Voting for Obama is voting for a forth Bush term.

Been seeing a lot of posts and comparisons that Rommey is Bush but none of you know that and look over the fact that Obama has done similar things as Bush did! For starters, Obama will win the electoral vote and not the popular vote just like Bush. That isn't the only thing similar. Both Obama and Bush had a failed stimulus package.

Bush stimulus

Look at all the other similarities!

1. Iraq - We should have known in 2008 that we wouldn't see any real change from the Obama Administration. Despite campaigning for the U.S. Senate in 2004 on a platform of voting against Bush's war budgets, when he became a Senator, Obama voted for every single one of Bush's requests to continue funding war in the Middle East. Apparently, his streak of broken promises started long before campaigning for the White House (and we'll get to those later down the list).

2. First Surge in Afghanistan - Think Iraq was bad? It gets better! Mr. (Blind) Hope and (Regime) Change kicked off his presidency with a 17,000 troop surge to Afghanistan in February of 2009. 17,000! Don't defend him. Don't say it was necessary to help win the war there. You would not have defended Bush and you know it. Mr. Obama started his presidency by radically escalating Bush's war.

3. Second Surge in Afghanistan - But wait- there's more! By December of 2009, less than a year into his presidency, Obama decided to outdo even himself and send another whopping 30,000 troops to Afghanistan! By this point, Al-Qaeda was scattered and devastated. Our troops were overseas fighting someone else's civil war, not defending our freedoms or our safety.

4. Phony Afghan Withdrawal - In June of 2011, Obama announced a "troop withdrawal" from Afghanistan, and true to form, it was as phony as his Iraq withdrawal. Even if he stays on schedule and makes the most "radical" withdrawal on the table by the end of 2012-- 30,000 troops-- there would still be more than twice as many troops as there were in January 2009 when Obama took office. Only in the Orwellian world of U.S. foreign policy could something like that be called a withdrawal.

5. The Rise of Drone Warfare - The Obama Administration's continued and extensive use of weaponized aerial drones to bomb enemy targets in countries throughout the Middle East (sometimes resulting in the deaths of dozens of civilians at a time when the drone operators or intelligence make a mistake) has touched off a drone arms race with the rest of the world, most notably China. Great. Just great.

Obama is Bush 2.0

There is 100 ways to compare Bush to Obama in this article. I encourage all of you to read them.

While some of these can be very vague...How is it that Rommey, never being president before, is Bush when Obama already has fit that bill?

I can tell you that the first 4 are absolutely true. My job in the Air Force is moving and receiving cargo from all over the war. We have just barely received the stuff from Iraq and barely anything from Afghan. Then on top of that we have been getting numerous rumors that we are deploying to Libya and still deploying to Afghan.

Very few of you can see the truth before your eyes, that these presidents are put here by the government not the people. To test this theory, why don't we all vote Independent and see if the "We" vote actually matters.

reply to post by johngrissom


Dera johngrissom,

Are you saying that Romney is pledging to get us our of Iraq and Afghanistan? When did he promise such things? I wish to read and listen to it. What else is he promising? Bush got us in the wars, Obama has continued them and Romney has promised to end them? Did he promise success or just to end the wars? There is a difference and then again, there is just more of the same. What does the face matter? Romney pledges to help the wealthy and has public stated that he doesn't care about the rest of us. Show me where he said he would leave Afghanistan and Iraq and not go to war with Iran. Show me where he said torture was wrong and should be stopped immediately. I will waith.

Obama/Romney - Whatever - Two sides to the same coin.

Maybe if Gary Johnson poses topless during his airing time he might get more MSM coverage - it'd be a better sight than them pair anyway!

Obama supporters can't tell the difference between Obama and Bush 43. After the 2008 elections, I told friends of mine that supported Obama..."Who better than Obama to sell foreign policy to the American People?"

4 years later...I was right!

Originally posted by AQuestion
reply to post by johngrissom

 

Dera johngrissom,

Are you saying that Romney is pledging to get us our of Iraq and Afghanistan? When did he promise such things? I wish to read and listen to it. What else is he promising? Bush got us in the wars, Obama has continued them and Romney has promised to end them? Did he promise success or just to end the wars? There is a difference and then again, there is just more of the same. What does the face matter? Romney pledges to help the wealthy and has public stated that he doesn't care about the rest of us. Show me where he said he would leave Afghanistan and Iraq and not go to war with Iran. Show me where he said torture was wrong and should be stopped immediately. I will waith.

You clearly are missing the point and assume I support Rommey. This thread is merely an attempt to wake up the many many many people voting purely based on parties. Rommey hasn't been in Office yet...So comparing him to Bush is not logical because of the many lies spewing out of both their mouths. In turn no one can compare him to Bush until he has had his 4 year go at it. You and like many of you are just bashing a party because it is the opposite. Then not looking at the facts I have stated in the OP.

reply to post by muse7


Okay and? All this is saying, Rommey will have the same view points and solutions as Obama because Obama had the same as Bush. Are you seeing the trend here? Maybe there is a hidden agenda, I don't know but wake up! This isn't a thread where Rommey is better than Obama or Obama is better than Rommey. This is a thread to stop the one sided behavior that is very shown in this election. Whether or not it is Obama or Rommey, the problems will still be there because neither side can fix them. The politicians continue to do what "We" do...the constant bash of either side. If we want our children to have a future then "We" must work together. Both sides have to see the benefit(s) of either solution and combined them. Unfortunately, this will never change. The elections have turned into a dog and pony show of who can make the other one look like a bigger piece of crap. Instead of telling the truth and focusing on the task at hand. Fixing this damn planet.

Why is it so hard to work together?

Originally posted by muse7

Yup.... I love Obama's break from the past too, don't you? He really had a problem with George Bush's defense and war policy. Yes Indeed. He had such a problem with it, he kept George Bush's Secretary of Defense a full 2 years beyond taking office himself.

Secretary of Defense: Robert Gates

22nd United States Secretary of Defense In office

December 18, 2006 – July 1, 2011

President
George W. Bush
Barack Obama

Deputy Gordon England
William Lynn

Preceded by
Donald Rumsfeld

Succeeded by
Leon Panetta

(Source)

He didn't end the war in Iraq. He allowed it to end, right on time, as set by George Bush. He could have ended it earlier. The man is the President and it's well within his ability. He chose to let it run to Bush's timeline. We could be out of Afghanistan too, but no, we have until at least 2014 under Obama and perhaps more. That more part is on again off again last heard from the State Dept a couple days AFTER Biden insisted we'd absolutely never stay....talking about staying longer. It'd be funny if people weren't being killed and my own family has a couple vets from that hell hole. Ending the war sometime in his FIRST FOUR YEARS would have been nice. Now I flat out don't trust or believe him.

and...nothing anyone else, anywhere else does takes away from the above facts. He pretty well carried the worst of Bush's foreign policy and added some bad of his own to the blend. Bahhh..

Originally posted by johngrissom
reply to post by muse7

 

Okay and? All this is saying, Rommey will have the same view points and solutions as Obama because Obama had the same as Bush. Are you seeing the trend here? Maybe there is a hidden agenda, I don't know but wake up! This isn't a thread where Rommey is better than Obama or Obama is better than Rommey. This is a thread to stop the one sided behavior that is very shown in this election. Whether or not it is Obama or Rommey, the problems will still be there because neither side can fix them. The politicians continue to do what "We" do...the constant bash of either side. If we want our children to have a future then "We" must work together. Both sides have to see the benefit(s) of either solution and combined them.

Why is it so hard to work together?

The 17 neocons mentioned will be Romneys source of expertise.

We already know their opinion and what they want, Iran.

If Obama wanted Iran we would have done it already.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

reply to post by campanionator


I'm glad some of you mentioned the war. Is it at all possible that we cannot pull out of the middle east because of our economy? Unemployment is already bad enough as it is with the thought of no war...where do all the soldiers go? Front-line infantry? Tank operators? Pilots? Civilians?
Not to mention the amount of money funding the war through civilian contracts and foreign contracts. You think the United States military is the only funding this war? We see many foreign cargo and foreign aircraft's being loaded through our warehouse.

1,458,697 currently served in this year. Without a war, nearly a quarter of those members would not be able to enlist or sign another contract. Then on top of that nearly half of the 688,628 civilians employed would be out of a job. Which has already happened. Personally, I dont think the United States will ever see a peace time again, until the economy problems are fixed.

So, should war even be in the topic of the future or continuation of the presidency. Or should the government and president focus merely on keeping a float/fixing the problems?

Originally posted by johngrissom
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

reply to post by campanionator

 

I'm glad some of you mentioned the war. Is it at all possible that we cannot pull out of the middle east because of our economy? Unemployment is already bad enough as it is with the thought of no war...where do all the soldiers go? Front-line infantry? Tank operators? Pilots? Civilians?

1,458,697 currently served in this year. Without a war, nearly a quarter of those members would not be able to enlist or sign another contract. Then on top of that nearly half of the 688,628 civilians employed would be out of a job. Which has already happened. Personally, I dont think the United States will ever see a peace time again, until the economy problems are fixed.

And Mitt Romney will make sure of it, enjoy your Bush III

Originally posted by campanionator

Originally posted by johngrissom
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

reply to post by campanionator

 

I'm glad some of you mentioned the war. Is it at all possible that we cannot pull out of the middle east because of our economy? Unemployment is already bad enough as it is with the thought of no war...where do all the soldiers go? Front-line infantry? Tank operators? Pilots? Civilians?

1,458,697 currently served in this year. Without a war, nearly a quarter of those members would not be able to enlist or sign another contract. Then on top of that nearly half of the 688,628 civilians employed would be out of a job. Which has already happened. Personally, I dont think the United States will ever see a peace time again, until the economy problems are fixed.

And Mitt Romney will make sure of it, enjoy your Bush III

You didn't answer nor ponder the question of war and our economy. What side do you support?

Also again, why does anyone think I support Rommey? Did you even read the OP?

reply to post by johngrissom

I really appreciate how you look deeper in terms of cause and long term meaning. The election will come here shortly....and one of two men will win. Whichever one that is, the wars will still have the question you raise that needs answered. That won't change...and it's a big one. Frankly, it's really one I hadn't given much thought for awhile either.

Now that you mention it the way you have though, it really opens a can or worms just enough to know there is more to deal with.

What comes to mind for me is growing up in 1980's Southern California when a very large % of the entire area's economy was based in aerospace and related support business. Almost all of it in support of Defense and things like the Stealth aircraft as well as Star Wars. Nothing possible without Russia for a willing enemy and they simply went broke before we did....or so we thought. I don't know as we stand today.

Vietnam broke the malaise of the years leading to it and kicked defense in the butt for everything to follow.. Enormous money....and many still believe Kennedy went down for it to happen.

You know, I guess the most compelling thing would have to be........when a U.S. President says it himself.



I don't know the extent to which this has all become about contractor dollars and the political corruption that breeds in everyone in office it seems, but the answer is one I've pondered myself. It's one we, as citizens, HAVE to demand answers to. Either way to the Election outcome. Either way, IMO.

reply to post by johngrissom


Dear johngrissom.

You and like many of you are just bashing a party because it is the opposite. Then not looking at the facts I have stated in the OP.

You clearly misunderstand me, I have no use for either party and believe they have both sold us down the river. Obama followed the same policies as Bush and Romney would do the same. Both Obama and Romney have raised hundreds of millions to run for a job that pays considerably less, the question for both of them is what did they have to promise to get the money and what do they get in return.

reply to post by johngrissom


And voting for Romney is voting for the 4th Bush term as well!

See what I did there?

reply to post by johngrissom


How many sovereign states has Obama invaded and occupied?
How many terrorist attacks has Obama allowed/instigated on US soil?
How many banker buddies has Obama given hundreds of billions of dollars too?
How many tax breaks has Obama given to the elite rich?

Now tell me,

What will Romney do in regards to Afghanistan?
What will Romney do in regards to the bankers?
What will Romney do in regards to his banker/elite buddies?
What will Romney do in regards to the debt and the outsourcing to china?

Don't get me wrong, I don't think either of them are genuine above board people, add to the mix neither of them ACTUALLY make the decisions, they are puppets.

But c'mon, Romney? After everything Bush and Cheney did FOR the elite republicans you want a republican BACK in the white house?.. I suppose after 8 more yrs of Republican Ruins you'll blame the poor democrat in 2020 who defeats the 2nd term republican for everything that happens between 2012 and 2020, right?

No wonder America is in trouble, its citizens cannot even acknowledge where the problems ACTUALLY come from.

I don't like Romney OR Obama but we can't spend another 1.5 trillion a year for another four years.
We won't recover from another four.
Romney is a left wing screaming Liberal by Texas terms but he's still the lesser of two evils in my opinion.

In principle I agree. Unfortunately, given that Romney's foreign policy and defense advisers consist of a litany of George W. Bush administration advisers, former PNAC members, people associated with Blackwater, the co-author of the PATRIOT Act, and the head of the NSA during the warrantless wiretapping fiasco, I perceive a Romney administration as a fourth Bush term as well.

Hence my not voting for either of them. Peace.