The Masonic Grand Design

KellyPrettyBear


Do you think it's possible, that modern Masons have gotten very
boring, and have for the most part abandoned all the things
which made them interesting a 100+ years ago?

Yes. A lot of masons don't join for the esoterica (which the OP is a typical example of) but for the friends & beer fellowship, the social charity aspect or with the idea of networking. Masons more interested in esoterica eventually move on to various side-degrees in masonry.

reply to post by Kantzveldt


Gotta play somewhere!

There's links between Scotland and France, and ancient architecture as you're no doubt well aware.

These little beauties have been intriguing me recently, and fit in well with your thoughts on alchemy. Mostly found around the East coast, and the North, and dating from 3000bc:

While most carved balls are Scottish objects, several have been discovered in Orkney and a few have been found on Skye, Iona, Lewis, Harris and Uist. In addition, some have been uncovered in Ireland and England. (1)

Mathematicians are interested in Carved Stone Balls because of their aesthetic beauty as they have amongst them all the symmetrical forms of the five Platonic solids.

Carved stone balls

reply to post by Kantzveldt


Very interesting thread. Looking more at Claude Nicolas Ledoux, he was a very unique person and had many interests. I had not heard of him before, so thank you for the knowledge.

I think the confusion is that masonry defines his accomplishments. While he was a Freemason, and he used masonic symbolism in his designs, he had many interests, alchemy and hermetic teachings being some of them. I think there is a misconception that they are all synonymous, but they are different. (to a point) Some masonic side orders teach parts of alchemy as well as other esoteric interests, but as a whole, masonry isn't about that at all. (IMHO)

None of that takes away from the accomplishments of Ledoux, or the merits of this thread. Fantastic job.

reply to post by Kantzveldt


The last woodcut image you have is interesting. At the left there is a web with a spider in the center placed above a flowering plant. The bee represents a person who seeks light and the flower with its nectar represents the true R+C whilst the web with its spider represents those schools who offer the false hope of light but instead entangle the seeker in degrees and dues which serves only to waist their time and money.

reply to post by LUXUS


In masonic teachings, the Bee, or Bee Hive represents industry.

reply to post by network dude



Thanks, he was a true visionary in that he saw the design as not only extending across the globe but even throughout the Solar System, and created an ariel elevation drawing from outer space






reply to post by beansidhe



Yes those are intriguing, considerations of idealized forms, here's one Ledoux designed somewhat later.





reply to post by LUXUS



Here's another version of that woodcut with subtle differences, maybe like in the move The Ninth Gate they mean something...





Arachne perceived the illuminated web.

reply to post by network dude


The beehive represents the school

The work which goes on in the beehive represents industry

The Bee represents the initiate

The work the bee is involved in is transforming pollen into golden honey

The spider and the web are those who would stop the bee from completing his work

Honey is the goal, the alchemical gold, consolidated sunlight!

"a small room adjoining the Lodge, in which, preparatory to initiation, the candidate is enclosed for the purpose of indulging in those serious meditations which its sombre appearance and the gloomy emblems with which it is furnished are calculated to produce. It is also used in some of the advanced degrees for a similar purpose.

This small room or chamber, which does not necessarily adjoins the Lodge room, is dark, with the walls painted black, or, as in one case I saw, imitating a rocky underground cave. It contains the following: a simple rough wooden table on which we find: a human skull, usually on two crossbones, a chunk of bread, a pitcher with water, a cup with salt, a cup with sulphur, a lighted candle or lantern, an hourglass, paper, ink and pen, a wooden stool or chair painted on the wall: a rooster, a sickle, the acronym V.IT.R.I.O.L.(U.M.) and various sayings."

Candle flame is that what illuminates, dispels darkness

Cross bones represent Death

The hour glass represents time

Bread represents manna

Water (the living mercury) Sulfur and salt are the ingredients to produce the stone

Sickle also represents death and Saturn, lead or the rough substance to be worked

In other words, time is slipping, death is near, there is work still to be completed!

The cock announces the break of a new day


Original masons would have understood this but yes they have become lazy

reply to post by Kantzveldt


Yes in this one the spider has became fat (the bee in its stomach), the rose has wilted and the lady hangs...ie the spider has won, the dream of honey gone, the initiate dies before achieving his goal!

reply to post by LUXUS


This is a practice in the side order of craft masonry called York Rite. If a mason chooses to join this side order, then he learns the things taught to him by this side order.

The fact that you keep lumping everything into on big basket, only shows a bit of laziness on your part. There is a lot to it and you have to understand the core to even try to comprehend the fruit.

For someone who thinks they know so much about masonry, you should join and teach all those silly masons what they forgot.

reply to post by network dude


I do not separate the branches from the tree, I understand they are connected and once (operative masonry) they were whole

Its not my job to remind them, from my interaction with them they quite enjoy the sleep anyway, so sleep they shall!

LUXUS
Original masons would have understood this but yes they have become lazy

We use the Chamber of Reflection for all new candidates. Many of the lodges are moving to strict obidience as it offers a chance for those who want more esoteric particpation than what was typical in recent years.

LUXUS

Original masons would have understood this but yes they have become lazy

...or perhaps some of us on this forum can recite the lecture on this symbolism by heart.

Why do you assume that nothing modern is as it used to be. You made the same assumption in the druid thread.

Just because you have not experienced something doesn't mean it does not exist!

reply to post by Saurus


Can you please make up your mind, you said when you joined masonry you were disappointment at the lack of esoteric teachings in modern masonry, you also stated that you have to seek esoteric teachings outside masonry which should not be the case should it?


BTW I suggest you seek a scholar on the history of druidism and put your question to them, actually contact the order of druids themselves and put the question to them, you will be told that "neo druids" have nothing to do with the ancient druids.

I apologize to the OP for initiating the thread misdirection. Perhaps Luxus could start his own thread.

LUXUS
reply to post by Saurus

 

Can you please make up your mind, you said when you joined masonry you were disappointment at the lack of esoteric teachings in modern masonry, you also stated that you have to seek esoteric teachings outside masonry which should not be the case should it?

I never said or even implied that there was none!

I wanted to learn more about Hermetic Qabalism and Magick, and that I did not find in Freemasonry.
I was disappointed because I did not find what I was looking for, but I found something equally, if not more, wonderful.

There is not as much as one might expect, but that's certainly not the same as none!

BTW I suggest you seek a scholar on the history of druidism and put your question to them, actually contact the order of druids themselves and put the question to them, you will be told that "neo druids" have nothing to do with the ancient druids.

Contact them? I'm sitting next to one!

Kantzveldt

But for the record, the intent is to destroy the inter-planetary system of the Olympians.

What the heck is the inter-planetary system of the Olympians?

What are you implying by this?
And who are the Olympians in this terminology ?

How does one destroy their system?
And how does this thread play into that scheme?

network dude
I apologize to the OP for initiating the thread misdirection. Perhaps Luxus could start his own thread.

Rather throw your mason pack a can of spam to keep them busy munching, I am not responsible for thread misdirection!

reply to post by Kantzveldt


Looking at the architecture what I see is a solar calendar much like stone henge....it would be interesting to know how it alines to the vernal equinox when the Sun is in the house of the Ram!!!

reply to post by LUXUS



"Neo-Druidry, commonly referred to as Druidry by many adherents,is a form of modern spirituality or religion that generally promotes harmony and worship of nature, and respect for all beings, including the environment. Many forms of modern Druidry are Neopagan religions, whereas some are instead seen as philosophies that are not necessarily religious in nature. Originating in Britain during the 18th century, Druidry was originally a cultural movement, only gaining religious or spiritual connotations in the 19th century.

The core principle of Druidry is respect and veneration of nature, and as such it often involves participation in the environmental movement. Another prominent belief amongst modern Druids is the veneration of ancestors, particularly those who belonged to prehistoric societies.

Arising from the 18th century Romanticist movement in Britain, which glorified the ancient "Celtic" peoples of the Iron Age, the early Druids aimed to imitate the Iron Age priests who were also known as druids