apology...
Knight of the Red Cross, Highest honour in York Rite Freemasonry?
Templar Treasure Tunnels

[edit on 1-12-2004 by dbates]

posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 02:01 PM
The Templars- from not really existing to now having hundreds of lodges and wanting the Vatican to apologize is amazing.

I've read lots of different cuts on the history of the Templar demise and still have questions. I just don't buy into the mantra that the King of France popped in and whacked them because he wanted their money.

The Templars were extremely powerful and militarily proficient. They also controlled vast sums of wealth. The Templars had castles from northern Scotland to North Africa and the Middle East at one time. They dealt opium with the Assassins and extorted protection money from travelers and princes.

The beginning stories about them protecting pilgrims never rang true either. The Hospitallers did that and did it on the cheap. The original Templars hung out in Jerusalem for years doing what?

No doubt they were a formidable force but they also were politically adept (apparently not as much as they thought.) No European prince/King stepped out to help them without taking their property in the process when Phil and the Vatican moved against them.

For the NWO crowd look no further than this. Had the Templars had their way every nation would be beholding to them. Great soldiers, fantastic bankers, but saints- no.

If the Vatican apologizes who next? The Cathars?

ATS thread same subject
ATS thread basic Templar stuff
Other ATS Templar threads- probably a dozen

Templar lore

Templar org
A great lady of Maraclea was loved by a Templar, A Lord of Sidon; but she died in her youth, and on the night of her burial, this wicked lover crept to the grave, dug up her body and violated it. then a voice from the void bade him return in nine months time for he would find a son.

This is from one of the Templar's own web sites! Necrophilia personified.

[edit on 1-12-2004 by JoeDoaks]

posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 03:16 PM
If there was any justice in the world the Cathars should get an apology also...

The Templars never ceased to exist in Scotland...Bruce never took their lands and money...

They hung out in Jeruselem, excavating the underground stables of the Temple of Solomon. The persecution wasn't just about the money, it was also about the Arc of the Covenant and the translation of the Tables of Testimony, and also a continuation of the Churches persecution of the Desposyni...

It is interesting that not only the Templars are seeking reconciliation with the Church of Rome but also reconciled is the Priory of Sion (Knights Chevalliers of Notre Dame).

posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 04:04 PM
Ask any Historian and he or she will tell you the Templars are an extinct Order, ask a Mason and he will tell you the Templar branch of Masonry is symbolic and there is no verifiable direct link between the Templars and Masonry.
The Templars in there original form are extinct and have been for a very long time. I would like to see some proof that these modern day Knights are in fact directly descended from the Knights Templar, I'm sure they could do that if they were in fact THE Knights Templar and not some Order created under that name in the mid 1800's.
I have no doubt the Templars should be pardoned by the Pope, the was no real proof that they committed any sin against God, Christ or the Church only confessions gained by dubious means.
I agree with the above poster about the Cathars, the should also be pardoned, what happened to them was far worse than what happened to the Templars.

posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 04:59 PM
Not in Scotland...

English historians should never ever be referenced with regards to Scots history, particularly under the German Hanoverian Royalty of modern day England.

During the persecution of the Templars the papal bull was completely ignored as whole of Scotland was excommunicated from the church at this time for taking up arms against King Phillipe's son in law Edward II of England. King David I of Scots granted the lands of Ballantradoch to the Templars in 1128 (now the village of Temple), more land was granted to the Templars later around the Lothians, Aberdeen and Ayr. In 1314 the Templars fought with the Scots Under Heri St Clair at Bannockburn and subsequently became very prominent in Lorne and Argyle.

From this time onwards each successive Bruce and Stewart heir was a hereditary Templar from Birth, with the clan Sinclair Templar Hereditary patrons and protectors of Scots masons. If you visit the Rosselyn chapel (built in 1446- finished 1486) you will see it is heavily adorned with squares, compasses, swords, trowels and various images of the Temple of Solomon.

Some Templars later reincorporated the order in Portugal as the Knights of Christ who equipped with maps from the Sinclairs (nei Norman St Clair) 'discovered' The America's, both Columbus and Vasco de Gama (1497) were knights of the order.

The current heir to the Scots throne is Prince Micheal Stewart of Albany, who like all that went before him since Robert the Bruce is a heriditary Templar, as is the Right Honorable Malcolm Sinclair, Earl of Caithness.

posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 05:11 PM
As far as conspiracy magnets go, the Knights Templar rate right up there with the best of them.

It seems a conspiracy theory isn't a classic conspiracy theory unless it somehow explains what became of the Knights Templar and what they are up to these days.

The fact that the Hertfordshire Knights are making this formal request for reconciliation is loaded with meanings of its own.

Do they truly represent the Knights Templar, or is this something more mysterious? I can't even begin to imagine what sorts of politics surround a group like this -- let alone adding the Vatican to the mix.

Fortunately, there is already a great deal of fascinating information provided by the responses to this thread, which are way above, in my opinion.

No matter how you slice it, this is the kind of news and commentary I come to ATS for. Major thumbs up!

posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 05:19 PM
The politics that surround this group are the politics of the Sangrael...

posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 05:20 PM
oops ... double posted...

[edit on 1-12-2004 by Flange Gasket]

posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 05:32 PM

Originally posted by Flange Gasket
The politics that surround this group are the politics of the Sangrael...

The Priory of Sion? Its an interesting story. Did the Templars guard the secret of Christs survival of crucification and protect his heirs. Its a fascinating story but, and this is just my opinion, thats all it really is. But on the other hand there were a lot of strange stuff going on at Rennes-le-Chateau so who knows. Theres no smoke without fire so they say.

[edit on 1-12-2004 by Janus]

posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 05:58 PM
I find this a little interesting. So, if I understand this correctly, the Knight Templars and an apology from teh Pope for him okaying the French jacking the Templar's gold and killing a whole bunch of them.

So, what they did to Muslims happened to them. I getcha. But they're asking for an apology.

Somehow, I find this akin to a Nazi war criminal asking for an apology from the Allies after they took all his hard-stolen Jewish treasure away.

Oh, did I mention they also taxed all those kindly pilgrims coming to see the Temple? This seems...bizarre at best to me.


posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 06:40 PM
Rumors, accusations, myths and truths-
With the Templars no one will (maybe someone could) prove which is which.

In Jerusaleum for years, while the Hospitallers protected pilgrims YET the Templars are recognized by the leading RC monk and given power equal to that of kings by the Pope.

Templars are well recognized for fearsome battle prowess.

Feared by friend and foe.

Templars charge for services and institute Europe-wide banking for a fee.

Rumored to found Switzerland.

Mythically destroyed by a second-rate King and the Pope.

Vast treasures disappear (much perhaps stolen from the Cathars?).

Political tie to Assassins (cast-off Islamic sect of killers).

(myths and rumors and truths intermixed)
Help Robert the Bruce defeat English, sail to new world and bury much of their treasure, found mining operations in Canadian region, form Pirate fleets that become scourge of Mediterranean and Caribbean for centuries, use skull and cross bones as flag, form masonic lodges throughout England and France to use as way stations for subversive travels, during Jerusalem stay excavate subterranean caverns and tunnels throughout not only the ancient temple area but other parts of city, lost Templar treasure fleet, settled a colony deep in the River Platt region of South America, obtained geometrical knowledge from Islamic scholars, obtained occult knowledge from Hebrew and Egyptian mystics, is there a Merovingian connection, how were they tied to the Cathars, did the Templars use underground villages or did they become satanists near their end, what happened to all the hundreds of clerics that maintained records and accounts, how many ships were sailed to the Sinclairs on that Friday the 13th, do they still exist . . .

There are a lot of questions regarding the Templars. I agree with all posted thus far. As pointed out by Janus, the group seeking an apology is suspect at best.
DeusEx hits the money angle early on.

Could be an interesting research project for someone.

posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 06:57 PM
I wonder if this request for an apology is coming fom the same guy who "leaked" the news about Templar tunnels under Hertford.

If so, this is probably nothing more than a publicity stunt for this guy's website.

If it is the same guy Tim Acheson, it should be noted that this is the top story on his site at the moment.

It should also be noted that the guy quotes himself and connects himself to the story.

[edit on 1-12-2004 by Leveller]

posted on Dec, 1 2004 @ 07:31 PM
Leveller, very interesting angle!

Could Tim Acheson be the Templar equivalent of Angelyne in the shadowy world of secret societies?

More to the point, is such a personality really compatible with the idea of a "secret society"?

Oh my, I must ponder this conundrum over tea straightaway!

posted on Dec, 3 2004 @ 03:41 AM
After 1312 "The Knights Templar" disappear from English and French record books being politically advantageous to regard them at the time as having been disbanded: They did however continue to exist in Scotland and Spain/Portugal under different guises, fighting for Robert the Bruce and playing at least a small part in the Battle of Bannockburn in 1314.

One of the many Holy Relics of the time The Brecbannoch, a very large battle standard, appears at the Battle of Bannockburn carried by Henry de Monymusk. This was given to Henry prior to the Battle, by the Abbot of Arbroath, to be kept in perpetuity by his family. The Brecbannoch was one of the more important Scottish relics of the Middle Ages. Henry also acquired the lands at Forglen as part of the Brecbannoch's dowry. The Templar holdings in Scotland not acquired by the Hospitallers were given by Bruce to his loyal followers, who previously had not held property. Many Templars were the younger sons of the existing Nobility, and since the life of a Knight was a far better option than taking the cloth to be shut up in a closed Monastic order, they joined the Order of the Temple.

By 1320 King Bruce was back in Papal favour and he considered it politic to be seen to be observing the Papal Decree. In order to ensure the continuing liberty of those Templars loyal to his Cause he formed the Royal Order of Scotland: This Order, like the modern Knights Templar, continues to this day.

More Scots history of the Templars.

posted on Dec, 3 2004 @ 06:48 AM
Quote: " Lost Templar treasure fleet... obtained geometrical knowledge from Islamic scholars, obtained occult knowledge from Hebrew and Egyptian mystics, is there a Merovingian connection... tied to the Cathars".


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