Teaching Creationism As Science Now Banned In All UK Public Schools

a reply to: seagull

'Science' ain't science either.

To borrow your own quote: "Not in any shape, fashion, or form."

Just like all other forms of religion, it merely pretends to be something it is not.

Like the below quote says, 'Science' can be and IS abused for the sake of religious or anti-religious preconceptions.

The High Priests perform their statistical rituals and the cultists genuflect reverently before their idol, Science. And it's all very impressive until the truth is discovered spectator.org...

How do you know if you have fallen prey to the cult of 'Scientism'? Answer this question: Can you differentiate between the collective human understanding of 'how' things work in our material world, and the 'why' of how they came to be that way. (or even why it does what it does at all.) Those are two very different questions, that scientists, (who frequenty are very bad philosophers,) often get mixed up. Never forget that 'science' can be as abused for the sake of religious or anti-religious preconceptions as equally as the Bible can be, on both sides of a debate.

This becomes readily obvious when you investigate the unquestioned assumption that most Atheist-leaning scientists tenaciously hold on to as their 'modus operandi'. One way to state this foundational belief is: "Only statements that are verifiable through a scientific method can be held as truth, or objectively knowable."

Combating the cult of "Scientism."

originally posted by: NihilistSanta
a reply to: grainofsand

Yes well the nearly 20% (18.5) unemployment rate for youth 16-24 in the UK says otherwise.

853,000 young people aged 16-24 were unemployed in February to April 2014, down 59,000 on the previous quarter and down 98,000 on the previous year. The unemployment rate (the proportion of the economically active population who are unemployed) for 16-24 year olds was 18.5%, down 1.3 percentage points from the previous quarter and down 2.0 percentage points from the previous year.

You're own link shows it is falling and rapidly too. It was something called the recession you know.

originally posted by: NihilistSanta
College graduates faring no better it seems.

"The pre-recession rates of underemployment of graduate skills in the UK economy were already disappointing – the post-recession rates represent an alarming jump in underemployment and a massive waste of investment in skills," said John Philpott, director of The Jobs Economist consultancy. "These figures further highlight the plight of young people in the jobs market at present. The fact that the unemployment rate for recent graduates (9%) is much lower than that for non-graduates is due simply to the fact that almost half of those who have recently gained higher education qualifications are entering jobs for which they are over qualified, which makes it even harder for the less qualified to find work."

Half of recent UK graduates stuck in non-graduate jobs, says ONS

Clearly more theoretical science is the answer. Good thing you people are focusing on the big issues like creationism. Hey at least your grads don't end up with the type of debt that US students do.

Many "graduates" have wasted 3-4 years at Uni learning a nonsense, Mickey mouse degree in Social Media, or Testicular Studies. It's no wonder many can't find "graduate" work. Do a proper course, like Engineering, Science etc and you will get a job.

originally posted by: NihilistSanta
You can ignore the employment data when considering the effectiveness of your countries education system if you want but it wont change facts. I can tell from the lack of comprehension about the OPs story and your spin that things are not as merry as you may believe.

"Employment data" is simply a snapshot of a particular slice of time - I could show you "employment data" from pre-2008 which would show the opposite.

It is ironic you say that grainofsand can't see the "big picture" when you're focussing on a sliver of time after the biggest economic crash in 100 years. Of course youngsters will find it hard to get work, as employers want experience. You're own articles show youth unemployment falling, month on month, though. Give it 12 months and unemployment will be another distant memory for most and there will be some news article about booming house prices or souring inflation..

As far as our education system is mind you, we're actually ranked in the Top 10 for the World and have been for years.

originally posted by: Unity_99
a reply to: NoRulesAllowed

No, but it should be theories, and lots of them, and students putting on thinking caps. Not just one theory or concept.

There is a world of difference between me having a "theory" and a Scientific Theory.

One is me suspecting my neighbour is abusing my cat just because it is what I believe - the other requires reams of evidence to be even considered a "theory". I'll let you figure out which is which.

a reply to: Murgatroid

Just as religion has its zealots, so, too, does science. Science can't solve every problem, any more than religion/faith can.

One needs to inform the other.

Religious belief at its best instills an ethical system that science desperately needs so as not to be abused. Science can, at its finest can do the same with religious belief.

Zealotry is the enemy. Not religion. Not science.

a reply to: Murgatroid

Science is not a religion. Religions are full of myths that can't be verified. Science is full of facts that can be verified. Can someone please explain to me why the Know-Nothings appear to be rising again in the USA? This kind of anti-science rubbish is baffling.

a reply to: AngryCymraeg

Unless I'm totally misunderstanding him, he is saying that many seem to think that science has all the answers. Or, so I surmise.

There is no denying that many do, indeed, think that.

...and some things science just can't explain. Yet. ...or maybe never. On that I agree. Just as I also believe that religion, of whatever faith, doesn't either.

a reply to: wayforward

2.000 miles?

The DfE handles Education in England and Wales, so the maximum distance between it an the furthest school is no more than 300 miles...

As for "freedom of speech" - there is nothing stopping you starting up and funding your own school to teach what you like. You could even teach the utter bollocks that is the Bible and no one would care. They'd only take notice if you started helping yourself to State funding for this wacky outfit of yours.

Get back in your box.

originally posted by: seagull
a reply to: AngryCymraeg

Unless I'm totally misunderstanding him, he is saying that many seem to think that science has all the answers. Or, so I surmise.

There is no denying that many do, indeed, think that.

...and some things science just can't explain. Yet. ...or maybe never. On that I agree. Just as I also believe that religion, of whatever faith, doesn't either.

I think that no scientist would ever claim that science has all the answers. They'd be far more likely to say that we need to do a lot more research to confirm things.

a reply to: AngryCymraeg

No ethical scientist would. The key word there is ethical.

...and I find that ethics are becoming more and more a rare bird. In science. In religion. In life in general.

Science doesn't have all the answers, and probably never will. Each question it answers, leads to two new ones.

However what science can answer, is supported by masses of testing, or evidence, or both. That's something religion can't do. It can't be tested, nor is there any real hard evidence. Thats why one is religion, the other is science.

One other thing that differentiates science from religion. If data appears to prove an existing scientific theory wrong, in general, the data gets verified and reverified, and if the data is found to be accurate, the theory is adjusted to fit the data, or even discarded entirely, and a new theory proposed.

Religion just buries its head in the sand and says 'no no no no no no... go away'.

a reply to: wayforward

Erm, what a pile of ridiculous crap.

The Government is charged with the well-being of nation, of which Education is a key part. It is the responsibility of the Government to ensure that the next generation of it's citizens are well equipped to take the nation forward. Allowing State funding to be used for such obvious bullcrap would be criminal.

If you want to teach such obvious bullcrap, do so at your own expense.

a reply to: BMorris

That's not what religion is. Or not supposed to be, anyway...

Religion is about faith. Faith that there are answers to questions, even if they aren't evident to us.

In an ideal world each should inform the other. IMHO.

a reply to: wayforward

I am sorry but that is the most strangled and obtuse twisting of the definition and meaning of "free-speech" I have ever read.

The truth is not subject to a vote or a belief. It simply is.

a reply to: stumason

...or perhaps "how to avoid condescension 101".

Sometimes I don't write a whole BOOK in a post, so I miss things...like specifics of how one concept interacts or may be interrelated to another.

Sorry for the confusion, and yeah... No kidding.. Evolution doesn't have a lot to do with the moment of life's transition from goo in a pool to self aware and sentient life. There is a bit in between.

a reply to: Wrabbit2000

Sorry if it came across as condescending, but normally, Wrabbit, I think of you as a highly intelligent chap - In fact, I am actually surprised to find you in amongst the God botherers - so I wouldn't have thought you'd fall into the trap of having evolution try to explain origin.

For the record, as it has been mentioned a few times in this thread (not by your good self), I am not an Atheist but rather an Agnostic.

originally posted by: AngryCymraeg
Science is not a religion. Religions are full of myths that can't be verified. Science is full of facts that can be verified. Can someone please explain to me why the Know-Nothings appear to be rising again in the USA? This kind of anti-science rubbish is baffling.

Science says so therefore it MUST be true...

facts that can be verified...

Correction: hoax's and fraud that have been verified...

Where did you hear that?
Science.
And you believed it?
Yeah. They can't put anything in Science that isn't true.
Where did you hear that?
Science.

Like I said, Science like all other forms of religion pretends to be something it is not.

With respect to its great contributions to society, I think it is important to make a case that science is really affecting society more like a religion now than a field of study or a resource base of useful information. Many everyday people do not understand it at all and accept ALL its teachings on faith. Unfortunately some scientists and academic professionals are not so noble and have perpetrated deliberate frauds and cover-ups of important discoveries.

Modern Scientific beliefs are based upon a leap of faith in the big bang theory. It has become a belief system based on faith and therefore another form of religion. Scientists, like priests can explain their beliefs but the everyday people accept it all on faith. Scientists and doctors are the priests of this new religion, getting angry and crying "heresy" when anyone respectfully disagrees with them.

Has Science become a Religion

Science - The Illuminati Religion and Mind Control Tool for the Masses

"Throughout recorded history, the Illuminati has successfully withheld from humankind major aspects of history and science in order to subjugate the masses"

"Historical, religious and political truths have been withheld from the general public in order to perpetuate armed conflict," he continues. "Similarly if the presently suppressed technology were to be made commercially available, disease, famine and environmental pollution virtually would become eradicated."

By manipulating the souls evolving on earth, the Illuminati have deliberately suppressed the spiritual facts of life, not to mention liberating technologies, which could bring plenitude to all.

Secrets of Suppressed Science and History

>>
Can someone please explain to me why the Know-Nothings appear to be rising again in the USA? This kind of anti-science rubbish is baffling.
>>

it is indeed correct or at least it seems so that more "anti-science" beliefs and stances are there today...but this is not surprising because a lot of our modern world, "science" has also brought forth bad things. So..increasingly more people are skeptical about traditional medicine, "traditional" science etc. and BASICALLY this is a good thing.

However, people make a big mistake. It's almost as if it's "hip & trendy" to be skeptical and "anti-establishment"...but then the same skepticism should ALSO apply to anything else, like pseudo-science theories, books, websites etc.

But THEN their skepticism obviously does not apply! They swallow any alternative theories like candy and don't dare to ask the same questions they would ask with an established theory. Because their BIAS makes them automatically drawn-to anything which is anti-science/establishment which, by default, is seen as "good", SIMPLY because it goes against the mainstream.

Snake-oil salesmen and pseudo science book authors can make big bucks today because people have become naive and uncritical.

Rather than having become *really* skeptical about science...they just changed sides. They THINK they are skeptical because they reject whatever official theory but have no problem believing what they read one some pseudo/fringe site forum. They have not become skeptical, they have become gullible.

a reply to: Murgatroid

(Facepalm)
Science is NOT a religion. It's testable. It changes as new facts are verified. It's also apparently very badly understood by people like yourself.

a reply to: AngryCymraeg
Maybe these people who struggle to grasp that science is not a religion were taught in schools which were allowed to bring religion into science classes. I notice there are not many Brits coming out with that rubbish, maybe it is a sign that our ban on such practices in tandem with dedicated religious awareness education classes in state schools is a sensible, fair, and rational middle ground.