Why do we even bother "discussing" certain subjects?

Simple question. By asking it, I don't intend to point the finger at one particular topic or set of beliefs or another, but rather to hold up a mirror (both to myself and to the ATS community). Certain topics here are rife with tension and often turn into bitter literary slug fests. Religious topics, 9/11, UFO's, just to name a few. I absolutely see the value in having a place to discuss these subjects in a civil way, but I often find myself asking what the point of it all is.

Do we participate in such discussions to have our own ideas validated by people who already share them? If so, what is the point? Isn't that a sort of mental masturbation? Do we participate in some of these threads to bash other ideas? Why do we participate in threads where we will likely NEVER change our minds?

How many of us honestly approach a subject with an open mind to the extent that we could actually be persuaded to change our positions? I'm guessing the number is very low. If you are participating in a discussion where the likelihood you will change your position is very very low, what is the point in having the discussion at all? Do you honestly want to understand the opposing viewpoint better?

I guess I feel like there are a lot of people on this forum who aren't really interested in having a civil discussion. They are interested in having their own bias validated by others who share it. They want pats on the back instead of dialog.

Do you think you could ever change your mind on some of the bigger issues?

reply to post by DeadSeraph


I do enjoy a civil conversation on ATS more than the bickering.

I have been ripped apart in multiple threads that actually allow me to take a second look at how I perceive things...I do believe I grow from those type of interactions as much as it may hurt sometimes.

Sometimes I just like to hear myself talk because lord knows my wife will never participate in subjects that she deems foolish or fanciful.

reply to post by DeadSeraph


what you dont like my cat just died threads?

why would anyone change their minds about anything maybe its all about expressing their point of view and seeing the other side angle, its discussion not i win so gimme a s & f

I had a thread once asking the same thing If anyone has had their minds changed by others on ATS and I admit it only a couple of times have I thought "Heck Iam wrong and he is right".
I think what matters is having the bottle to hold up your hands when you are wrong and admitting it.
We all think we are right about stuff but If we all agreed it would be a little boring on ATS.
I have gone the other way due to ATS, I used to believe we never went to the moon but ATS showed me I was wrong and we have.

boymonkey74
I had a thread once asking the same thing If anyone has had their minds changed by others on ATS and I admit it only a couple of times have I thought "Heck Iam wrong and he is right".
I think what matters is having the bottle to hold up your hands when you are wrong and admitting it.
We all think we are right about stuff but If we all agreed it would be a little boring on ATS.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think everyone should agree on everything. Life would get boring quickly. I guess what I'm asking is why we have discussions on subjects that we are adamant about in the first place.

reply to post by DeadSeraph


Maybe to confirm those ideas to ourselves, maybe we have a little bit of doubt in our heads and need to put it down to help us believe our own BS, ego also, we are all guilty of it, it is only human.
YOU KNOW IAM RIGHT KNEEL BEFORE ME!!.

Ah Zod does it soo much better here

I find a lot of inspiration on forums like this. I see something interesting in a thread that I want to learn about and search for other threads about it, and search on the internet at large. For me I think it's more of this than it's a matter of me entering a thread with one opinion and leaving with another. That might have happened but I can't remember any such case right now. Also I think that in general you learn more when you discuss with people who have a differing opinion than when you discuss with people who agree with you about everything. As a matter of fact I seek out people who disagree with my opinions, to challenge my own views, and sometimes that results in my views deepening. Sometimes I attain an opinion that none of the people I read has but I still learned from the communication.

I would hope that we discuss so that we can learn something from one another. So long as people have open, yet critical minds, I would hope that collectively we could discern the facts from the fictions, the truth from the lies.

I have an idea that most of the things that we currently argue about have been deliberately set before us as bait, with the aim of dividing us from one another and setting us against one another. Divide and conquer.

At some point people can see that their mutual similarities greatly outweigh their differences, all in their own time. They will understand that it takes all kinds, and that our differences are ones to be celebrated, not ridiculed.

We discuss these things because even though we disagree on many points, we are all still here together, and that is the main point.

And some people are here because they are trolls, and they like to derail and deride. That is also a fun game, and I appreciate it being played everywhere.

reply to post by DeadSeraph


Indeed Seraph. There seems to be preaching to the choir or manning the battlements. How to get beyond this is a puzzle. There is also talking to hear oneself talk. And a lot of that.

These approaches to conversation appear to me to be the cases not only here but oft times in the general public discourse.

We do not change thought and ideas easily. If they were just a loose collection of ideas and points of view which had come to use over our lives then it might be easy. But we are more complex than that. Our thoughts are intertwined and in may cases rely upon other thoughts which basically when added up turn out to be the sense of self which we consider ourselves to be. Taking one conception, or idea or brick out of this building which is ourselves is not so easily done with out demolishing the whole structure. I no longer ask this of others at all and only in degrees of myself.

DeadSeraph

boymonkey74
I had a thread once asking the same thing If anyone has had their minds changed by others on ATS and I admit it only a couple of times have I thought "Heck Iam wrong and he is right".
I think what matters is having the bottle to hold up your hands when you are wrong and admitting it.
We all think we are right about stuff but If we all agreed it would be a little boring on ATS.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think everyone should agree on everything. Life would get boring quickly. I guess what I'm asking is why we have discussions on subjects that we are adamant about in the first place.

I see people sometimes that are obviously the way you describe. I don't understand them and I don't understand the point. Maybe for some of them they feel they have to defend their views in the world or else corruption would spread or something lol. I don't know. I guess all of us have a certain degree of that in us though. We all try to be open-minded, questioning, humble etc. Some days we're better at it than other days...

I'd like to think I am open minded about things, except religion (I used to believe, now I don't)
And things like racism and homophobia, as far as I'm concerned they are completely unacceptable!

My father is of superior intellect (cough, so he says) He is also right about everything, I basically just don't want to be like him, so make an extra effort to listen to others.

reply to post by DeadSeraph


Here's the problem the way I see it.

People who are set in a way on a subject want others to nod their heads in agreement, in a way "like this post" from Facebook has become the standard for the internet. In the same way peer pressure kept the 'freaks' from speaking up in society, the internet has followed the same path.

The issue is, it's not about bending someone to your will when it comes to a certain viewpoint. It's about expanding their mind on what they already believe, and how you go about it is more important than just outright shaking someone down until they agree with your opinion.

There are people who will never get that as they are too set in their ways to ever see the light, when I come across people like that, it's often simpler to walk away than engage them.

I enjoy reading other' opinions, especially on controversial topics, but when comments like " you are obviously lacking in grey matter" appear, it disrupts the flow.

Soon, others join in, trying to 'best' the first insulter, and the thread becomes unreadable for me.

I love considering all facets of the UFO phenomenon, but on the forum it seems to become nothing more than 'you're an idiot; they don't exist; you have no ability for rational thought', etc.

Is it not possible to politely state your differing views without a personal attack in retaliation?

There seems to be a group of 'avatars' (same people) who jump from thread to thread for a while every night, making insulting comments on each, then trading barbs for pages on end. Reminds me of the kids that never got any attention for behaving, so they learned that acting out was the only option for getting noticed.

Some of the thread 'disruptors' seem to run together, so when they show up I leave. It's better than letting my 'buttons' get pushed, and drug down to their level, which I'm ashamed to admit has already happened a few times.

nugget1
Reminds me of the kids that never got any attention for behaving, so they learned that acting out was the only option for getting noticed.

Yes, this is the real definition of Attention Deficit Disorder. Someone who doesn't get enough attention growing up, and has to seek it by being juvenile.

Unless you are a juvenile, then this is completely normal. Carry on.