Ruins of Ancient industrial Base City or Spaceport near Newton Crater.

originally posted by: LABTECH767
Is is not nonsense at all, the image of Tracy's rock was never shown five month at to be fake though a poster claimed on another thread that it was so, Let's see if there is voracity to that very slanderous assertion, can you provide both the Catalogue and Expedition frame to back up your point and if not then thank you for the great airbrushed image from the CATALOGUE but please if you are so very certain that it is fake why not do as they did and obtain through the freedom of information a copy of the Expedition frame, they had to run through loop's and threaten legal action to obtain it and it is that I have uploaded so sorry if it does not fit your two dimensional a-b view of history or they world or if it scares you a little and make your spine tingle in an unpleasent fashion as they were more advanced than us and were they hell are they, they fell and so too may or even will we.

If you read my previous post you would see that what they call the "Expedition frame" is so called because it comes from the book called Apollo: Expeditions to the Moon, published in 1975. It is not some secret photograph, as you claim.

This book is available in full on the NASA website. Or you can buy it on Amazon . So why on Earth would you need to go through a Freedom of Information request to get it?

The image that is "not available anywhere on the internet" is right here, on this page: history.nasa.gov...



As you can see, it is a scan from a printed book in which the panorama goes across both pages, hence the reason it doesn't line up properly in the centre.

Alternatively, as onebigmonkey posted above, the exact same panorama appears on the cover of the Apollo 17 Preliminary Science Report. He posted a photo of the actual publication, and a scanned version is available online here.

And here are the two images that make up the assembled panorama:

www.hq.nasa.gov...


and www.hq.nasa.gov...

a reply to: Rob48

You might want to check back rob, after looking the post showing possible tampering (After I typed the reply) I went back and edited that part.
You know I used to know a Rob over here in blighty, a fantastic Technician whom took his chemistry degree and went on to work as a teacher at our colledge, great lad but mad as a hatter, there was a very large spillage of mercury so after we evacuated the lab he then with a cloth face mask (honestly no protection at all) he used distillation in the open environment, bunson burner and bukner flask style to repurify the several kilograms of liquid mercury, we did not breath it in but he certainly did, mad as a hatter but one of the nicest mad people you could ever meet.
And it is not Rubbish or Trash as the yanks say, As you know modern obfuscation techniques have come a very long way since the early 1970's so what proof do you have that the modern information is actually not censored on release, especially if it is NASA originated, I have the utmost respect for NASA but not for whom it take's it's behind the scenes orders from on this matter, Oh did you know the Shuttle tiles were partially developed here in england at Pilkingtons laboratory's under contract, a friend of mine actually had two of the reject tiles given him by his father when they failed tests so what a security lapse on there part eh, top secret thermal tiles taken home from work by a laboratory worker, they looked more aluminum than white at that stage.

my god, how did this thread hit TWO pages?

are rocks, craters, and shadows, REALLY that interesting?

a reply to: Daedalus

YES, it is only by looking into the dark that we overcome our ignorance and when wrong it matters if we are shown such (and that is how we grow) but if right that we prove our point but not pig headed stupidly, Rob showed some very interesting analysis which has thrown me over Casey's rock and may have persuaded me, still that was only to add to the subject that is nothing to do with casey's rock and has to do with possible geometric patterning, ancient site's on earth are often seen at sun set or sun rise with the sun at an angle so that slight devations become more apparent and if this site is buried an overhead angly shot with the sun also high would hide the evidence unless it was with the sun at an oblique angle so the downward image of the site proves nothing at all.

The apollo 17 image with the possible ancient astronaut body though is real and not tampered (At least except possibly by nasa) as it is an original nasa image I downloaded myself and not from that site though it was that site which first showed it as such.
Have a look at the first piece of debris to the left which I made a blow up of, why is a domed piece of supposed rock supported on one side by a flange like bent buckled piece of metal and it does have similarity to the russian lunar project but is obviously far far older unless the rusky's never wanted the world to know about an accident and failed mission to the moon Eh.
The closest someone has come to debunking that is to show images from other part's of that crater on which the artifacts did not appear so even if you debunk and possible successfully (well you have convinced me) the casey rock image the other is still valid and like I said there is power and prestige resting on later lunar image's so how can we truly trust them to not be altered.

originally posted by: LABTECH767
a reply to: Daedalus

YES, it is only by looking into the dark that we overcome our ignorance and when wrong it matters if we are show such but if right that we prove our point but not pig headed stupidly, Rob showed some very interesting analysis which has thrown me over Casey's rock and may have persuaded me but I am not up for admitting that just yet, still that was only to add to the subject with is nothing to do with casey's rock and has to do with possible geometric patterning, ancient site's on earth are often seen at sun set or sun rise with the sun at an angle so that slight devations become more apparent and if this site is buried an overhead angly shot with the sun also high would hide the evidence unless it was with the sun at an oblique angle so the downward image of the site proves nothing at all.

I think that's the longest sentence I've ever read.

a reply to: draknoir2

Could be. And why do conspiracy theorists always use "whom" instead of "who"? Labtech must be the third one with this particular stylistic quirk I have come across in recent days. Do they think "whom" is what educated people say?

Have a look at the first piece of debris to the left which I made a blow up of, why is a domed piece of supposed rock supported on one side by a flange like bent buckled piece of metal and it does have similarity to the russian lunar project but is obviously far far older unless the rusky's never wanted the world to know about an accident and failed mission to the moon Eh.

This one? What we're looking at here is what professional geologists call "a rock partly hidden behind another rock".

To be exact, a rock up on the crater rim in the background, casting a shadow, with the base of it partly hidden by a big irregularly shaped rock on the downslope in front of it.

Here is some information about the Air brushing that went on at NASA. www.abovetopsecret.com...= - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...

Ah yes, the information that shows Donna Hare is full of it.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Well rob why to debunkers alway's fall back on attacking grammer is there an intent to show the other party as less then competant, it is a very long tested and known psychological technique, NO you are wrong this is not a rock behind another rock at all, now you are getting flaky, I will hand it to you that the casey's rock explanation you provide is very good indeed but not this one.
And can you prove the negative that they (lunararcheaology.org) claimed to have obtained through persistant repeat freedom of information requests is tampered or that they used the technique you claim as I am still not totally convinced and am looking at the image to try to detect pixel sheer which I can not find, can you.
In other word's now you are talking total tripe.

a reply to: LABTECH767

Now I am a firm believer that there are relics and artefact's on the moon but not convinced of there relation to either us or an alien race as I believe they are very ancient indeed, this does not preclude however that such ancient structure's may have been repurposed by visitor's at a later date and indeed may also have been or be one day repurposed by our own military.

My thinking exactly.

Most, if not all of the artifacts, i believe are ours - or rather the achievements of those who came before us and whom we've unfortunately forgotten for whatever reason.

But as you say, if they were built to last...it's entirely possibly others have been and possibly still are using them as bases of operation. 'Others' could be anyone, including our own black project, contemporary people from right here on Earth.

But yes, they're there and the power structures we know and love really don't want us to know about them, at least not yet anyway.

And again:



My own actual real copy of National Geographic from September 1973.

On another matter raised, I look at the correct use of the possessive apostrophe and spelling as indicative of the diligence of the person with whom I am discussing something. If they can't be bothered to get those right, what chance is there of their 'facts' being correct?

a reply to: MysterX

My thought's exactly but I believe they may be further back, convergant evolution has over the past 65 million years alone brought forth several almost identical but totally unrelated species of rhinocerous like animals as it was a successful evolutionary model and yet there is a firm unchallenged belief that humanity could only have evolved once, though I tend also to believe humanity is far older than the current model.
On another thread I pointed out the prevalence of modern third world beleifs in past civilization especially in india such as the rama empire and the Atallan whom they were at war with (atalla the white isle at the naval of the world) but I also pointed out that in those places it was actually more likely that the empire of which they speak in there religion if it is at all real (though there is no ACCEPTED evidence) would likely have been elsewhere and in such a war have been totally anihilated leaving only the third world of that period as the less damaged area's but of course famine and hunger sped on by an ice age precipitating nuclear winter would have done for civilization even there with the survivors fragmenting into xenophobic social group's and tribes at war for the meagre resources with the other survivors over several generations, so under that scenario what would have survived of there knowledge.

I will accept this as fact given that it is a 1973 image, and you are a great source of information on that matter and thank you for sharing this scanned document, it must be quite a valuable asset to you after all of this time, I was only three then so thank you again.
Still though it is still a great rock and of course you have seen this hilarious skit on the net.
conceptships.blogspot.co.uk...
Scroll down you cant miss it.

I know you to be an actualy very knowlegable and I daresay authority on many space related matters but though this thread may not be the place for it have you never been suspicious of any of there image's.
Well as for the spelling I disagree with you, did you know einstein used to lose his key's all the time, got lost frequently on the way home even though he lived very close indeed, apparantly his wife fixed half his equations as well, not that I am equating myself with einstein you understand.

Also as one whom grew up staring at a telescope all night when I was supposed to be asleep you must understand I would not willingly lead other's astray so only upload what I at the time believe, the image of casey's rock they claimed that you show was claimed to be a public release image and one that had been tampered with, they also avoided the whole UFO scene or may still be up there today with advertisers moving is as they are very popular site's are they not, but Lunar archeaology org as I states had no advertising and were run from a university campus, the vanished about 6 to 8 years ago but the last time I archived there site for my own curiosity as I did not have internet back then was closer to ten years ago, they had university staff among there members and even when I was in academia as a young man most of our lecturers believed in an alien presence so it is not simply naive uneducated individual's but professor's and doctor's whom believe this.

a reply to: LABTECH767

the problem is that i (and most other people) don't see any of these things....we see rocks, craters, and shadows..

you're the one seeing things that aren't there.

i mean, if you were to post something that was clearly NOT a rock, crater, or shadow, i'd be all over it..as i said, i want us to find evidence of life, or past life out there as much as anyone...but this stuff is just rocks...

a reply to: Rob48

"whom" is most often more grammatically correct than "who" in the majority of situations...just thought i'd throw that out there...

on topic: you are correct sir...it's rocks..

a reply to: Daedalus

That is fine deadalus and I agree with you, it is what is in the eye of the beholder that matters (two many beer's have led to many a broken heart the next day) and some thing's may look completely different to different people, this I truly respect and acknowlege your point thoroughly.
Perfectly stated case and indeed this is why we have juries in criminal cases as even the judge can not see without some level of bias and I must admit I am biased in my belief on this matter having stared at some of these image's for hours.
Of course sometimes we do see shapes in the clouds and this fundemental human trait is one of the reasons humans can actually grasp abstract phenomena and theory so it is the very basis of theoretical research as a human trait, which is why scientists ARE ARTISTS.
Anyway have a look at that image on the above post, the site is a heavy loader as it uses animated images but it is well worth a quick chuckle.

originally posted by: Daedalus
a reply to: Rob48

"whom" is most often more grammatically correct than "who" in the majority of situations...just thought i'd throw that out there...

Hardly "the majority of situations". It depends entirely on whether it is an object or a subject. (I'm a copy editor by profession )

But enough of the grammar hijack. Yes, rocks. End of thread.

a reply to: Rob48
Ah that explains the propensity for attacking someone's grammatical ability, nevertheless I will accept as I say the point you made over casey's rock but still hold you to that challenge and do not agree at all with your assertion that the first piece of debris like object is a stone behind a stone, indeed I think that is a very poor argument to follow such an elegant and even extremely convincing argument you made for your opinion of tampering on that image of casey's rock I downloaded from that other now deceased site.
Given the freely available image of casey's rock you and others use every time I have shown this I would believe it myself but given that the site I downloaded it from was not a cook dumb brained fantasy site and made no money from there work but merely presented the data for anyone whom looked to see it (no post section so not a conspiracy site and no membership, no advertisment's etc) the idea they would manufacture such is not only questionable but it seem's even ridiculous especially since they where putting there reputations on the line.

Great thread and effort LABTECH767

I will say it again, i have said it in the past many times, History is not as the school books present it! They hide from us the true History!

ATS members, I advice and urge everyone who wants to know more than school "taught" him, more than NWO wanted him to know, more than the average people know to make a trip into the corridors of the ancient History.

Read the ancient Greek Orphic Texts about the astric wars, about the space travels, about the battles on the surface of the Moon and Mars.
Read about Lucian, the ancient Greek writer and his travels on the Moon, on Mars, his meetings with the king of the Moon and the spaceships he saw.
Read the ancient Hindu Texts called "vaimanika shastra" and all the relevant texts and stories which describe a step to step guide about the creation of a spaceship which moves with antigravity!!!
Read about Hesiodus, the ancient Greek writer who also described the "war of gods", read about battlers much more interesting and bigger than the battles of the movies "Star Wars" or "Star Trek"! Read about technology thousands of years ahead of ours!
Read about the Hindu epic called "ramayana", too! Technology you cannot even imagine is being described carefully in texts which were written 7000 or 10000 years BC!
Read about the epic of Gilgamesh who lived around 5000 BC and visited the moon in order to do his labours, exactly as Hercules did his. Read about the trips that are being described there and the extremely advanced technology!

The knowledge is out there! Go and find it! Search about what they intentionally hide from the public and see that the NWO wants you dumb and "blind"!

As for the moon and the apollo missions





simply search in the web for "Apollo 20 mission"

a reply to: JesusChristwins

Well though I do not like quoting or linking to them the Nazi party of germany before the war had a extremist bunch of mainly pagan occultists whom were convinced along with some of there scientists that a superior age had existed (and they decided to appropriate it as a german age so embraced the idea conveniently forgetting if they were right then all humans wer descended from it), the Ahnanerb as they were called sent out many expeditions to india, Nepal, Tibet, china even antarctica where admiral bird is purported to have led operation high jump, a supposed scientific mission to map the continent in 1947 made up of the following, several thousand armed marine's, destroyer's, tankers, an aircraft carrier, an armed submarine and various planes and fighters www.south-pole.com...
The mission CLASSIFIED,

www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...

The nazis worked on exotic propulsion ideas some of which they supposedly recieved via Ahnanerb operations from the recovery of ancient information and a great book about some of there project's called 'the hunt for zero point' was published back in the ninetys by a former janes aviation weekly reporter called Nick Cook.
In the book he researched the infamous nazi bell a mystery anti gravity device which needed to be chained down to four steel reinforced concrete posts which still exist to this day as evidenced by the photographs in his book along with the steel loops used to hold the chains and several other exotic experiments, as the nazi's only reluctantly used einsteins theory's they were actually more driven to use the very early quantum science which was then in it's infancy as it had apparently been cleared by there nazi overlord's as of german origin.

Remember the allies or more specifically the american military with einstein and several other top physicist carried out the infamous philidelphia experiment at the same time and over hambourg allied bombers after late 44 had to fly over five thousand feet not only to avoid flack but also it was rumoured that there angines would cut out and on the ground some civilian reports also say petrol engined would not work so only diesel engines worked which makes me think they may also have developed a nazi EMP generator to interfere with electrical igniton systems and this too was I beleive mentioned in nick cook's book.

Here are some sites that disagree about it's actual nature but all admit it existed, strange though for a particle accelerator to need to be chained down.

en.wikipedia.org...
sites.google.com...
www.paranormalpeopleonline.com...
www.theepochtimes.com...
www.roswellufomuseum.com...
projectcamelotportal.com...

I see this as being on thread as to see the whole structure can make thing's more clear though it can also be enough to make it more confusing as well.

There are many whom believe that this is what is called antideluvial science being recovered and of watcher origin.

But whatever the truth of it's origins it remains a possible ancient technology which may be tied to the ruin like structures on the moon.

This is related to the second video you included in your post,
www.abovetopsecret.com...
I believe there is something there but also believe there is dis information on that one floating around the net.

originally posted by: JesusChristwins

As for the moon and the apollo missions


simply search in the web for "Apollo 20 mission"

...and you will see that "Apollo 20" was just an extremely poorly done hoax job/art project using Photoshopped versions of existing Apollo photography.

For example, that elaborate "city" is just a painting pasted over an image from Apollo 17.



On the right, "Apollo 20". On the left, image AS17-134-20437, as seen at www.hq.nasa.gov...

The city itself is by an artist called Bruce Pennington and appears in a book called Eschatus: Future Prophecies from Nostradamus.

The "spaceship" is simply a hill that was photographed on Apollo 15, which looks like a cylindrical object due to the lighting. High-resolution photos show it is just a hill.



This was all proven nonsense more than 4 years ago right here on ATS.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

originally posted by: LABTECH767
a friend of mine actually had two of the reject tiles given him by his father when they failed tests so what a security lapse on there part eh, top secret thermal tiles

What makes you claim that they were "top secret"?