Alien Life May Be Rare Across the Universe

At the minute all of this is just speculation but I find it funny that this was posted just as Curiosity discovers a key water indicator on Mars www.bbc.co.uk... and this www.abovetopsecret.com...

As time moves on, it's only going to increase the chances of finding something alive out there www.abovetopsecret.com... and also, if anyone wants a bit more info on how information is used in the search, I would recommend this www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by Druid42


Cyanide based life wouldn't necessarily be immediately deadly to us on contact.
The Cyanide would be tied up and bonded as part of the biological blueprint, likely stable and essentially harmless. If, however, we were to attempt to toss one on the barby to see if it tastes like chicken, it very well may taste like almond chicken, but that taste would likely be the diner's last.

There are, of course, other questions that arise from speculation on a variety of non-carbon based life.
We can attempt to extrapolate some from our experiences in attempting to communicate with dolphins for instance, or ants, or any other animal.
Any potential meeting with anything 'other' is going to present a whole range of possibilities in communication alone. We communicate by sound, and symbols representing sounds, as well as other methods.
What are the other possibilities and kinds of communications that might exist?
First contact could very well be with a species that communicates via pheromones, or touch, or rapidly changing complex patterns across their skin similar to squid.

Silicone based life is also mentioned.
Such could as a rarity have evolved naturally, but, we then also come to the possibility of artificial life.
As old as the Universe is, if there ever has been another technological space faring civilization, there then begs the question about self replicating/repairing artificial intelligences that have outlived their own creators.
There very well could be something like autobots and decepticons out there, or more likely something much more 'alien'.

On the cusp of technological singularity we are ourselves, we may even find the evolution of a species, such as ourselves, follows a predictable pattern of biological evolution followed then by the biological civilization opting for a more durable existence as machine augmented life, or even complete machine life, and then back to self guided, self engineered biology again.
If we can store ourselves as data where that data can be injected into a machine, and back to biology, swapping bodies could be like changing clothes. That's all speculation, however.
Point is, anyone we meet depending the age and sophistication of the civilization, could look like, or be anything.

A sufficiently sophisticated species of any origin could very well present themselves to look exactly like us, if only as a matter of first contact protocol.

I think we're going to be seeing a lot of back and forth news articles on life in the universe.

It seems right now we have two camps of people that know there is life out there. One wants to hurry up with the step-by-step disclosure, and the other wants to slow down and/or go backwards.

Basically, we have a disclosure war going on behind the scenes.

eh eh

90% of our DNA is junk

we come from the monkey

the universe is wasted space

ufo's are fantasy

use logic people

Originally posted by Druscilla
Thus, so what if there's alien life somewhere else. It doesn't matter how rarefied or saturated the greater Universe is with life until we can detect it.

I would go so far as to say that we human beings would have only a very marginal interest in any life we found that didn't look and think like us. Sure, there would always be some small core of academics who would be interested in studying some intelligent-in-some-odd-way slime creature on some other planet. But most people aren't even all that interested in different kinds of people on Earth, much less some slime ball or bug on a distant planet.

Unless they give us flying saucer rides, of course.

reply to post by ThorsMate

90% of our DNA is junk

Not any more ..
Junk DNA — Not So Useless After All
We just didn't know what it was for .

the universe is wasted space

You believe that ...Really ?

use logic people

I will if you do

Originally posted by ImpactoR

And what is the point that you psot it, to say that life may not be out there? Well DUH? We discovered America here? Of course, this is the other possibility, one should embrace along with the possibility of life existing..

So the purpose of posting this? None

Well I for one find the hypothesis that intelligent life, or even life full stop is unique to our planet just as intriguing as saying the universe is teeming with life. To say the OPs post has no point or purpose is incorrect.

The idea we could be alone in the vastness of the universe blows my mind, and is entirely possible.

Originally posted by doorhandle

Originally posted by ImpactoR

And what is the point that you psot it, to say that life may not be out there? Well DUH? We discovered America here? Of course, this is the other possibility, one should embrace along with the possibility of life existing..

So the purpose of posting this? None

Well I for one find the hypothesis that intelligent life, or even life full stop is unique to our planet just as intriguing as saying the universe is teeming with life. To say the OPs post has no point or purpose is incorrect.

The idea we could be alone in the vastness of the universe blows my mind, and is entirely possible.

Charles Cockell is a SETI member, what he has put out from that conference is a theory, his theory, but he is still looking for ET. The University of Edinburgh is a very old research institute and Charles Cockell is the key man in let's say Astrobiology. There is even a lab there for disseminating ET should he happen to fall out of the sky and Charles Cockell is solely in charge of that? He is also a collaborator with NASA.
This interview from 2006 is interesting and includes Panspermia BTW, (does that ring a very recent bell)

www.spaceref.com...

and so is this one from 2008,

www.newscientist.com...
Which includes systems to avoid accidental Panspermia to protect alien life??
So it is a busy week, from Chandra Wickramasinghe, Charles Cockell, and NASA with all the themes touching on ET. Funny that, but guess who is getting the most flack? Yup, it's Ol' Chandra, the most senior guy along with Hoyle who promotes Panspermia. Thoughts anyone.

reply to post by Druscilla


There you go again, setting a new parameter that only strengthens the OP: Sophistication.

Sure, we'd like to believe that there is microscopic life thriving in thermal vents in alien oceans as much as they've been detected in our own, bereft of sunlight, yet alive. In that order, microscopic life should be present everywhere, and I wonder if they'll find proof on Mars. Surely meteorites have shown us this recently.

But let's remember extinction events, natural calamities that upset the balance of life. In far away star systems, do the same factors still apply, albeit light years away? Surely.

There's a reason why there are no advanced life forms visiting us. The sophistication required to evolve from a thermal vent to interstellar travel is a huge biological leap, and as previously stated, geological time is not on their side. Take millions of years, as evidenced on our own planet, and lifeforms trying to develop have been besieged by a rather regular series of extinction events. The same would appear to hold true everywhere, due to the lack of evidence of intelligent life, and also due to the rather random interactions of a multiverse full of death dealing asteroid impacts. I won't go into gamma ray bursters from pulsars, but the plausibility factor of life evolving is rather slim when you consider the totality of potential hazards.

There's not enough time for life to become sophisticated enough to become intelligent. The short span we've been "intelligent", like said, is but a drop in the bucket.

To overlap two cultures, almost impossible.

reply to post by Druid42


I don't disagree with that statement.

Based on the evidence, or lack of it, as well as what we currently think we know about the Universe, getting from slime to sublime shouldn't be expected easy, or common.

Our own survivability has been dependent on several factors, one not least of which is the physical shield we have in this gigantic moon we have, not to mention the benefits that come from the tidal forces brought about by its presence.

Jupiter, two doors down, serves also as a wonderful gatekeeper in sponging up stray bits of rock and ice nosing their ways inward on the ecliptic, as well as the other gas giants.

We've a fairly tame star, a relatively strong magnetic field (for a smallish rocky body) enough so to force-field most of any nasty stuff our star spits out, but not too much so as to prevent mutations that over time could lead to adaptation and evolution.

Our distance from our star, plus the degree of tilt, as well as the 24 hour rotation, and variability in solar distance in elliptical orbit also gives us a wonderful variety of conditions to elicit adaptability.

Geothermal activity withing our little rock gives us further variety.

All the conditions coming together are rather elegant, and it's likely not too common that similar conditions pervade. This isn't to say that life can't pop up under differing conditions.

Still, in the end, as I've always maintained, we don't know, and it's more than okay to say we don't know because, really, we don't, and we won't until confirming observations are made to such effect.

If people are refusing to believe mars nasa images like this:

mars.jpl.nasa.gov...

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This:

mars.jpl.nasa.gov...
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mars.jpl.nasa.gov...

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They either are in association with Nasa Jpl, malin to debunk or just plain stupid! Or a fundamentalist and call every thing demons.

mars.jpl.nasa.gov...




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It will be tough even if it hit em over the had with a bowling ball

Here's the thing - the X-philes are not interested in non-human intelligent life, alien life, or even intelligent alien life. They are holding out for intellectually and technologically superior humanoid alien life with intergalactic/inter-dimensional travel capabilities.

Difficult for a Europan microbe to compete with Klaatu.

Originally posted by thetiler
If people are refusing to believe mars nasa images like this:

I have no problem believing images like that.

Originally posted by thetiler
They either are in association with Nasa Jpl, malin to debunk or just plain stupid! Or a fundamentalist and call every thing demons.

Those are the only options - NASA employee, fundamentalist, or stupid?

Originally posted by thetiler
It will be tough even if it hit em over the had with a bowling ball

Do you see a bowling ball in those images?

reply to post by Spider879


Apparently the professor didn't do so hot in statistics....

If he had, he'd note that the numbers do not lie, and by sheer probability, the Universe is likely teeming with life...that doesn't mean it's teeming with intelligent life, but that isn't what he said.

I'll bet we find conclusive evidence of past life (microbial) on Mars within the year, and confirm Earthlike conditions on an extrasolar system's planet within 5 years.

reply to post by Gazrok


There you go, confirming that life must evolve under "earth-like" conditions.

So you get your confirmation of microbial life on Mars. That's two planets in the same solar system with evidence of life. While you get the card that says "Teeming with Life", I play my card that says "Rare Conditions". The parameters are so narrow, the balance of life so delicate on this planet, (I'll draw my "Extinction Events" card) that life is eradicated rather quickly in the geological reference. Millions of years? That's the field we play with to understand our existence in the here and now.

reply to post by Druid42


... and there you go ... mitigating, whittling, and limiting, when, in all actuality, we don't know.

The only thing we DO know is that life does indeed exist on this planet, and by extension could thus also exist in any similar conditions found on or in any other exo-planetary body.

All in all, however, it's still an unanswered question.
Just like aliens, confirming evidence of life exists in a superstate position where it both does and does not exist until observation collapses the superposition to a single solid state.

Until we know, we don't.

Originally posted by Gazrok
reply to post by Spider879

 

Apparently the professor didn't do so hot in statistics....

If he had, he'd note that the numbers do not lie, and by sheer probability, the Universe is likely teeming with life...that doesn't mean it's teeming with intelligent life, but that isn't what he said.

I'll bet we find conclusive evidence of past life (microbial) on Mars within the year, and confirm Earthlike conditions on an extrasolar system's planet within 5 years.

Yes we may find life or evidence of it at anytime on Mars or else where,Seth Shostak said pretty much the same thing that much of what's out there maybe in his words

Stupid life

But what if Druid42 is also correct that extinction maybe the norm,wouldn't that help keep life at a minimum.

The reptillians and insectoids killed everyone off!

And they are here on planet earth. Did you know about the UN?

reply to post by Druid42

There you go, confirming that life must evolve under "earth-like" conditions.

Right, so the statistics, even using Earth-like conditions, point to teeming with life...with the amount of planets and stars out there. So, if you expand the parameters....well, there you go, even more teeming.

Also, the Earth-like parameters aren't that narrow. We've found life in many places we didn't think it could exist...and these same conditions could exist elsewhere, even in our own solar system.

reply to post by Spider879


We have studied 1 solar system. That system has life in it. That is a 100% success rate.
Score:
Alien Life Forms 100
Loser Scientist 0