Video; Obama, responsible for Benghazi, case closed.

reply to post by sonnny1

Dear sonny1,

I'm glad you appreciate it. It makes me feel special. Most of the confused swaying I see, is in bars. Mr. TexasChem doesn't like me.

Flipping to Holder, is it safe to say that a pattern has been established along the lines of "Deny the Charge, Blame the Opposition, and Stonewall?" That seems to be happening here as well.

Don't let anybody know, this is a secret. Yes, I dislike Obama's policies, but that happens. I find I loathe him as a man. Maybe I grew up with John Wayne, and assorted "American Heroes," but I miss the honesty, trustworthiness, straight forward, admit when I'm wrong, defend those who trusted you, and still be a gentleman, kind of American role model. Had I had Obama as a Company Commander, I suspect the troops would have made his life very difficult.

Remember, it's a secret, don't tell anyone I said so.

With respect,
Charles1952

reply to post by charles1952


I totally understand how you feel.

Where is the Trust, but Verify type Presidents, when you need them??

Originally posted by sonnny1
reply to post by charles1952

 

I totally understand how you feel.

Where is the Trust, but Verify type Presidents, when you need them??

Too bad for us all, they don't get a shake at the job, because they wont bow to masters who pull all the right strings.

So they get the boot, and a good little tool comes along, and gets the job, this is the way of American politics today.

ETA- Cholo has begun to delete all his posts from this thread, "deleted for being contrary to conservative ideology"

LOL, poor guy, he really is going to take his ball and go home.

off-topic.

You know I feel a little sorry for cholo. It's Ok to be wrong, happens to me all the time. All you have to do is recognize that your thinking's screwed up, then go think it over again. But he believes he's being attacked for his ideology, and so, will never reconsider his thoughts.

He hasn't taken this opporunity to learn, and perhaps doesn't even know how to learn. As I said, I'm kind of sorry for him.

Originally posted by charles1952
off-topic.

You know I feel a little sorry for cholo. It's Ok to be wrong, happens to me all the time. All you have to do is recognize that your thinking's screwed up, then go think it over again. But he believes he's being attacked for his ideology, and so, will never reconsider his thoughts.

He hasn't taken this opporunity to learn, and perhaps doesn't even know how to learn. As I said, I'm kind of sorry for him.

Agreed. That is the reason the guy wouldn't even acknowledge any questions about the facts surrounding the situation, he would always deflect and blame Bush.

I don't think he one time acknowledged a single question about the reasoning behind denying aid to those on the ground.

It was pretty bad, but I wouldn't start a controversial thread unless I was prepared for the results, and ready to take the criticisms head on.

I hope he comes back, I hate to see anyone go so angrily and not return.

reply to post by cholo


The right cannot let Obama take the blame. The blood MUST be on Hillary's hands. Otherwise, she'll run for president in 2016 and win.

Hillary 2016!

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


I can't fathom any scenario where any Democrat wins in 2016. Once Obamacare his in full force in January and people are crushed with the massive premiums and taxes the people will be screaming for it's repeal.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by cholo

 

The right cannot let Obama take the blame. The blood MUST be on Hillary's hands. Otherwise, she'll run for president in 2016 and win.

Hillary 2016!

Yep, that is what it is all about now.

The smear campaign for 2016 has already started.

Originally posted by cholo

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by cholo

 

Langley could have scrambled jets in that time, watch him sit there and then talk about your dismal
comparison

What the hell would Langley have to do with scrambling jets???

To protect the pentagon

"Langley" is the CIA. They have nothing to do with scrambling military aircraft. The Pentagon can scramble it's OWN DOD aircraft without anyone's assistance.

You know, it is really sad to see cholo leave because it is being allowed for a gang of members to jump on him, insult him, mock him, and openly deride him and not his opinions.

I see it happen all the time, there is a gang of right wing members that will always gang up on someone with a liberal mindset and if that person dares to fight back...they get posts removed or banned.

Don't worry, I know the risk I'm running by pointing this out...it will most likely be removed and/or me banned...it is just how it is.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
I can't fathom any scenario where any Democrat wins in 2016.

I know a lot of people couldn't fathom Obama winning a second term. I guess we'll see.

Truth is, Obama is ultimately responsible for what happens during his term. That doesn't mean he pulled the trigger, or should be punished for it, but the buck stops there. Being president is like that. It's WAY more than just a job. It's a HUGE responsibility, of which we have no clue.

The right is playing politics with this event. And most people can see it, even though the vocal minority cannot.

reply to post by DistantRumor


If cholo is going to take the position of supporting Obama in any way here on ATS, he/she is not in a popular position. Just ask me. While I certainly don't support everything he does by a long shot, it is well known that I generally support Obama as president and have voted for him twice. If being "popular" here was my goal, I'd be quiet about it. But sometimes you have to be strong and just let things roll off your back. It's just words... If you see a direct attack, report it. That's my advice.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


Why did you respond to my post with the context scrubbed out?

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Proper Quoting - Freshman Forum

I always trim quotes down to the section I'm replying to because I HATE big and "nested" quotes. They're messy and confusing. I never trim a quote to purposely exclude context.

WHY you think Democrats will lose is not relevant to my reply. There is no nefarious scheme here. If people want to read the rest of your post, they can click on the "reply to" portion that I always include.

Now, is there something else you want to nit-pick or can we get back on topic?

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by cholo

 

The right cannot let Obama take the blame. The blood MUST be on Hillary's hands. Otherwise, she'll run for president in 2016 and win.

Hillary 2016!

I'd like to think Hillary's head wound...whatever that was all about...is about enough to cover that little issue. There is certainly no way I'd vote for someone for the Presidency who had a head trauma bad enough to be seeing double for days, as many suggested those coke bottle glasses she had were there to correct.

For one of the single most powerful positions in the world? There are some limits. I want to see Hillary answer for this far more than Obama because her desk was the one MUCH closer to the point of decsion making on the day to day that impacted everything happening (or not happening) at the Consulate. I'm thinking, to the extent either of them had a personal hand in any of this prior to that night? Hillary decided and Obama just got it mentioned to him from time to time, in passing...if that much.

Frankly? Outside if that night directly, I've thought it rather silly to think the President would have more than the most passing awareness of the events or policy on something as micro as security arrangements at a specific consulate property in another nation. Any President. If he really was micromanaging that low, that alone is something to ask about, eh? That's certainly part of why I don't want to see it become all about Obama as President. This happened over months...not 1 night ...and I just can't see Obama being the weak link on this chain.

Originally posted by charles1952
off-topic.

You know I feel a little sorry for cholo. It's Ok to be wrong, happens to me all the time. All you have to do is recognize that your thinking's screwed up, then go think it over again. But he believes he's being attacked for his ideology, and so, will never reconsider his thoughts.

He hasn't taken this opporunity to learn, and perhaps doesn't even know how to learn. As I said, I'm kind of sorry for him.

You know, after that post, I feel a little sorry for you. But just a little.

Originally posted by DistantRumor
You know, it is really sad to see cholo leave because it is being allowed for a gang of members to jump on him, insult him, mock him, and openly deride him and not his opinions.

I see it happen all the time, there is a gang of right wing members that will always gang up on someone with a liberal mindset and if that person dares to fight back...they get posts removed or banned.

Don't worry, I know the risk I'm running by pointing this out...it will most likely be removed and/or me banned...it is just how it is.

I didn't see Cholo being attacked in any way, on a personal level. I saw it from him...I didn't see it to him. Perhaps I'm just odd that way. When you've been here awhile (JUST made your account yesterday I notice), you'll see how it all works, I'm sure..

A friend of mine, and who FIRST told me about ATS, was hounded right off this site, as HE saw it.... Why? He claimed people were intolerant and hateful because they wouldn't accept his precise view of FEMA camps. FEMA camps, of all things...he actually said no one here had the open mindedness to accept them as real! ....he was actually just too closed minded and insistent people see it precisely HIS way and we don't talk about ATS. It's a super-sore subject with him, last I even saw him.

Frankly, if I use provably faulty logic and then stand by my bad position like someone cussing the makers of the ice cube from the deck of the Titanic? I'd be torn to bloody little pieces of broken argument and logic around here ...my numbers or history doing NOTHING to save me from that fate. In fact, it happened a couple times, early on, before I learned to use facts and logic almost exclusively. Never opinion as a basis.


On this topic? There are plenty of facts and really? Anyone suggesting that 3 good Americans plus 1 the rank of an Ambassador, being killed....is simply partisan or we should all "get over it" without a proper investigation? Well...It's much like saying people should just 'get over 9/11' because it's over a decade ago...so what does it matter now?? It's not the body count, it's the principle. We're a nation founded on and run by principle. Or, at least we were.

That is why it matters ...and why those who say it doesn't in such an off handed and casual way? Will certainly meet an aggressive, factually based, but aggressive defense of the right to know and understand events like this. Such is life on a very high tempo site in a very adversarial, debate oriented subject area.

* Personally, I hope Cholo comes back. I really do. There are a number of members here who I give a WIDE birth to on some subjects ...because I know we disagree SO strongly, it's Insta-Fight. Just add Bunny or visa-versa ...Yet on other topics? We can debate as allies, and do just that. I'd have been interested to see what else he thought of things, after this topic passed.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Excellent points!

The problem here is Obama is a Democrat. So, no matter what, the Democrats will defend Obama and everyone associated with Obama. This is really the ugly side of Politics. People are literally BLIND ZOMBIES when it comes to following the Democrats or the Republicans.

The Democrats want you to just let it go because they don't want you to find more dirt. These Politicians on both side are corrupt to the core and the thing that gives them their power is ignorant people who worship these Politicians.

If this was a Republican the roles would be reversed. Democrats would be screaming for more investigations and impeachment and Republicans will be saying it's time to move on.

Obama is the most protected President I have seen in my lifetime. Most of the media don't report on Obama they cover for Obama.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Proper Quoting - Freshman Forum

I always trim quotes down to the section I'm replying to because I HATE big and "nested" quotes. They're messy and confusing. I never trim a quote to purposely exclude context.

WHY you think Democrats will lose is not relevant to my reply. There is no nefarious scheme here. If people want to read the rest of your post, they can click on the "reply to" portion that I always include.

Now, is there something else you want to nit-pick or can we get back on topic?

Well then you never addressed why I said they would lose in '16. You don't have to, sure we can move on if you wish.

Originally posted by neoholographic
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

Excellent points!

The problem here is Obama is a Democrat. So, no matter what, the Democrats will defend Obama and everyone associated with Obama. This is really the ugly side of Politics. People are literally BLIND ZOMBIES when it comes to following the Democrats or the Republicans.

You're right on that. I must admit (as if it's "news" to any long term members anyway) I was one of the worse when it came to being very focused and party oriented. It wasn't until last November I took a look around me and realized...the normal passions of party and election time had turned to a true, black hate among so many and so DEEPLY. On both sides.

We're being played off each other to keep those in power safe...R's and D's together. Those in office are the only ones benefiting, and they're the ones who don't have that division in more than appearance. Heck, ever hear of them having a raging or flaming debate/argument outside the range of cameras or a stenographer, taking it for the record? Rarely....and that's the whole point, isn't it?

If this was a Republican the roles would be reversed. Democrats would be screaming for more investigations and impeachment and Republicans will be saying it's time to move on.

True enough...and I don't think the point can be argued with some folks at this stage. When/If this gets far enough to touch the middle-upper management levels, where bad decisions actually happen at a place like the State Department, we'll see both parties represented by the career people who helped make this happen. I will absolutely demand they all be held to account. Regardless of politics. Until that is proven in action and not mere word tho? Indeed.... Some won't take it for more than empty words.

Obama is the most protected President I have seen in my lifetime. Most of the media don't report on Obama they cover for Obama.

Again, I agree. Reagan had the people around him that were as protective and just as willing to cover ANYTHING to save his reputation for pure ideology reasons. Reagan didn't have the near full cooperation of all levels of media. That would be the key difference I see today, but it's a giant one, eh?

reply to post by cholo


im not trying to insult you in anyway but where does he claim its a terrorist attack, he doesn't actually call it a terrorist attack he calls it an attack, two different meanings. even when he lists it among thing says that Americans cant let terrorist attacks blah blah, he never calls it a terrorist attack. secondly, its not a ploy against him or what he is doing, think about what he has done, tell me where he has done good and i can double that with where he has done bad. Benghazi is an issue and the story because of how he and his entire administration lied to you the american people (if you are american) then he went in front of the world at the UN and used the video again, he claims that it was not a terrorist attack, he lied, he lied on the deaths of four Americans, he has tried to pass the blame on to others when you yourself says that it was his fault and yet he hasn't offered to sit in front of congress for the investigation has he, no, Obama has been the most secretive president in a long time, he has refused to release his college information, he has denied request for information about the whole fast and furious thing (which i haven't heard much about in recent times) he has attacked Americans rights during his own reelection campaign he promised the whole gun laws wont be attacked or changed, he promised free healthcare that wasn't mandatory which is now is and is more expensive for the poor, he has yet to answer questions about why he hasn't closed down the torture prison.
to say that its just a political ploy is wrong and really kinda low. take a moment and think about it, this man is in the white house where he charges twenty thousand dollars for celebrities to come and dance with him and his wife and kids, he hangs out with celebs at parties and goes golfing and yet you say that he is doing good. sorry to rant but it just drives me nuts when people sit up and say YEP HE IS THE BEST PRESIDENT WE HAVE. haven't you seen him without a teleprompter he stumbles on his words and babbles almost as much as i have in this rant. sorry but in my opinion he is one of the worst presidents, and before you ask no i dont like republicans either and think that its time someone got into the white house who is neither.

okay im done. oh im British by the way but lived in the US for a year before leaving, i left halfway through Obama's first term not for any political reason just because i missed my own country, which sadly is also going down the pan thanks to an inept government.

RANT OVER