Internet Devices - We're Baited, Now for the Switch

Originally posted by DustbowlDebutante
reply to post by resoe26

 

ETA: Why can't someone make an app that makes phones inoperable at a certain velocity or something along those lines, simply for safety's sake?

edit on 28-3-2013 by DustbowlDebutante because: spelling

edit on 28-3-2013 by DustbowlDebutante because: (no reason given)

Neat idea, would be nice for parents to activate on their kids' phones. The reason things like this aren't heavily pursued IMO is because vendors rarely pursue things that limit what people can do, it would be viewed like an anti-selling point. GPS is sensitive enough to do what you are saying, at least I think, but what about:

- being a passenger on a bus/plane/train (GOOD, shut it off, lol)
- other exceptions here I'm not thinking of

Don't take my word for it though. Your idea is actually pretty novel, especially compared to most ideas in the space. ;-) Nice thought.

I think you are letting ATS paranoia get the better of you there. The first smartphones were way way too underpowerd to run the latest OS of the day hence the very trimmed down android. However, the power and memory in smart phones has grown quite considerably such that todays phones are indeed powerful enough to runfull blown OS....except for one minor point. The screens physical size means the interface has to work in terms of several block areas that you can control with a finger. Imagine a mouse pointer on a normal laptop that was 200 pixels in diameter !!!!!!

In case you haven't noticed the Linux world has been playing catch up and now the likes of gnome and kde have the touch screen tablet (and thus smartphone) interfaces. Also note that it wasn't until 16gb cards and 2gb internal memory came along as minimum specs that windows really able to work ie windows 8.

We are at that point in the technology where the four main computing devices desktop/laptop/tablet/smartphone are now using common O/S's. The big problem is that small screen phones and large screen computers just interface differently with users despite all the effort. It will remain that way until we can talk to them!

The internet : there is a cost problem that has been building up for years as more people access yet more info at ever smaller costs per Mb and yet the net is slowly getting choked with traffic. something has got to give and new way of paying for the services is bound to surface. Quite what I don't know but I would not be suprised if monthly fixed charges are replaced with usage charges. It just seems so much more logical. If a penny an email is the price to pay for limiting spam and preventing multi tier internet then so be it.

Sorry but your observation i wrong you need to observe this technology for the last 20 years to see how things change and what is most likely to happen.

According to this article...the debate is not mobile vs. desktop...

Forget ‘mobile vs. desktop,’ the future of computing will be a question of ‘head vs. wrist’

The battle for the future of computing is no longer a contest between tablets and PCs. Wearable computing is the hot new category, with startups like Pebble introducing “smart” watches while Apple reportedly tests a similar device (which former PandoDaily staffer Greg Kumparak asked for way back in August) in Jony Ive’s dungeon its Cupertino headquarters and Google prepares its own “smart” glasses. Wearable computing in general, and smartwatches in particular, could be, as The Verge’s Chris Ziegler writes, “the Next Big Thing in consumer tech.”

Full Article

Although, as medical advancements begin to merge with our need for communication and media...I would think that "implantable devices/components" that tap directly into the cerebral cortex (gray matter) as to allow our brains to carry out the majority of the processing...is not in the too distant future.

My avatar is not an intended pun btw

I agree that the model, universally, is regressing back into a variant of its original model. Once upon a time the only way to get online was to pay by the minute. Now some carriers are already moving to a pay per data use model. This isn't yet common, but I fear it will become the norm in fairly short order... an account where one pays maybe twenty bucks for access and for the first gig or two of use - and then half a cent per Kb thereafter.

One local company, here in Georgia, already has such a program. They offer insane speed - much higher than most other plans, but with the above payment model... first gig free and half a cent per Kb thereafter.

One caveat to this conversation however... I don't see home computing going the way of the dinosaur. I do see it changing dramatically though. The TV is going to replace the computer monitor with gaming devices and hybrid computers, like the Raspberry Pi becoming the norm for home computing. I think that the architecture in machines like the Pi will evolve rapidly and catch up to some aspects of typical desktop PC power. Ultimately I see devices that cost a few hundred dollars and which come with a high power processor and GPU... small machines that you take out of a box, hook up to your TV, plug in a USB keyboard / mouse combo, scan for a WiFi network, and that's that. A simple machine with a ton of RAM and only as much ROM as the card or USB flash drive you choose to utilize. Everything else in the Cloud.

This has actually been happening for about 25 years really. I remember being on a 386 machine discussing the emerging technology that they called Oxygen... an all in one, adaptive device that would be a phone, video phone, book reader, PC, gaming system, music player, etc. The dream that has led us to pads and smart phones.

As far as the pay to play model goes? That's how the Internet started ( the global one at least - not BBS's and whatnot ) and that system gave rise to small ISP's that offered "unlimited" plans. I imagine that as soon as the big providers all make the mistake of going to a pay for data system... small companies will rise up, again, offering an unlimited option. This will force the big carriers to do the same.

More and more Android phones will be coming with locked boot loaders, will not be vulnerable to root exploits, and will just be a lot more secure in general. There will be a lot less custom recoveries, ROMs, and modifications possible. Vendors will stop releasing complete source code, (actually most of them do not now).

This stuff is against the Open source spirit of the Android Community

We will know a lot less about the processes and applications that are running in the back ground on our phones.

We takes these devices with us everywhere, they have microphones that can record our voices, cameras that can record us visually, GPS chips that can track us where ever we go. It keeps records of our interactions / conversations with other people.

Remote access applications can be easily hidden or disguised with these new secured phones.

The government has complete control over the cell phone companies and can access any of this data they want.

Have you ever left your smart phone at home by accident or lost it, did you feel kind of naked / helpless with out it, is this a result of conditioning or do these devices really make our lives that much better.


Knowing all this stuff, I still can not wait to get an S4, get it rooted and install CyanogenMod on it.

I think Winofiend has the right idea.

The reason we haven't yet seen full desktop operating systems on mobile devices is because of the architecture in the chip. A lot of things come into play with these chips and the OS's that will run on them. Battery Consumption and Heat being a major issue with traditional processors, even in laptops. Although, this market is changing all the time.

In October, Microsoft released it's first tablet in the Surface series. Surface RT. Running a dumbed down version of Windows 8 called Windows RT, on the ARM based Tegra 3 processor. This tablet does have a desktop function and traditional file system capabilities as well as Office 2013, but you can only install applications from the Microsoft store, similar to the way Android and iOS tablets work.

Then in February, Microsoft released the Surface Pro. This tablet is nearly identical to the RT, except that it has an Intel Core i5 processor and runs a full desktop version of Windows 8 Pro. This is one of the first devices that we've seen that is a tablet running a full desktop operating system. And it's performance is phenomenal. The device is a bit thicker than the RT version of the tablet, but that's because i5 needs cooling and an air strip has been placed around the entire tablet. Don't worry, it still stays quiet and cool. Battery power is an issue, 5 hours, compared to the RT's 8-10 depending on use. But hey, you're running a full desktop operating system on a tablet.

As you mentioned in your post as well, Ubuntu is also working on a cross-device version of their operating system, that is essentially the full operating system that can be used on any device. I don't have as much info on this, but I know they did show some of the features of the OS at this years CES 2013, I watched an interview that Mark Shuttleworth had with Engadget. I am excited to see what all they have in store.

Now that the stage has been set, I expect we will be seeing more of these devices soon. Microsoft said themselves, that they were "setting the stage" for their OEM's. People want a productivity device like a laptop that is the size of a tablet. Hopefully we see more of this to come from each OS, Chrome based tablets, OS X based tablets, etc.

Also, I see a lot of people hate on Windows 8, but if you've really used it. And I mean REALLY used it. You would know that in Desktop mode, it is identical to Windows 7. The main difference being that the start menu is now metro based. It runs lighter, and has several improved features. Most of what people are complaining about is the new Metro interface, which is more suitable for touchscreens and mainly contains the Microsoft store apps. All you have to do is open the desktop and it's nearly the same machine that you had when you were using Windows 7. You can even re-enable the traditional start menu if you would like to. People just don't like change, but, we are moving into a touch based device era, the operating systems will have to evolve for that. Traditional operating systems are not as touch friendly as they need to be.

Originally posted by AkumaStreak
reply to post by TheBlackTiger

 

Your feelings are warranted. The counterpoints in this thread are largely simply not the REAL reason why this change has occurred. I do not think it is a conspiracy, but I have seen the shift you speak of over decades. Walled gardens are ideal for platform and digital ecosystem players, economically speaking. They can also be great for consumers, but with the positives, come many negatives that IMO outweigh the positives. The big positive for consumers is in the consumption department. Devices like the iPad offer a fantastic consumption experience. That is, browsing the web, tinkering with interesting apps, all without the worry of malware due to the sandboxed nature of the applications. You don't have to worry about not installing five crapware applications every time you install something (this prob. was much worse say 5-10 years ago, mostly in Windows), etc. For consumption, these devices are great.

Due to the proprietary nature of these platforms (even if a company gives you some freedom, ala Apple's developer program, you are still playing within THEIR decided limitations and learning a lot of proprietary, non-transferrable knowledge).

So what suffers as a result? Computing knowledge within the population is one thing. While being able to use an iPad might be impressive if the user is two years old (literally, two-year olds can use these, it's crazy), this is not the same as general computing knowledge. Computer science/low-level software and hardware knowledge is not being learned by heavy use of the most popular mobile devices among young people, etc. Now an iPad is a great educational device, for ex., you can get some wonderful interactive books to teach you a great many things. But again that's a caveat, and personally, I care about computing knowledge as I've always felt it hugely important -- the capacity for people to use computers as tools. So what suffers, is in the CREATE realm largely, vs. CONSUME.

Imagine a 14 year old girl that grew up with a Rasperry Pi, using that as her primary computer, vs. a girl that only had an iPad and used it for everything. Guess which kid is going to be leaps and bounds ahead wrt computing knowledge...

I suggest you stop using your mobile devices so much. Get a nice PC that you can start messing around with popular Linux distros on (Ubuntu, Linux Mint, etc.). Get back to what you love! Phones are for calling people. :-P

edit on 3/28/2013 by AkumaStreak because: (no reason given)

This is a great post. I actually tried to reply on my phone, but was unable... So lets try trusty laptop.

The key thing is that the force that led us out of the dark ages was an empowered and educated population. The dumbing down of tech consolidates power for some groups, but mostly just damages people.

The most obvious thing to me about phones, smart phones, is that they're very powerful marketing tools for businesses. TV commercials are what's going the way of the dinosaur. Advertisers are fully aware that your phone is a the most perfect opportunity they've ever had to sell things to you, because you spend more time with your phone than anyone ever did with TV.

I still don't have even a basic cell phone. And I just bought my fist laptop - 5 days ago. For me, if I'm at my computer, I'm at my computer and that's when I want to be doing all that crap. When I'm out and about, no one needs to get a hold of me.

I'm not resisting the technology exactly, just fully aware that I already use it too much to begin with. And I should have a smart phone and use it MORE? I think not.

Originally posted by AkumaStreak

Originally posted by DustbowlDebutante
reply to post by resoe26

 

ETA: Why can't someone make an app that makes phones inoperable at a certain velocity or something along those lines, simply for safety's sake?

edit on 28-3-2013 by DustbowlDebutante because: spelling

edit on 28-3-2013 by DustbowlDebutante because: (no reason given)

Neat idea, would be nice for parents to activate on their kids' phones. The reason things like this aren't heavily pursued IMO is because vendors rarely pursue things that limit what people can do, it would be viewed like an anti-selling point. GPS is sensitive enough to do what you are saying, at least I think, but what about:

- being a passenger on a bus/plane/train (GOOD, shut it off, lol)
- other exceptions here I'm not thinking of

Don't take my word for it though. Your idea is actually pretty novel, especially compared to most ideas in the space. ;-) Nice thought.

I think the reason they will never do this is because it would stop those of us who us blue tooth from using our phones legally. Also, so many cars are coming out with built in blue tooth these days. Perhaps an app that took account of that would be a good idea.

I like this thread, but I don't agree with the conclusions. I think it is a trend at the moment to have slimmed down OS's on slimmed down devices. There is no reason touch screens have to run on ARM processors, as there is no reason an X64 OS could not be ported to ARM. But these approaches are needless expense to companies who already have a good thing going. But divergence of computers will continue slowly as it is what we want. Cloud computing is a way of achieving that. Everything available everywhere. And as things continue to get more powerful - remember Mores Law? It is still happening - we will find we are able to constantly achieve more with less. The biggest problem is always the human interface - keyboard and screen. The will always need to take up a certain amount of space. Either on the screen of your tablet, or separate like on your laptop or home PC. The next biggest revolution will be fixes for these problems.

Like the OP I have run old computers. I was running company systems on stacks of i386 33Mgz computers with a massive 64Mg of RAM back in the late 80's. I remember installing my first ever 1GB hard drive into a server - it was the size of a shoe box! My telephone has a chip in it the size of my thumb nail with 32GB of space on it, and a processor running at 1Ghz. So in theory it could run that whole office of 350 people! LOL OK, it probably couldn't. But you see How things have come on in just my short life time. It blows my mind a little.

Having been involved in the it industry mostly business development over the last 20 years, I can tell you that, none of you have anything to fear. It is true that companies such as apple have created ans successfully marketed the touchscreen tablet (tablet pc were available at least 8 years earlier),

and it is true that this controlled method of computingnisnfine for a vast number of people for presisecly the reasons anyone with a bit ofntech knowledge hates them for.

I for example remeber bouncing of the ipad wall about 10 mins of first using it..... Who ever heard of needing to download an app to be able to attach to emails... Geesh....

But...

Open systems will always be available to those that know and want to use them. I think I can safely say that there is very little you cannot get around in terms of tech restrictions.

There won't be an arch administrator of the flow of data across the net, and that is all you need to be able to do anything you like... Data...

With ssd gaining in size it is possible to run virtual machines within virtual machines within virtual machines... What I mean by this is even if pc hardware was to fundimentally change, you would still be able to virtualise an opperating system of your choice.... Especially if this os is no longer a licenced product.

Have faith and keep learning new things and you will be fine...

Besides the dumbing down of the masses could also be considered the rise if the geeks!!

Korg,

Originally posted by Hektik1
Also, I see a lot of people hate on Windows 8, but if you've really used it. And I mean REALLY used it. You would know that in Desktop mode, it is identical to Windows 7. The main difference being that the start menu is now metro based. It runs lighter, and has several improved features. Most of what people are complaining about is the new Metro interface, which is more suitable for touchscreens and mainly contains the Microsoft store apps. All you have to do is open the desktop and it's nearly the same machine that you had when you were using Windows 7. You can even re-enable the traditional start menu if you would like to. People just don't like change, but, we are moving into a touch based device era, the operating systems will have to evolve for that. Traditional operating systems are not as touch friendly as they need to be.

edit on 28-3-2013 by Hektik1 because: Grammer/Spelling

edit on 28-3-2013 by Hektik1 because: (no reason given)

Just to let you know, there are some mods you can easily download that puts the start menue back and kills metro.

Metro sucks!!!

The version where you can re-enable the start menue was not windows 8, it was an upgrade to windows 8 from 7. This version is no longer available.

So if you didn't know how to mod the os you're stuck with sucky metro.

Korg.

I don't have a mobile (Cell) phone. I don't need one. I lived without one for years before they were invented and I don't have any desire to ever own one. My PC's are all I need now that I've consigned Windows to the Virtual Dustbin and written my own OS. My PC does what I want it to do, not what Microsoft wants or what anyone else wants. I don't have to worry about viruses or compatibility issues, costs or contracts. I have also retained the ability to use the English language correctly without a spellchecker and I can calculate without a calculator. I was taught to do these things at school, they were considered basic and necessary skills at the time. I suspect I gain a lot more pleasure from my PC than most users of technology. Learning to program on a machine with 3.5K (Yes kilobytes) of memory makes you appreciate a machine with half a Terabyte of available hard-drive space.

The last time I posted a similar message to this someone replied 'OMFG you cant play angrey birds.'

To me that speaks volumes, I know where I'd rather be.

OP just made the case for Linux without even mentioning it by name. Well done. Ubuntu is a bastardized version that was made to appeal to the masses. Also, using a desktop has little correlation to how much data you are downloading. People suck down just as much through a tablet or smartphone.

OP,
I dont know if you heard but Google just announced they will be open source on several factors of their OS. T-Mobil ditched all plans and is now month to month, and there is a handful of providers that offer no contract.

The future will be open Source and as far away from Microsoft-Anything as possible. Windows is a Dinosaur compared to Linux/Apple's OS/Android and I really hope for and see a day where Windows and its crappy 20 minute loading disaster of an OS is completely out the window in exchange for sleek/fast custom Operating Systems specifically tailored to the user.

Don't care for all the back end stuff. You'll have a simple OS. Like to do some back end stuff = Middle Level. For those who LOVE programming they will have fully open to manipulating all back end stuff. I wish Microsoft would die already. When Apple and Android came out with ease of use and super fast ....that's exactly what I've been waiting for

Originally posted by dominicus


The future will be open Source and as far away from Microsoft-Anything as possible. Windows is a Dinosaur compared to Linux/Apple's OS/Android and I really hope for and see a day where Windows and its crappy 20 minute loading disaster of an OS is completely out the window in exchange for sleek/fast custom Operating Systems specifically tailored to the user.

I take it you haven't seen windows 7 running on a ssd then.

Korg.

See thread for more information and this being covered earlier this year.....
This USB-Size Cloud Computer From Dell Is A Total Game Changer, page 1

Below is my post in said thread, appended here:

Originally posted by MarkJS

Originally posted by MarkJS
This is just history repeating itself. IBM in the 70s and 80s was doing this with 3270 dumb terminals connected to a super-computer. It's not the future. In actuality, it's a throwback to the past.

The device is cheap. So how are the manufacturers going to make a profit? Probably from the connection and CPU time used by the user. If you want to do something simple like write a Word Doc, you will need connectivity. The overall cost will balance itself out in the end... or it may be more expensive overall.

Say goodbye to user-data privacy. Whatever smidgen of privacy we have now.... bye bye.

There's a thought.... Consolidating power from the hands of many, into the hands of
a few. That's always been a winning formula in society.

So many sheeple. []Sarcasm off.[]

Well maybe the power will so consolidated that it goes ultimately to 'one man', the antichrist (one tricky fellow...not a nice man). It's not ideal, humanly speaking, but if it happens, it has been prophesized to be.

16 He causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads, 17 and that no one may buy or sell (and probably: and cannot use the internet... added by me) except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
Revelation 13:16-17 (New King James Version)

Originally posted by Korg Trinity
But...

Open systems will always be available to those that know and want to use them. I think I can safely say that there is very little you cannot get around in terms of tech restrictions.

There won't be an arch administrator of the flow of data across the net, and that is all you need to be able to do anything you like... Data...

Besides the dumbing down of the masses could also be considered the rise if the geeks!!

Korg,

So who speaks for those who don't have the privilege of knowing what you know?

The young who don't know what skills they are being denied?