Stymied Obama aims to bypass Congress

reply to post by ownbestenemy


Yes the people have the power, but most don't know that because of the strategic divisions put in place to protect the peoples rights.

Most dont understand what is being voted on because of how intertwined certain bills are with others.

MonkeyMentat
reply to post by shaneslaughta

 

Ahhhh, it would be the elected official at fault if he fails to represent the people.

I never said that. What im getting at is the system is broken. There is not enough representation of the people.

ownbestenemy

muse7
It would depend on the context on which they used them for.

With today's Republicans hell bent on not compromising with the President to get things done, then someone needs to get the job done.

So if it is in favor of what you believe to be "right", you support such measures, but if it is contrary to what you believe, it is "wrong"? Am I getting this right?

No.

I don't really have a problem with presidents being able to use executive orders and actions when necessary. Obviously when a President is dealing with a congress that has no plan for the country other than just sabotaging the President's term, then yes I would support them using their powers to circumvent congress.

muse7
Obviously when a President is dealing with a congress that has no plan for the country other than just sabotaging the President's term, then yes I would support them using their powers to circumvent congress.

The only thing these people are capable of doing is voting themselves raises. That is about all they get together on.

That or cutting deals to big corporations like tax breaks, to further their own agendas and pockets.

muse7
I don't really have a problem with presidents being able to use executive orders and actions when necessary. Obviously when a President is dealing with a congress that has no plan for the country other than just sabotaging the President's term, then yes I would support them using their powers to circumvent congress.

For hypothetical purposes then, if Congress was against a war in Russia, but the President was for it, you would then, agree that the President should use Executive powers to achieve the means? I mean, you have no problem right? Maybe Congress has been "sabotaging" the President's ambitions?

I say we remove some of the riff raff from positions of power. Hell lets get rid of the house of reps and have national votes on laws and simplify the process. Actual transparency and peoples real voice.

Am i off my rocker here?

reply to post by muse7


Would you feel that way regardless of the Party of the President?

Don't you feel that neutralizes your rights to elect Congress?

reply to post by xuenchen


Yeah, I read the article, he is promising the poor status of middle class, to push the immigration reform bill and many other "things" that he think are soo important that he doesn't need congress to make them into law.

this one is going to be an interesting thing to see, after all he have the NSA spying on politicians any opposition and the supreme court as leverage in case anybody gets in his way.

The dictator has spoken, and the irony, that Bush wanted to be that dictator but could not.

I've been talking with my Grandfather about this for some time now. He reminded me that decades ago if we the people didn't agree with something that the government proposed or enacted, then all hell would be raised. Our society now is too busy with taking the kids to soccer practice. People choose to do nothing because we are consumed in our daily routines.

In a "perfect world" the majority of the nation would simply said "NO, we will not comply". If we refuse to comply with this tyrannical government then what could they possibly do? Good luck trying to enforce much of anything. The majority rules, does it not?

ownbestenemy
I would like to here from other members who maybe agree here -- I could name them, but I believe that would be crass.

Do you think that the president (the Executive Branch) should be able to bypass Congress (the Legislative Branch) in regards to laws and legislation via mandates and regulations?

I agree with this action. I'm sick and tired of this crappy congress that can't get anything done. The President won the election and he deserves a shot at keeping his campaign promises. Congress is stopping him every chance they get and nothing is getting done. The American people want change and if this is what he has to do, I'm all for it!

reply to post by KEMIK


Does grandpa happen to have any specific examples he can point us toward to check the "raise all hell" theory? Because I have been alive for 45 years, and I can't remember the last time the American people were united in opposition to anything.

reply to post by rjbaggins


Sorry to say this but is a reason why the congress is elected by the people, they do not elect themselves, neither they are appointed by the president.

Is call checks and balances, people chose to give majority to opposing parties in congress to avoid having a president becoming a Dictator, the founding fathers were smart about that.

It seems that you forgot you US government history

The Legislative Process: Introduction and Referral of Bills

beta.congress.gov...

When a president take the role of supreme leader is call dictatorship.

If that leader is your elected favorite party member you see no wrong with having a dictatorship in the nation, but when is the opposition you will no find it to be a very nice thing to the democratic process.

Obama is trying to step into a very dangerous ground here and he is going to find himself burned in the process, see Bush try to do the same, but he could not because in his term it was the opposing party in majority in congress.

Bush Jr had a slim Republican majority in the house until 2007 when the Democrats gain a 233-198 majority. The Senate was split 50-50 at the beginning of his first term and 49-49-2 at the end of his second term. The democrat party had control of both the the House and Senate, starting January 4th, 2007, when the recession began. The democrats kept control until the voters chose the republican party to reclaim the House starting on January 3rd, 2011, after the first two years of Barack Obama's presidency.

wiki.answers.com...

People have such short memories this days, either that or they just want to remember only what benefits them the most, or let say their favorite party in control

reply to post by 0zzymand0s


Firstly, you can leave your sarcasm elsewhere. I was merely relaying that he believes that there was a difference in mindset from his era as compared to our current. Maybe I should have been a little more clear for you.

reply to post by muse7

I don't really have a problem with presidents being able to use executive orders and actions when necessary. Obviously when a President is dealing with a congress that has no plan for the country other than just sabotaging the President's term, then yes I would support them using their powers to circumvent congress.

reply to post by rjbaggins

I agree with this action. I'm sick and tired of this crappy congress that can't get anything done. The President won the election and he deserves a shot at keeping his campaign promises. Congress is stopping him every chance they get and nothing is getting done. The American people want change and if this is what he has to do, I'm all for it!

Well let's take a closer look.

1. Democrats had full control of Congress from Jan 2007 until Jan 2011.

2. Obama had the Executive Branch for two of those years.

They passed all kinds of economic legislation unabated.

Given that, it seems that the current White House positions are admitting failure of their own legislations.

Now that would indicate an ongoing blame game since 2011.

Not to mention the Constitution gives the House the authority on financial legislation origins.

The President has no authority to legislate on his own.

Unless of course somebody can display an argument with Constitutional merits.

reply to post by KEMIK


I know exactly what you mean and you grandpa is right, people have lost their back bone in America, but the reason of that is because most of the working force in the nation and the welfare system is under the control of the government.

The government is the biggest employer in the nation so most people will not go against the hand that feed them, then you have the growing welfare state, the poor and needy receiving their share of the tax dollars from the working class that works for the government do not want to lose their benefits either, so nobody will want to fight anything.

I have been a voter since 1978, so I been around for a while and I have seen how things have change in the nation and is not for the better.

reply to post by rjbaggins


And don't forget one more thing.

The U.S. House majority actually represents the majority of the U.S. population.

Obama LLC is barking up the wrong tree.

He prefers his band of pirates over the majority of American Citizens it seems.

They had their majority for 2 years and screwed it up bigtime.

They can't even get enough support from the RINOcorps and RINOkomrades either.

Very sick.

reply to post by xuenchen


And that is the thing that is going to burn his political party the most, no wonder he wants to hurry up and by pass congress in order to secure the votes of millions of illegals with an amnesty bill, at the same time is filling the heads of the poor with promises of middle class status.

I have to laugh at the pitiful attempts of Obama, that wasted more than half of his term in nothing but allowing the NSA to be spying on citizens and using the IRS for his own benefits.

What we got, a lousy health care reform that people are finding out is screwing the working class and the very poor.

Is just pitiful actually. Now he wants to become the first dictator in the US that do not need a congress to do what he wants.

And people still wonder why is America so screwed.

reply to post by KEMIK


Ok. He's wrong, but so is most conventional wisdom, and nearly all anecdote.

reply to post by 0zzymand0s


Ok, I respect your disagreement and applaud your ability to articulate your argument.

What is with all this middle class talk. We have taken the brunt of the trauma inflicted on us by the last two administrations.
Here are a few examples from the obama administration.

Cnn