U.S.: Russian planes flew near California, Guam, in upped activity

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The head of U.S. air forces in the Pacific said on Monday that Russia's intervention in Ukraine had been accompanied by a significant increase in Russian air activity in the Asia-Pacific region in a show of strength and to gather intelligence.

General Herbert "Hawk" Carlisle said the activity had included Russian flights to the coast of California, and around the U.S. Pacific island of Guam.

Carlisle said the number of long-range Russian patrols around the Japanese islands and Korea had increased "drastically." He said there had also been "a lot more ship activity as well."

U.S.: Russian planes flew near California, Guam, in upped activity

Russia is now reconnoitering California and Guam in a show of strength. What does this say that Putin is able to fly all the way to California. We know Guam is now in a precarious situation, do we hold on to that in the event that Russia should then "annex" Guam or the Aleutians?

Frightening, that's my opinion.

I guess this is why the U.S. spy plane had such unusual activity on the west coast, messing with air traffic control accidentally?

a reply to: WarminIndy

Bluster.

Russia only has a handful of long range bombers that are no significant threat to anyone. they started trying to fly them a bit more often 3-4 years ago as was reported at the time.

the old Tu-95 turboprops are marvels of aerospace engineering - but also death traps in case of any significant air defence being present.

the Tu-160's are much more modern and capable, but only 36 were ever built, many were experimental a/c, and between 2008-2013 numbers in service were reported as being between 4 and 16.

the Russians have apparently contacted to produce 1 new one every 2 years (yes - every TWO YEARS) until they have 30 available.

a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

Russia loves to harass. They're just letting the U.S. know they're there. My dad was in the navy during the cold war and he has stories about Russian ships buzzing them in the Mediterranean. Probably up to their old tricks.
Think of it as your psycho ex cruising by your house every now and then to glare but never stop.

a reply to: WarminIndy

www.abovetopsecret.com... Already been covered here a few Days ago.I'm not going to dig at you and say use your search or anything sarcastic like that.It's rude and has been done to me many times.All sweet no bad

a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

You are aware of the fact the Russian Federation is in the middle of a very dramatic modernization and rebuilding effort, right? Your aticle dates 2010...which in most cases, would be timely enough. In this case? It's a picture of what used to be, and hasn't finished where it's going yet.

Folks who look down on Russia need to see just how much they've dropped into this and how much they've done in the past few years.

Fearing West, Putin pledges biggest military buildup since cold war

Russia's Military Is Back

It's been quite a thing to follow as a side interest, and I'm surprised more people haven't been. In addition to conventional forces, they are undergoing refit or replacement to their Submarines, Strategic Bombers and land based ICBM carrier/launcher units. Oh...and the Civil Defense shelters build to handle a fair portion of the Moscow population, if needed.

He's planned ahead, I believe. Unlike..say..our side, it seems.

They have been doing this for over a year + now. Its just recently made the news, no doubt because of Ukraine.

This was a common occurrence during the cold war. Naval vessels would taunt each other etc.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
They have been doing this for over a year + now. Its just recently made the news, no doubt because of Ukraine.

This was a common occurrence during the cold war. Naval vessels would taunt each other etc.

Do you think they are harmless?

I think the rule is, never underestimate the enemy. They might not be perceived as our enemy to us, but how do they perceive us? Are we harmless to them them? It seems they aren't underestimating us.

Machismo only works on Saturday nights in the clubs, but I heard Putin has a lot of machismo. I'm a woman and don't understand all of this macho stuff you guys feel you have to bluff with, and it sounds like that's what you are saying, that he is macho-bluffing. But I have to ask, is he really?

It's only fuelling bigger military budgets for the West and her allies, and more cooperation on future join programs

It is very reminiscent of the Cold War error however the last time Russia order bigger military's spending and an arms race the failed spectacularly

a reply to: Xcathdra

Agreed on routine and business as usual. Putin was running strategic bombers against U.S. and Canadian airspace, occasionally, while Bush was around. Kinda tweaking his nose to keep him awake, I think. This time, it's outright disrespect being communicated, but it's still mere communication. 'We're here...we CAN get there from here and don't anyone forget it' is the message I've generally seen these actions as carrying.

Bombers over Guam, Hawaii and other U.S. areas we kinda tolerate this for ..with occasional runs right along our beaches, or..as close as they figure they'll get away with.

As Gene Hackman says in the movie (paraphrase from Crimson Tide). 'I hope everyone enjoyed the vacation, because it looks like we're back at it'. At least, they better dust off the old books to refresh memories on the deterrence concepts, eh?

a reply to: Wrabbit2000

The modernization program has hit a few snags. The Su-34 is a fiasco almost to rival any American program. The MiG-29 upgrade just got rocked by scandal as well.

They have a lot of nice ideas, and in 10 years will have a force to rival almost anyone else out there. Right now their missile forces are the best out there, and there are two new air to air missiles they're developing that honestly scare the hell out of me, and a lot of other people.

They do a lot with what they have, and they've begun new training that will make them better, but they will have material problems for several more years at best.

a reply to: Zaphod58

True on your points and of course, you're familiar with them as a deeper level than I ever have been. Especially on the particulars of air power.

What I think I see and what honestly, scares the hell out of me is the attitude taken these days. It's primarily in the West and particularly in the United States. The thinking seems to go that if another nation cannot meet us on the field of battle as we choose or as we force it, and defeat us on the terms we've funneled things down to, they are either irrelevant for serious concern or deserve caution but respect...? Meh.. not so much.

What I see when I look around the world is a state of affairs where we've effectively taken off the idiots and fools (low hanging fruit) who would let us build a 500,000 man invasion force within miles of their border and not respond (like Saddam). Likewise, for another example, people who would think by their isolation and history, we won't go or won't do something we very much WILL...simply because it hasn't happened before. (Afghanistan for that...). Among the remaining World nations we'd care about, we've removed most if not all of what will likely ever be easy.

Now we have the nations like Russia, Iran and China who have patiently and very carefully studied every move we've made back to 1989 at least, like a chess player or football team becoming experts on every historic move of an opponent. We don't see Army, Navy and Air Forces built to match us. 2 world wars shows that ignorant to attempt. We have nations that have specialized to attack..not what we stand strong with...but the Achilles tendons each aspect of our strength depends on and requires.

I'm afraid when we go to war with Russia or China (and it looks like IF..even if it takes years to get there..but if, not so much when) we won't lose tanks and planes by dog fights and land battles....but getting lost when GPS and chips running inertial nav systems just go tits up for no apparent reason. Guidance systems we have to now look down on others for NOT having...simply don't go to the right spots for technical malfunction or sabotage.

We have a VERY powerful system to make war ...but it's a system predicated on everything working properly. Whereas, the Russian and Chinese versions are PLANNING for everything which can go wrong, to go catastrophically wrong...and still be able to hold what they have, if not return the fight.

Therein lay the difference I referred to at the start. The other nations know what seeing their own beloved homeland ravaged by war looks and...recently enough..feels like. We have no concept, with myself included, to even think in terms of defeat being a true possibility. That.....may be what causes it to happen.

originally posted by: Wrabbit2000
a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul

You are aware of the fact the Russian Federation is in the middle of a very dramatic modernization and rebuilding effort, right? Your aticle dates 2010...which in most cases, would be timely enough. In this case? It's a picture of what used to be, and hasn't finished where it's going yet.

Yes they are modernizing - but the rate is slow and the numbers limited - as I indicated they are rebuilding their Tu-160 Blackjack fleet at the rate of 1 every 2 years!

a reply to: 13th Zodiac

I'm not going to dig at you and say use your search or anything sarcastic like that.It's rude and has been done to me many times.

Well at least you didn't dig at him or act sarcastic or rudely.

a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul
Indeed... I got that from Zaph, too.
As noted above..they are not even trying to match us. They aren't trying to deter us. They are working to DEFEAT us...which won't be in ways or come in places we anticipate. Kinda text book in that way...and we're very much overlooking the fact there even IS a threat right now, in the present day.

That is what I find scary. We're playing checkers and it's a good game ...until you are in a chess game and have no clue how to think several moves ahead. It's not a perfect fit, but it sure seems close.

a reply to: Wrabbit2000

Again, it seem the current population in the United States underestimates the enemy. They have set themselves up as our enemy and we need to realize that.

I am not a man and supposedly don't understand all of this war gaming that men do, but it makes me just a little frightened to think that the very men we rely on for our defense isn't taking it serious enough to consider what would happen if Russia did strike California or Hawaii.

That's one thing we need to do, expect the unexpected to have a contingency plan ready to go into action, because Russia could say it is a preemptive strike against us. And think about this, with our shock and awe the first night of the Iraqi war, why wasn't it effective enough and the war still goes on? Apparently we didn't shock and awe enough.

Would we really have enough time in the event that California were struck tomorrow? The only recourse we have is nuclear weapons and if California were hit, we would lose several military bases. Washington DC is a long way from California, but if California were hit, it would cause a chain reaction and then our nuclear power plants would be in jeopardy, because right now, we know how vulnerable our electric grid is. If the hackers can hack highway signs telling people there are zombies ahead, and they can get to our street lights, then who is to say that our current system won't go down?

Right now, we are just gearing up to warm weather when air conditioners will soon be running full time,placing a strain on the electric grid, what happens if two major power plants go down? Instead of digging for more coal to shore up our resources, Obama chooses to lay a pipe line through Canada, making us even more vulnerable. And that's what I am seeing from here, I don't understand these war games.

a reply to: WarminIndy

Don't feel bad. Sadly, Obama doesn't either.

What I've seen coming out of this admin shows no signs of any real strategic thinking unless you put it together as some kind of nefarious conspiracy.

originally posted by: Wrabbit2000
a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul
Indeed... I got that from Zaph, too.
As noted above..they are not even trying to match us. They aren't trying to deter us. They are working to DEFEAT us...which won't be in ways or come in places we anticipate. Kinda text book in that way...and we're very much overlooking the fact there even IS a threat right now, in the present day.

That is what I find scary. We're playing checkers and it's a good game ...until you are in a chess game and have no clue how to think several moves ahead. It's not a perfect fit, but it sure seems close.

There was recent news about a man who used a cell phone jammer for 2 years before getting caught. Think about this, 50 men with cell phone jammers cruising the city streets, how many more cell phones will be effected? These are little things, but enough to disrupt us.

It's not the huge things that make or break a battle, it is the well-strategized plans that win. I can think of a thousand different ways to attack the United States from within, and believe me, the crock pot bomb is just the beginning. Who would have thought that someone would think to use crock pots? It happened, so why do we think people are not going to implement every idea that we think is crazy? And why are we thinking that people won't do it?

a reply to: WarminIndy

It's amazing that you note that when you do...but I agree 100%. The fates of nations and entire continents can rest on the smallest of things, to see it all in hindsight. A pivotal battle defining the end of the 19th century and how the 20th would go, for instance, pivoting on the fact it rained the night before. In another, the entire flow and likely outcome of World War II, early on, changing forever...because a pilot encountered fog and didn't want to look bad returning with a bomb load.

I think we've gotten far too spoiled by the way U.S. power has been first used, and then stretched...then stretched some more..in sequential fights going back to 1990. Each time, it's 'do more with less and ..well..you'll find a way'. It's worked up to now....but I think we've about tapped out the prestige factor for winning things. Just my sinking feeling.

originally posted by: Wrabbit2000
a reply to: Aloysius the Gaul
Indeed... I got that from Zaph, too.
As noted above..they are not even trying to match us. They aren't trying to deter us. They are working to DEFEAT us...which won't be in ways or come in places we anticipate. Kinda text book in that way...and we're very much overlooking the fact there even IS a threat right now, in the present day.

That is what I find scary. We're playing checkers and it's a good game ...until you are in a chess game and have no clue how to think several moves ahead. It's not a perfect fit, but it sure seems close.

Well the USA biggest weakness is its $17 trillion debt.

I think Russia is going to take a page out of the US cold war playbook and use the same trick that beat the USSR and thats get the USA to spend more and more on its military until the USA cant keep up with the spending.

You can already see the strain, USA creates $200 million fighters so Russia builds cheap missles that it can mass produce and give those fighters a bad day, so the USA then spends more and so on.