How Snowflakes are created

well i've hypothesized on this for many years. Although somehow within me i felt it to be right and correct when i first deduced it. and it is simple.

In the study of Sound Cymatics, Swiss scientist, Dr. Hans Jenny explores the topic of the effects of sound, on matter. what he had discovered can be easily described with the following videos. if you havent seen them before, be assured that they are very entertaining, at the very least.







my hypothesis is simple. sound cymatics is affecting the shape and structure of a water droplet as it freezes in our atmosphere, and accounts for, and determines it's growth structure and final pattern. creating a snowflake.

there then is seen that our atmosphere contains within it many frequencies travelling through the clouds and affecting the shape of individual water droplets, creating unique shapes in each snowflake. shapes and sizes can also have minor differences related to the volume of water contained in each droplet, and the conditions under which it was formed.

in effect, i can create 2 identical snowflakes if i were to blast 2 separate water droplets of equal volume with the same frequency and under the same conditions in a lab.

2 more inferences are now gathered from this:

perhaps, the multitude of various frequencies in our atmosphere affecting each water droplet to give it a unique shape, are coming from earth's surface. this could be noise from any multitude of things, including our wireless communication transmissions.

or

perhaps the source of the frequencies is somehow external to earth's atmosphere and bombards our atmosphere much like aurora borealis shows into our sky. this would show a direct path of communication from nature on a cosmic level reaching earth. such an external source is directly communicating with the planet and would be worthy of observation. it would demonstrate, that not only are we bombarded by light, but also sound from a cosmic source, which is interpreted by our planet in it's operative abilities. and may even go so far, as into affecting our weather.

Originally posted by filledcup
In the study of Sound Cymatics, Swiss scientist, Dr. Hans Jenny explores the topic of the effects of sound, on matter. what he had discovered can be easily described with the following videos.

After the introduction Jenny is playing with sound to produce Chladni patterns. But the introduction is nonsensical garbage, talking about sound being responsible for everything. Space is a relative vacuum, and there's no sound transmitted through a vacuum so it's pretty easy to show that claim is false.

in effect, i can create 2 identical snowflakes if i were to blast 2 separate water droplets of equal volume with the same frequency and under the same conditions in a lab.

That's the video you should have posted, where is it?

Originally posted by Arbitrageur

Originally posted by filledcup
In the study of Sound Cymatics, Swiss scientist, Dr. Hans Jenny explores the topic of the effects of sound, on matter. what he had discovered can be easily described with the following videos.

After the introduction Jenny is playing with sound to produce Chladni patterns. But the introduction is nonsensical garbage, talking about sound being responsible for everything. Space is a relative vacuum, and there's no sound transmitted through a vacuum so it's pretty easy to show that claim is false.

in effect, i can create 2 identical snowflakes if i were to blast 2 separate water droplets of equal volume with the same frequency and under the same conditions in a lab.

That's the video you should have posted, where is it?

you seem knowledgeable. is it possible that cosmic radiation bombarding our atmosphere could cause frequencies of sound within our atmosphere? basically, the sound isnt traveling through space but is sort of a drop-off packet of what actually traveled across space to get to our atmosphere. and our earth translates part of it into various frequencies including sound and light within our borders.

i wouldnt say his introduction is garbage. he's attempting to follow the scriptural train of thought. where God created the world with his word. basically giving birth to sound. i wouldnt throw out his theory completely since we know that electro-magnetism is responsible for a significant portion of the aspect of existence we call 'life'. energy and vibration therefore being building blocks. and there is no vibration without sound.

basically, someone drops a book on the floor, the wind pressure escaping from under the book as it approaches the ground creates a gust of wind, that gust makes it's way to a pencil at the edge of a desk, causing the pencil to wobble just enough to roll off the table and fall to the ground. we hear the sound of the pencil when this happens. but if we knew the entire process but could not hear the sound of the book when it actually falls, we would identify the dropping of the book to the sound of a pencil hitting the floor.

as for the lab, well it is my imagination i use for a lab to conduct the experiments. im more than pretty sure it will work just as ive described. but i dont have access to a physical lab with the required equipment at the moment.

i am also certain, that i can replicate more and more complex patterns by combining frequencies based on the attributes normally instinctive to a particular frequency. but seeing as you seem more interested in the snowflake replicating aspect, would that mean that you then agree that this aspect of sound is a required and missing element in the scientific description of the snowflake formation process? it currently has nothing that indicates an aspect of sound frequencies controlling the shape and development of a forming snowflake.

Originally posted by filledcup
you seem knowledgeable. is it possible that cosmic radiation bombarding our atmosphere could cause frequencies of sound within our atmosphere? basically, the sound isnt traveling through space but is sort of a drop-off packet of what actually traveled across space to get to our atmosphere. and our earth translates part of it into various frequencies including sound and light within our borders.

So if the square peg doesn't fit in a round hole, you want to hammer it in anyway, eh?

Even if cosmic rays striking the atmosphere caused sound, and I've never seen evidence they do, you can't say it's a form of sound transmission. Speaker wire sends electrical signals to speakers, but it's not sound in the speaker wire, it's electrical signals.

i wouldnt say his introduction is garbage. he's attempting to follow the scriptural train of thought. where God created the world with his word.

You may notice this is the science forum, where scripture is not usually cited as a reliable source for scientific information. I know some people like young earth creationists think their scripture takes precedence over science, and in their home it might, but it doesn't in science forums. If you don't recognize that sound can't travel through a vacuum and there's a lot of vacuum in the universe, then you need to work on your powers of perception when you say the claim by Peter Manners that "Everything owes its existence solely and completely to sound" is not garbage.

Sound has some interesting properties for sure, but that claim is way over the top.

Originally posted by Arbitrageur

Originally posted by filledcup
you seem knowledgeable. is it possible that cosmic radiation bombarding our atmosphere could cause frequencies of sound within our atmosphere? basically, the sound isnt traveling through space but is sort of a drop-off packet of what actually traveled across space to get to our atmosphere. and our earth translates part of it into various frequencies including sound and light within our borders.

So if the square peg doesn't fit in a round hole, you want to hammer it in anyway, eh?

Even if cosmic rays striking the atmosphere caused sound, and I've never seen evidence they do, you can't say it's a form of sound transmission. Speaker wire sends electrical signals to speakers, but it's not sound in the speaker wire, it's electrical signals.

agreed in the case of speaker wire and speakers. but it may not be such a square peg in a round hole. to answer the question with absolute surety, we'd have to know which side the frequencies are coming from, whether earth-side or being caused by external factors. since you dont know whether cosmic radiation bombardment can cause frequencies to rain down in our upper atmosphere, then i think ur information would be incomplete to make a final assessment.

if it does turn out to be externally translated frequencies, then it is very possible that we can observe a form of cosmic interplanetary communication. note.. this is not human communication like a sentence or paragraph to translate. im referring to communication between plantery bodies. solar flares from the sun for example, bombard earth's magnetosphere. couldnt this generate sounds which make their way into earth's atmosphere?

if those sounds affect moisture in our atmosphere, they could well affect the weather. various frequencies may have different effects in creating certain weather patterns.if all this turns out to be true.. we could effectively control the weather. all this can confirm this form of communication to be true.

we're still looking at the pencil as though it just fell on it's own and not realizing that it's fall was initiated by the book.

Originally posted by filledcup
since you dont know whether cosmic radiation bombardment can cause frequencies to rain down in our upper atmosphere, then i think ur information would be incomplete to make a final assessment.

I don't know if unicorns exist either, and I can't prove they don't exist. You can speculate about those too, along with the flying spaghetti monster, if you want to speculate about any and every idea that we have no evidence to support. That doesn't mean it's a worthwhile exercise. But if someone has credible evidence to support a claim, science will review it.

Some people are confused by the audio recordings that have been made by transposing the electromagnetic radiation frequencies resulting from the interaction of the solar wind with planetary magnetic fields, but the original source is not any form of sound. Thinking that it's sound is just a form of ignorance. It's simply another way of presenting the data, like a graph. NASA explains it here;

solarsystem.nasa.gov...

One approach scientists use to make sense of the data from instruments is to make pictures and graphs to represent the data. This is called "data visualization". Some types of data, especially radio signals, are very similar in many ways to sound. The power of a radio signal is analogous to the volume of a sound. The radio signal also varies in terms of the frequency and wavelength of the radio waves, which is like the variation in pitch of sound waves. So scientists sometimes translate radio signals into sound to better understand the signals. This approach is called "data sonification". Click the image on your left to hear the sound that corresponds to this graph.

It can be presented as sound, but the original source is not sound.

well that's exactly what i said. the source is not sound and im not claiming that it is. sound is not the cause, but the effect. so as it would seem solar winds do cause sound to be produced in our atmosphere. so this is not an issue with the spaghetti monster since we do know that the magnetosphere intercepts solar winds and forwards sound through to our atmosphere. which affects moisture in our atmosphere as it changes states.

when we receive an email on a computer, the data had to first travel across the internet. we can then view the internet as space and the computer system as earth with its magnetosphere. essentially, what is sent across the internet are packets of 1s and 0s. but when they hit the computer, they are translated into a readable message or photo. a photo is not what traveled through space. but the magnetosphere translates it and splits it into the required forms of output. sound, photo, video or writing. in this situation we see the connection between the book hitting the floor and the pencil dropping.

also note that we analyze radio signals as they travel through space to reach our planet. how do these radio signals travel through space to be interpreted?

Allow me to also cite this latest discovery:

www.disclose.tv...

July 10, 2013 - NASA has turned science fiction into science fact by announcing the discovery of hidden ‘portals’ in Earth’s magnetic field. Deemed X-points or ‘electron diffusion regions’, rather than being intergalactic folds in space leading to different galaxies and planets found in sci-fi novels, these diffusion regions aid in the transfer of the magnetic field from the Sun to Earth.

Essentially, these portals help with the transfer of the tons of magnetically charged particles that flow from the Sun. These particles are responsible for the northern and southern lights and geomagnetic storms.

Read more: www.disclose.tv...

now that science has observed the node elements which assist in the translation. they are only now beginning to view evidence of interplanetary bodies communication. answering my original question which i posed to you in the fullest. obviously i couldve posted this topic several years ago and it would only now, through this report be given some level of credence. altho my aim first and foremost was to identify a missing element in the snowflake formation process.

everything is connected, not just in our bodies, but in the world as well. again.. we view the pencil as a random event.. when a pencil falls we think "oh a pencil fell.. cool" not realizing that it is when a book falls it causes wind that pushes the pencil off the table in the first place.

as you can see, even without a physical lab, science is trailing my understanding. and this isnt the first incidence of this. in fact i have a full on track record of predicting scientific developments, where it will succeed and fail in discovery. i need only know of an experiment and it's factors to know if it will be a successful experiment. unfortunately, i must give some credit to scriptures of the world having studied them all as much as i can get my hands on, provided me great insight into the operations of existence. i fear that without such studies i would not be able to process this sort of vision in scientific discovery, and for that reason i must give scripture some credit. takes away none from the solidness of the scientific discoveries i put forth using only my imagination for a lab.

i have been asking you for answers to questions that i already knew the answer to. to see what responses come from scientific academia on the topic only. as we can see, solar winds create light, affect the weather (geomagnetic storms affecting our planetary frequency shield. shield is disrupted and can influence the weather) and the final factor which i am now including.. Sound or frequencies.

note the things i say, and see them come to pass. anyone with a lab can replicate the snowflake formation process as ive laid it out and make this an accepted contribution to science. it will finally, be able to identify the complete process of snowflake formation and no longer be guessing and unsure in it's statements.

the earth itself creates a frequency of sound and these things not only affect our atmosphere, but our being as well. a frequency can be used to make someone sick, or well again since it is due to instability or misalignment in their magnetic field which causes illness. in this same way, i believe frequency of sound can be used to manipulate the weather to extremes, or make it perfectly pleasant. i will stop here for now awaiting your reply.

Originally posted by filledcup
so this is not an issue with the spaghetti monster since we do know that the magnetosphere intercepts solar winds and forwards sound through to our atmosphere.

Yes it's a spaghetti monster until you provide evidence. I don't know how you got that idea there is sound. You apparently don't understand what NASA clearly explained. I said I've not seen any evidence for sound, and I didn't present any from NASA. You may as well claim that graphs are being transmitted because graphs are another form of presenting the same data. But of course graphs aren't being transmitted either, graphs and sound are just analytical tools.

which affects moisture in our atmosphere as it changes states.

There is "space weather" at high altitudes where there is little moisture.

The vast majority of moisture in the atmosphere is at lower altitudes, which is below the "space weather". So it's really a stretch to tie space weather and moisture together, unless you have some evidence for this.

also note that we analyze radio signals as they travel through space to reach our planet. how do these radio signals travel through space to be interpreted?

This is well-understood by those who have studied the phenomenon but understanding probably requires taking a course on the subject, not reading a short reply in a forum post. I can assure you of this, there is no sound involved, just electricity and magnetism interacting in what we call electromagnetism or electromagnetic radiation.

let me also add this quote for a focal point:

While Scudder and his team at the University of Iowa are unsure of the true purpose of the portals, they have observed charged particles flowing through them. These particles are believed to cause electro-magnetic phenomemon in the Earth’s atmosphere.

Read more: www.disclose.tv...

is this not the same thing i said in my first post which science is now coming to know with expensive equipment?

my understanding of existence can help to catapult science in any avenue of study. and yes ive pretty much studied them all. some more in depth than others. again unfortunately, i give credit to this understanding to a Supreme Creator who has provided me the faculty to do so.

our magnetosphere is splitting or filtering the solar winds into energy in the form of light, and vibration in the form of frequency/sound. these 2 together create electromagnetism. it is almost like they studied my post to publish this.

Originally posted by filledcup
Read more: www.disclose.tv...


is this not the same thing i said in my first post which science is now coming to know with expensive equipment?

Same thing as what in your first post? You were talking about snowflakes, remember? That says nothing about snowflakes. You sure you're in the right thread?

Originally posted by Arbitrageur

Originally posted by filledcup
Read more: www.disclose.tv...


is this not the same thing i said in my first post which science is now coming to know with expensive equipment?

Same thing as what in your first post? You were talking about snowflakes, remember? That says nothing about snowflakes. You sure you're in the right thread?

what about this? was this not an introduction to the links discerned from my snowflake formation process as i aattempted to not go too far off topic? i see the connections.

perhaps the source of the frequencies is somehow external to earth's atmosphere and bombards our atmosphere much like aurora borealis shows into our sky. this would show a direct path of communication from nature on a cosmic level reaching earth. such an external source is directly communicating with the planet and would be worthy of observation. it would demonstrate, that not only are we bombarded by light, but also sound from a cosmic source, which is interpreted by our planet in it's operative abilities. and may even go so far, as into affecting our weather.

and this, did i not further explain inter planetary communication in further posts?

is it possible that cosmic radiation bombarding our atmosphere could cause frequencies of sound within our atmosphere? basically, the sound isnt traveling through space but is sort of a drop-off packet of what actually traveled across space to get to our atmosphere. and our earth translates part of it into various frequencies including sound and light

so as it would seem solar winds do cause sound to be produced in our atmosphere. so this is not an issue with the spaghetti monster since we do know that the magnetosphere intercepts solar winds and forwards sound through to our atmosphere

we are still on the topic of sound cymatics. notice science has identified the aurora bourealis but still have not yet identified the other aspect which is filtered .. sound/frequency.. placing me still ahead. we are still most certainly on the topic of sound cymatics, however it is linked in a chainlink fashion from the micro right up to the macro. as above so below lol. like i said.. i was asking you questions i already knew the answers to.. tho i learnt them from a mystical source, which i combined with knowledge from present day science to foresee.

reply to post by filledcup


I was just looking at Hans Jenny earlier today. Are you aware the he taught at a school of Rosicrucian and Anthrosophist Rudolf Steiner.

I thought you were going to say they were made by the same elves that make the cookies. I didn't think it was a sound scientific article.

Actually good reading, I read of the possible influences of frequencies on smow formation a while back but this is a lot more information. S&F..Got to go back and watch the videos now. I think DNA effects the different formations of frost on the windows. Maybe they act as frequency antennas. It seems the frost on our windows near the ferns outside look more like ferns and any frost closer to the oak tree looks more like leaves of trees. Pollen?

Originally posted by VeritasAequitas
reply to post by filledcup

 

I was just looking at Hans Jenny earlier today. Are you aware the he taught at a school of Rosicrucian and Anthrosophist Rudolf Steiner.

ahh my friend no i was not but that is interesting. i came across his videos several years ago in research. back then i did not even note his name, but the discoveries his cymatics video enlightened me to warranted me to note the name of the science. i myself am a rosicrucian, their studies as well have been very helpful as have been those of the square and compass

Originally posted by rickymouse
I thought you were going to say they were made by the same elves that make the cookies. I didn't think it was a sound scientific article.

Actually good reading, I read of the possible influences of frequencies on smow formation a while back but this is a lot more information. S&F..Got to go back and watch the videos now. I think DNA effects the different formations of frost on the windows. Maybe they act as frequency antennas. It seems the frost on our windows near the ferns outside look more like ferns and any frost closer to the oak tree looks more like leaves of trees. Pollen?

edit on 11-7-2013 by rickymouse because: (no reason given)

indeed, snow is just the tip of the iceberg. this has it's applications in many areas of existence including life itself.

Since you suggested anyone on your other thread should come here to try to refute your claim of snow flakes being formed by the method you describe above here I am....and here is your explanation:

Symmetry: A non-aggregated snowflake often exhibits six-fold radial symmetry. The initial symmetry can occur because the crystalline structure of ice is six-fold. The six "arms" of the snowflake, or dendrites, then grow independently, and each side of each arm grows independently. Most snowflakes are not completely symmetric. The micro-environment in which the snowflake grows changes dynamically as the snowflake falls through the cloud, and tiny changes in temperature and humidity affect the way in which water molecules attach to the snowflake. Since the micro-environment (and its changes) are very nearly identical around the snowflake, each arm can grow in nearly the same way. However, being in the same micro-environment does not guarantee that each arm grows the same; indeed, for some crystal forms it does not because the underlying crystal growth mechanism also affects how fast each surface region of a crystal grows. Empirical studies suggest less than 0.1% of snowflakes exhibit the ideal six-fold symmetric shape.

Snowflake Wiki

I would suggest if you are so interested in why things happen like this that you study fractals and why they occur in almost everything that grows in the world, including humans. It has nothing to do with frequencies or electrical impulses or sound.

Fractal Wiki

And no, your snowflake theory does not work at all and that is not at all how they are formed.

Originally posted by Vasa Croe
Since you suggested anyone on your other thread should come here to try to refute your claim of snow flakes being formed by the method you describe above here I am....and here is your explanation:

Symmetry: A non-aggregated snowflake often exhibits six-fold radial symmetry. The initial symmetry can occur because the crystalline structure of ice is six-fold. The six "arms" of the snowflake, or dendrites, then grow independently, and each side of each arm grows independently. Most snowflakes are not completely symmetric. The micro-environment in which the snowflake grows changes dynamically as the snowflake falls through the cloud, and tiny changes in temperature and humidity affect the way in which water molecules attach to the snowflake. Since the micro-environment (and its changes) are very nearly identical around the snowflake, each arm can grow in nearly the same way. However, being in the same micro-environment does not guarantee that each arm grows the same; indeed, for some crystal forms it does not because the underlying crystal growth mechanism also affects how fast each surface region of a crystal grows. Empirical studies suggest less than 0.1% of snowflakes exhibit the ideal six-fold symmetric shape.

Snowflake Wiki

I would suggest if you are so interested in why things happen like this that you study fractals and why they occur in almost everything that grows in the world, including humans. It has nothing to do with frequencies or electrical impulses or sound.

Fractal Wiki

And no, your snowflake theory does not work at all and that is not at all how they are formed.

heh.. nope.

this just describes the formation process but does not fully nail down the attributing factors...

notice the use of the word 'micro-envrionment'. the process described by science today is incomplete. they have totally ignored the frequency induced magnetic factors of these shapes being formed. sound cymatics is proven to affect the shape and structure of standard matter. this is rooted in ancient doctrines of languages such as hebrew and aramaic which were said to affect the structure of matter.

it is quite obvious to see through the formation of various snowflakes, by their significant differences in design that magnetic grids, such as those associated with sound cymatics are formed via the wave of a sound. providing a 2d depiction of a wave, as opposed to a 1d representation as seen on a sine wave graph, which is only 2d in the sense that it depicts the path of a point as it travels. but it is all made of dots.

see your media player. im sure u like to turn on visualizations for a cool effects. well guess what happens when you play music through a tonoscope in a cymatics application? visualizations. but these arent microsoft generated, they are nature generated. the true attributes of the sound.


higher frequencies produce more complex shapes. see my OP. and this is the absolute most important factor to the final shape as well as the construction. these high frequencies are hitting our clouds and cause the droplets to take shapes. as the temperature drops, the droplets are frozen in shape based on the last frequency to give it its grid. as well as, quite well due to dynamic changes in frequencies upon a particular droplet can attribute different personalities in different stages of freezing the water droplet into ice.

note i have not said science is wrong. merely incomplete. and missing a big piece of the pie however. these sound cymatics are absolutely critical to a forming snowflake. and it is easy to test. float a water droplet in an acoustic levitation chamber. then hit it with a cymatics frequency for a desired shape and then reduce the temperature to the point of freezing. this is how a snowflake is formed. however, this may create a giant snowflake in comparison to what falls from our skies depending on the volume of water in the droplet used for the experiment. the acoustic levitation chamber can also control whether the droplet is spherical or flattened by frequency adjustment. prove me wrong. it shall not be done.

there's a symphony playing in our clouds.. but we only get the snow

Your cymatics videos show a vibrational pattern forming all at once through the use of sound. What you are implying is that ice crystal do not grow but form all at once in an instant. This is not how ice crystals/snowflakes form....they form from the nucleus outwards in a fractal growth pattern, not because of any frequency or sound or electromagnetism or whatever you are suggesting.

And you say:

note i have not said science is wrong. merely incomplete. and missing a big piece of the pie however. these sound cymatics are absolutely critical to a forming snowflake. and it is easy to test. float a water droplet in an acoustic levitation chamber. then hit it with a cymatics frequency for a desired shape and then reduce the temperature to the point of freezing. this is how a snowflake is formed. however, this may create a giant snowflake in comparison to what falls from our skies depending on the volume of water in the droplet used for the experiment. the acoustic levitation chamber can also control whether the droplet is spherical or flattened by frequency adjustment. prove me wrong. it shall not be done.

That is not how snowflakes are formed. What you are suggesting will just make a nice looking ice cube formed of many thousands of crystals.

Here is another explanation from a chemist with a Ph.D.:

Why are snowflakes symmetrical (same on all sides)?

First, not all snowflakes are the same on all sides. Uneven temperatures, presence of dirt, and other factors may cause a snowflake to be lop-sided. Yet it is true that many snowflakes are symmetrical and intricate. This is because a snowflake's shape reflects the internal order of the water molecules. Water molecules in the solid state, such as in ice and snow, form weak bonds (called hydrogen bonds) with one another. These ordered arrangements result in the symmetrical, hexagonal shape of the snowflake. During crystallization, the water molecules align themselves to maximize attractive forces and minimize repulsive forces. Consequently, water molecules arrange themselves in predetermined spaces and in a specific arrangement. Water molecules simply arrange themselves to fit the spaces and maintain symmetry.

It has nothing to do with what you are claiming. These are from actual scientists with labs, not made up in their heads which as far as I know is not science at all, but imagination. While your imagination is great, you lack the science to back up any of what you state.

The way I can prove you wrong is because this is the way snowflakes are formed and if what you suggest is happening is actually occurring then each individual snowflake would have to have the same vibrational influence throughout the entirety of its formation, essentially locking on to it until it is completed.