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93,000 more ohio mystery votes

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posted on Nov, 12 2004 @ 09:01 PM
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I hope someonelse can confirm this. I got this from rense (I know, I know rense) but still if this is true this can blow the roof off the whole thing.




Smoking Gun

You may have seen the associated press story about the precinct in Cuyahoga county that had less than 1,000 voters, and gave Bush almost 4,000 extra votes.

But that turns out to be only the tip of a very ugly iceberg. The evidence discovered by some remarkably careful sleuthing would convince any reasonable court to invalidate the entire Ohio election.

In last Tuesday's election, 29 precincts in Cuyahoga County, Ohio, reported votes cast IN EXCESS of the number of registered voters - at least 93,136 extra votes total. And the numbers are right there on the official Cuyahoga County Board of Elections website:


www.rense.com...
Another Article

I understand that it is to late but if this information is true it does need to come to light.

[edit on 13-11-2004 by jmilici]




posted on Nov, 12 2004 @ 09:09 PM
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I live in OH, but not in one of the counties where all this debate is coming from.

Just saw on the local news this morning(?) s/thing about Kerry winning OH by counting s/thing(???). I don't know....was so groggy.
Guess I could always go look up my local news station if anyone cares. I don't unless the DO a voter recount. Then I would be highly interested!!



posted on Nov, 12 2004 @ 10:02 PM
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Juanita, I myself live in ohio and as you not in one of the counties. But I am interested in what you heard. You do not need to giva a local but maybe point me to your local news. I am located in champaign county. I personally think that there will never be a recount but I still want the truth to come out if thier indeed was fraud.



posted on Nov, 13 2004 @ 01:33 PM
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Originally posted by jmilici
I hope someonelse can confirm this. I got this from rense (I know, I know rense) but still if this is true this can blow the roof off the whole thing.


The Rense article gives a link so you can verify the information yourself. I looked into this briefly yesterday, and I will share what little I found.

REGISTERED VOTERS - BAY VILLAGE 13710

Bay Village consists of the following Wards:

REGISTERED VOTERS - BYVL WD1 3602
REGISTERED VOTERS - BYVL WD2 3381
REGISTERED VOTERS - BYVL WD3 3122
REGISTERED VOTERS - BYVL WD4 3605

Notice how the numbers add up?

BALLOTS CAST BAY VILLAGE 18663

BALLOTS CAST BYVL WD1 2233
BALLOTS CAST BYVL WD2 2164
BALLOTS CAST BYVL WD3 2030
BALLOTS CAST BYVL WD4 2288

Notice how the numbers do not add up?

I checked about 5 of the 29 precincts mentioned in the article, and they all shared this same thing in common.

What I have not done, is determine which totals the ballots cast for the county (665,334) used when totaling the vote.

However, I did look at the totals based on the assumption that their is indeed an extra 93,000 votes in the county. This is what I found:

As declared:

MICHAEL BADNARIK/RICHARD V. CAMPAGNA 1828 0.28%
GEORGE W. BUSH/DICK CHENEY 215624 33.05%
JOHN F. KERRY/JOHN EDWARDS 433262 66.41%
CANDIDATE DISQUALIFIED 0 0.00%
MICHAEL A. PEROUTKA/CHUCK BALDWIN 1667 0.26%

Without 93,136 extra votes for Bush:
MICHAEL BADNARIK/RICHARD V. CAMPAGNA 1828 0.33%
GEORGE W. BUSH/DICK CHENEY 122488 21.90%
JOHN F. KERRY/JOHN EDWARDS 433262 77.47%
CANDIDATE DISQUALIFIED 0 0.00%
MICHAEL A. PEROUTKA/CHUCK BALDWIN 1667 0.30%

Without 93,136 extra votes for Kerry
MICHAEL BADNARIK/RICHARD V. CAMPAGNA 1828 0.33%
GEORGE W. BUSH/DICK CHENEY 215624 38.56%
JOHN F. KERRY/JOHN EDWARDS 340126 60.82%
CANDIDATE DISQUALIFIED 0 0.00%
MICHAEL A. PEROUTKA/CHUCK BALDWIN 1667 0.30%


Which of these 3 results doesn't sound like it describes a county in a swing state?

A. The one with a 33% lead to Kerry?
B. The one with a 56% lead to Kerry?
C. The one with a 22% lead to Kerry?

This leads me to believe one of two things. Either it is an error that didn't effect results in a partisan manner, or the extra votes were for Kerry.



posted on Nov, 13 2004 @ 01:50 PM
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Originally posted by Raphael_UO
This leads me to believe one of two things. Either it is an error that didn't effect results in a partisan manner, or the extra votes were for Kerry.


Shhhhhh!


What are you trying to do? Start something??


We're SUPPOSED to just take people's word for it that the republicans caused all the problems and it only benefited them! How dare you do research instead of blindly following anti Bush conspiricy sites!



posted on Nov, 13 2004 @ 02:02 PM
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What about a third option that the extra votes went to Bush to give him an overall lead in the state despite losing that county?



posted on Nov, 13 2004 @ 02:20 PM
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Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
Shhhhhh!


What are you trying to do? Start something??


We're SUPPOSED to just take people's word for it that the republicans caused all the problems and it only benefited them! How dare you do research instead of blindly following anti Bush conspiricy sites!


What can I say? I believe that the accused is innocent until proven guilty.

Voter fraud gives weight to a particular vote. I believe that one eligible vote for a canidate should equal one vote, not 100.01% of a vote, and not 99.99% of a vote. Recognizing and eliminating fraud should be a nonpartisan effort.


Edit:


Originally posted by Frith
What about a third option that the extra votes went to Bush to give him an overall lead in the state despite losing that county?


Show me anything that says Kerry was expected to win Cuyahoga county with a 50% margin and I will concede the possibility.

edit two:

I came across this link while investigating pre-election polling data for Cuyahoga county.

But county officials say that's not how the data should be read. The "ballots cast" is not a reflection of the votes within a city's borders; the numbers also include votes in the congressional and legislative districts that overlap with the cities.

Excuse me??
CoughCOUGHWHITEWASHCOUGHcough

Look at my description and decide if that is true.



[edit on 13-11-2004 by Raphael_UO]



posted on Nov, 13 2004 @ 03:49 PM
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2000 Results for Cuyahoga County:

Total Ballots cast: 590,473
Bush: 192,099 (32.53%)
Gore: 359,913 (60.95%)


Change in Voter leaning from 2000 to 2004:

As reported:
+0.52% for Republicans
+5.46% for Democrats

Without extra Bush Votes:
-10.63% for Republicans
+16.52% for Democrats

Without Extra Kerry Votes:
+6.03% for Republicans
-0.13% for Democrats

You can decide which makes more sense to you. I am leaning toward the "as reported" changes, meaning it was a nonpartisan error.

Still looking for those pre-election polls though.



[edit on 13-11-2004 by Raphael_UO]



posted on Nov, 13 2004 @ 05:22 PM
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The proper thing to do is a revote in all areas that used the electronic voting systems. Lets find out what the real vote is.



posted on Nov, 13 2004 @ 05:56 PM
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Originally posted by Indy
The proper thing to do is a revote in all areas that used the electronic voting systems. Lets find out what the real vote is.


Cuyahoga used optical scanners. There is a "paper trail". No need to revote when a recount is available.



posted on Nov, 13 2004 @ 10:26 PM
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As the auther of this thread I must make something clear. I do not like bush and I did not vote for kerry. I voted third party. I still think there was voter fraud and want to know the truth. Whether it was on the side of the dems or repubs.

Raphael_UO, great work
, I am really glad someone was actually able to do some research. Unfortunately when I read that article I was at work and not able to do extended research.

I do however have a problem with the so called official statement given by the county. I feel they set it up this way to hide something. I may be wrong and just being a crazy conspiracy theorist. Does this happen elsewhere? What is the reasoning for doing it this?


[edit on 13-11-2004 by jmilici]



posted on Nov, 13 2004 @ 10:38 PM
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Have you guys been following The Diebold Factor thread? I have done a good deal or research and posted information there that might be of some interest to you guys as well. Also bear in mind who owns the optical scanners for the few paper votes left... The Help America Vote Act is the worst thing that has ever happened to democracy in this country, it mandates that by 2006, all votes will be cast on electronic devices. I wonder who told the bastages we needed their help to vote in the first place???
Have a look at this thread, alot of information...
www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Nov, 13 2004 @ 10:55 PM
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Originally posted by jmilici
As the auther of this thread I must make something clear. I do not like bush and I did not vote for kerry. I voted third party. I still think there was voter fraud and want to know the truth. Whether it was on the side of the dems or repubs.


I couldn't agree more, though I live in Ohio and didn't vote third party.




I do however have a problem with the so called official statement given by the county. I feel they set it up this way to hide something. I may be wrong and just being a crazy conspiracy theorist. Does this happen elsewhere? What is the reasoning for doing it this?


About that, there is a disclaimer on the site, but um... read:

From the article on the County's statement:
A disclaimer on the elections board's Web site warns viewers not to count up votes in a city based on the "ballots cast" column.

From the county's BOE page:
In even-numbered years, the Cuyahoga County Board of Elections tallies absentee ballots by Congressional, House, and Senate district combinations. Because of this, the ballots cast totals for municipalities on this web page and on the summary report needs to be derived by using the following technique: For municipalities with wards, find the ballots cast total for each ward and total them. For municipalities without wards, please refer to the contest of interest on the canvass report.

Now consider:

We are talking about 93,136 votes to bring those municipalities down to 100% voter turn out.

WARNING: Put your protective cup on this one is aiming between the legs.

BALLOTS CAST ABSENTEE 80624


Something stinks in Cuyahoga County and it ain't Cleveland.

[edit on 13-11-2004 by Raphael_UO]



posted on Nov, 13 2004 @ 11:24 PM
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Originally posted by twitchy
Have you guys been following The Diebold Factor thread? I have done a good deal or research and posted information there that might be of some interest to you guys as well. Also bear in mind who owns the optical scanners for the few paper votes left... The Help America Vote Act is the worst thing that has ever happened to democracy in this country, it mandates that by 2006, all votes will be cast on electronic devices. I wonder who told the bastages we needed their help to vote in the first place???
Have a look at this thread, alot of information...
www.abovetopsecret.com...


I did read it. I even posted information concerning the number of electronic votes cast in Ohio. Unfortunately, speculation is pointless without supporting evidence, and the discrepancy Cuyahoga county does not seem to support a Diebold-Bush conspiracy.



[edit on 13-11-2004 by Raphael_UO]



posted on Nov, 13 2004 @ 11:58 PM
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even if there was conspiracy and BS going on, it's over. bush is staying in office and nothing's gonna get him out for the next 4 years. dissapointing as it is,it's too late.



posted on Nov, 14 2004 @ 12:05 AM
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Originally posted by Raphael_UO Unfortunately, speculation is pointless without supporting evidence,

I could not have said it better myself...



posted on Nov, 14 2004 @ 01:25 AM
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Originally posted by psychosgirl
... bush is staying in office and nothing's gonna get him out for the next 4 years...


except for Stanley Hilton maybe.



posted on Nov, 14 2004 @ 01:30 AM
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Originally posted by psychosgirl
even if there was conspiracy and BS going on, it's over. bush is staying in office and nothing's gonna get him out for the next 4 years. dissapointing as it is,it's too late.


If you believe voter fraud will go away without something being done about it, you are sorely mistaken. But before something can be done about voter fraud, the nature of the fraud has to be investigated and determined.

For me, this has nothing to do with the candidate in office now; my candidate won. Its about an eligible vote counting as 100% of one vote and not 100.01% or 99.99%. It about 3rd party candidates getting the shaft because fraud could have given one or both candidates more additonal votes than they even received. It about the principles this nation was founded on-- equal rights of the individual.

You know what else? Bush, if he had knowledge of fraud, could be removed from office through impeachment. He was President when the fraud took place. On the other hand, Kerry, if he had knoweldge of fraud and won, could not have been.


@twitchy
The discrepancies in the Cuyahoga count may be enough evidence to begin a real investigation. After that is done, we can discuss how the real investigation was a conspiracy to cover the real truth.


[edit on 14-11-2004 by Raphael_UO]



posted on Nov, 14 2004 @ 08:02 PM
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Here's an explanation that doesn't sound like white wash.

Seems it was a error that lead to the mispresenting of the data, and it did not effect actual vote count.

As I said, a non-partisan error.



Edit: The detailed county report is here. I checked a couple of precincts and the information adds up.



[edit on 14-11-2004 by Raphael_UO]




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