Video surfaces of unarmed man shot in the back and killed by Long Beach Police!

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: ColCurious

Sure they might have better training but the mentality is all wrong.
And unless you were an MP, you have no training in how to deal with someone in an non viloent manner as a police officer should be able to do.

Police should not have military training or military attitude.
FAR separate jobs that require certain mentalities to do efficiently
The military is taught to kill, it was ever other word out of my mouth in boot camp.

Not sure i need some one that has been to combat pointing a gun at me, those guys shot pretty quick now a days too.
I do agree that insufficient training is a big problem

A well-trained soldier has more discipline than anyone you know. They would be the last to shoot first and ask questions later. It's not like they would come right into the police force directly out of the service...they too would have to achieve some police training so they would have the best of both worlds, police and military training.

originally posted by: Rezlooper

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: ColCurious

Sure they might have better training but the mentality is all wrong.
And unless you were an MP, you have no training in how to deal with someone in an non viloent manner as a police officer should be able to do.

Police should not have military training or military attitude.
FAR separate jobs that require certain mentalities to do efficiently
The military is taught to kill, it was ever other word out of my mouth in boot camp.

Not sure i need some one that has been to combat pointing a gun at me, those guys shot pretty quick now a days too.
I do agree that insufficient training is a big problem

A well-trained soldier has more discipline than anyone you know. They would be the last to shoot first and ask questions later. It's not like they would come right into the police force directly out of the service...they too would have to achieve some police training so they would have the best of both worlds, police and military training.

Wrong, an undiagnosed PTSD cop is an actual loose cannon. one can have a flashback. And PTSD episodes are triggered when adrenaline starts pumping. Not a good combo, actually a deadly combo.

The cops are sticking by their story according to today's LA Times article on the matter. Now, they have added that the Long Beach officers on the beach who opened fire from him below were shouting commands to him, heard gunshots from above and thought he was in a gun fight with other officers, then they saw him reach for his waistband, so they shot him.

Note how they contradict themselves. First of all, if they thought he was in a gun fight, firing back at officers above, why was he just now reaching for his waistband. They are full of crap! Also, in the story released yesterday, the Long Beach officers below the stairs claimed they couldn't see the suspect clearly because he was behind some brush or shrubs or something.

Unarmed man killed after 'reaching for his waistband'

originally posted by: HanzHenry

originally posted by: Rezlooper

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: ColCurious

Sure they might have better training but the mentality is all wrong.
And unless you were an MP, you have no training in how to deal with someone in an non viloent manner as a police officer should be able to do.

Police should not have military training or military attitude.
FAR separate jobs that require certain mentalities to do efficiently
The military is taught to kill, it was ever other word out of my mouth in boot camp.

Not sure i need some one that has been to combat pointing a gun at me, those guys shot pretty quick now a days too.
I do agree that insufficient training is a big problem

A well-trained soldier has more discipline than anyone you know. They would be the last to shoot first and ask questions later. It's not like they would come right into the police force directly out of the service...they too would have to achieve some police training so they would have the best of both worlds, police and military training.

Wrong, an undiagnosed PTSD cop is an actual loose cannon. one can have a flashback. And PTSD episodes are triggered when adrenaline starts pumping. Not a good combo, actually a deadly combo.

I doubt that PTSD-diagnosed soldiers are the ones becoming cops. I know several former marines and they are all sound individuals who are productive members of the community. All three saw combat. I would feel safe and secure if they were LEO's in this town. One of them is actually the best politician in our community, unlike many other polticians. He has values that matter.

a reply to: Rezlooper

Or you have LEO's that are reserves in the military... I served with many
And they all were trigger happy as could be, not all marines/soldiers are as well disciplined as you think. Far from it
You know what the diddy is to remember how long to hold down the trigger on a 240-G
Die mother #er die, let go
Die mother #er die, let go

They are also taught the same, you only have a second to react and decide or its your life, line of thinking.
Also the need for instant respect X2, you need to listen to me cause not only am I cop but also a marine/soldier!!
If they hold any rank then they are not used to getting talked back to or not listened to and they resort to what they do in the military.

The mentalities you need to have do not mix with each other

a reply to: Rezlooper

I doubt that PTSD-diagnosed soldiers are the ones becoming cops

This is a whole other thread, but half the time they don't know or refuse to believe they have it.
You are taught to never be "broken" in the military, to fight through everything cause you are a lean mean fighting machine!!
Especially mental issues, the military can give us all the lip service they want but they do not handle mental illness well at all, especially since it can be a career killer

This goes to show how deep the corruption is in this country and it's out of control. I think half the police force should be axed immediately and all the others disarmed to non-lethal only as they are a clear and present danger to society.

Shooting that guy in the back as he runs away from several yards away is insanity. They justify that he is a threat, really? The only threat I see here is the cops shooting wildly down a boardwalk in public from several yards away. All of them involved should be behind bars including the Crime N Chief that backs his officers ludicrous actions.

Cops always stress that if you shoot a robber fleeing from your home then you can be charged. Yeah practice what you preach!!

originally posted by: MDDoxs
a reply to: Rezlooper

Events like this and the other dozens of stories across these boards and the internet at large are proliferating this damaging image for law enforcement.

Whether this action was justified or not, this whole situation makes me wonder if there was or ever will be a time when law enforcement is given the benefit of the doubt and presumed to have acted in the best interest of society on convoluted scenarios. I think this has never been and will be difficult to obtain.

This falls back to better qualifying the members chosen to serve and protect and repairing this tarnished image allowing it time to become an uniformly honoured and respected institution.

1. Video clearly shows the man get out and make not threatening gestures toward the police.
2. He exits his vehicle and tries to flee.
3. He's more than likely gay as a man recording/near the recorder says "oh he's pretty"

Shoplifter or not, THAT shooting should NOT have happened. No one's life was in danger. And given they lied about "encountering" the suspect when the shooting happened - what else did they lie about?

If they want the benefit of the doubt they need to stop these kinds of shooting and lying about it.

Any heat these cops get is completely justified.

a reply to: WCmutant

He's more than likely gay as a man recording/near the recorder says "oh he's pretty"

...I think you could have this one out
That was a voice of someone in the room of the person taking the video... how does that make the guy running gay??

originally posted by: nunya13
a reply to: Sremmos80



You think the cop gives a crap about his dog? He doesn't care about human life. Why would he care about the dog's?

Because in his warped mind, the K9 unit is a fellow officer.
We civilians are less than dogs to them.. infuriating but true.

originally posted by: MysticPearl
The saddest thing is, there's never an uproar by cops who are members here or from cops across the country when their brothers in arms act as criminals.

Not an apple to apple comparison, but with everything happening around the Clippers owner, Donald Sterling and racism this week, NBA owners came out and blasted the remarks, came out united against one of their own who acted in a way which represents ownership and the league poorly.

Why do we NEVER see anything of the like from cops? It's either silence or an attempt to justify abuse/murder of citizens. It's very similar to Catholic priests/church and child abuse. Rarely an uproar. Far more complacency and turning a blind eye and just like the Catholic church, in many respects it's a culture issue within law enforcement, if you're not helping, you're part of the problem.

And that's what cops don't understand. It's not a bad apple here or there, it's a corrupt culture where they stand by their own no matter the issue, no matter the transgressions. It's sickening. It's pathetic. Needing to earn a living isn't an excuse. Drug dealers also need to earn a living but when it's criminal, the right to earn a living goes out the window . Cops pretty much are involved in legalized criminal organizations and even if they don't pull the trigger, support the climate/atmosphere.

Such low standards they have of themselves. They want respect but fail on all accounts of having respect for anyone not wearing blue with a badge.

It is Tribalism (probably spelt wrong lol). The difference with the NBA example is you have the leaders of different tribes lambasting the leader of another tribe... Imagine you took one tribe and a member of it made some comment or whatever, his tribe members would deflect and make excuses or whatever, defo wouldn't slag him and berate him in public.

So yeah it is tribalism and team mentality. It is cops against us, simple as that really.

Another sign out police state is out of control. We all see the problem, but instead of debating the problem over and over, what is the solution?

These stories need to become more prevalent in mainstream news. I am overwhelmed with news stories of this NBA guy Sterling and his blatant racisim, wow big deal, lets spread the airwaves with a stupid racial debate.

Meanwhile a defenseless black man is shot in the back by a bunch of white cops and nobody speaks up. Riots broke out when Rodney King was beaten by police, thank god he was only beaten with batons. It seems if today's para-military police forces were involved in the same Rodney King incident, there would be bullets flying all over the place.

These police officers need to start seeing serious jail time. Johannes Mehrsele only did 365 days behind bars for the murder of Oscar Grant. That story would not have been brought to light unless concerned citizens videotaped the incident. We are reaching a point where we need to film every encounter with police, in order to hold them accountable for their actions.
a reply to: Rezlooper

Why haven't we had any ATS law enforcement officers chime in on this thread? I would like to hear what they think of this video and if this shooting was justified? If so, why? Maybe there is something we're missing they can point out, cuz, right now, I just don't get how the Long Beach Department can stand behind such a blatant murderous act. He was clearly not a threat no matter how you slice it. Also, the dog was just about to make the arrest, why not let the animal do its job?

a reply to: Rezlooper



Biggest street gang in the United States

The Police: attack dogs for the corporate elite

Nothing but jack boot thugs with a licence to murder


Heck they are just as bad as the Mexican cartels, if not worse. And the court system well they are the Judges and district attourneys that are owned by the same corporate elite. So forget due process, being judged by your peers too. The mob rule is here to stay until people decide to make it an eye for an eye and remove this malignant cancer by force . All we can do is inform others and wake people up to the sobering nightmare we have found ourselves in. People ask "what happened" with our law enforcement since the transition to a militant occupation of goons. I simply dont know, but they are obviouly being given a green light to kill on sight by higher ups. Those higher ups are being ordered around by the corporate elite and bankers through "donations" to the police farce . Just like political campaign contributions by the lobby owned politicians. If we remove the source behind the machine things will return to normalcy i suppose . The same people who write laws are the same people ordering the police to behave like this.


Ever had police call asking for donations? Always struck me as odd. Easily bought.
www.supportpolice.com...

Follow the money to the highest bidder. www.salon.com...

a reply to: Sremmos80

KFOR/IFOR/SFOR soldiers have been policing in crisis and post-conflict areas since the 90s, quite successful as a matter of fact, and are trained in order to meet the tasks of an intervention force.
I cannot judge the situation for US soldiers, but I would be surprised if their training fell short behind that standard.

As for PTSD, this issue gets more attention nowadays, and you wouldn't get insurance status/treatment if you tried to conceal the condition.
As far as I know, LEOs also have to undergo psychological evaluation after using their weapon on duty.
Is this not the case in the US?

originally posted by: Sremmos80
They are also taught the same, you only have a second to react and decide or its your life, line of thinking.

Again, I doubt this is applies to a situation like in the video.
How long does it take to assess the threatlevel posed by a fleeing unarmed civilian??

a reply to: Rezlooper

Dear God, someone should fry for this one! I bet he gets promoted!

originally posted by: ColCurious
a reply to: Sremmos80

KFOR/IFOR/SFOR soldiers have been policing in crisis and post-conflict areas since the 90s, quite successful as a matter of fact, and are trained in order to meet the tasks of an intervention force.
I cannot judge the situation for US soldiers, but I would be surprised if their training fell short behind that standard.

As for PTSD, this issue gets more attention nowadays, and you wouldn't get insurance status/treatment if you tried to conceal the condition.
As far as I know, LEOs also have to undergo psychological evaluation after using their weapon on duty.
Is this not the case in the US?

originally posted by: Sremmos80
They are also taught the same, you only have a second to react and decide or its your life, line of thinking.

Again, I doubt this is applies to a situation like in the video.
How long does it take to assess the threatlevel posed by a fleeing unarmed civilian??

This guy was probably looking to pop someone as he will get some paid time off. A real question would be how many have died at this mans hands!

a reply to: ColCurious

I don't know the training the units you just said get but I can speak for the military and unless you are an MP( military police) then I didn't see many units getting that type of training.
Out side of your MOS training it was all field and rifle training and that consisted on how to kill people. Not how to come to peaceful and lawful decision.
When you are the range you go for kill shots most of the time. Failure drills being practied the most, which is 2 shots to the chest and 1 to the head or pelvic region(pelvic region only a few years into being taught)
Also like i said, military memebers don't deal with people not listening to them either, especially if they have been in for a while and have some rank.
Especially in the marines and a bunch of them go and become LEO's.
And not sure where your are getting your info on the PTSD.. it is still a major problem, well at least in my unit we got death by powerpoints on it all the time. Mostly about not hiding it and coming forward
Like I said, soilders and marines will flat out refuse the idea of them having it, they are conditioned that way.
No way they couldn't handle battle, it is what they have been training there whole adult life for.
No way they could be broken right now, no way I can leave my brothers, no way I will never be allowed to be sent back over and fight with my brothers. Just some examples of why it is still a major problem

How long does it take to assess the threatlevel posed by a fleeing unarmed civilian??

Well they shot him cause they "thought" he was reaching at his waistband.. So i guess they couldn't do it fast enough.
LBPD just paid 6.5 million for shooting a guy with a water nozzle in his hand.
Both military and police are taught that everyone has a gun or knife or weapon and everyone wants to kill you...
And that you only have seconds to decide, and it is that line of thinking that is getting our unarmed americans shot.
That is why it is not a good combination IMO.
And as far as they psych test go after discharge, I think they still do it, but it is all done in house so I am sure the results don't really matter as long as you got some brothers in blue to cover you
Which they probably learned how to do in the military, they keep a lot in house too

This is becoming the norm. The people need to demand a change in the system. . .as innocent people continue to die for no reason, we need to do whatever it takes to get the transparency and truth we demand.

originally posted by: sean

Cops always stress that if you shoot a robber fleeing from your home then you can be charged. Yeah practice what you preach!!

Exactly my feelings. If you or I did this how many decades would we get behind bars? It truly is becoming us versus them.