Someone explain the French: offend Moslems, no problem. Offend Jews, get arrested?

While there are some who dont believe in freedom of speech (predominantly the politically correct crowd), I'm not one of them.

I think its unfortunate when blatantly hateful or racist people hide behind the "free speech" banner but thats part of being free.

What I dont agree with is what would appear to be an outright double standard. Take the John Galliano case for example.

This man was arrested for allegedly insulting two Jews (though witness accounts vary). Not only was he arrested, but some media outlets actually referred to this incident as an "assault"...

The issue with arbitrary enforcement is who decides "whats offensive"? Is it enough for one person to say "I'm offended"?

In the case of the Muhammed cartoon, the magazine would probably argue that it was a joke and that they are protected by freedom of speech laws (assuming France has any). Well couldnt John Galliano make that same argument? That he was joking, that its his right as a free person to be offensive? Why wouldnt they arrest the owner/editor of the magazine? Surely, there are Moslems out there who were offended...

My only point is that the State should be consistent. Dont protect the feelings or sensibilities of one group while condoning offensive behavior towards another.

While I dont approve of their actions, neither John nor the magazine should face any legal problems if in-fact France was consistent.

But they're obviously not.

I think the beak speaks volumes. Think about their probable ancestry.

reply to post by rtyfx


The "beak"?

You obviously got a problem spotting the difference between a satyrical paper (it's their job) and an open discussion in a public bar from a drunken waste of skin.

reply to post by gladtobehere

Most French have a rather distinctive nose.

reply to post by Chrysalis

So its ok to be offensive so long as someone is "joking".

How do we know that the magazine editors dont harbor hate for Moslems? We dont.

Does John hate Jews? I would argue that he probably doesnt but again, whos to say?

Which leads me back to my original point.

Allow all speech, even if its offensive, or dont allow any. Be consistent.

reply to post by gladtobehere


So please, have a look at this :



Their offices have been burned down on the 2nd november 2011.
Do they hold a grudge ? maybe, maybe not.

What is known is that this paper treats all religions / politicians .. equally.
The boss is still under police protection almost 1 year after the facts.

On a side note, theonion.com published recently a pic you should check. Just notice how this one didnt make the rounds in the news.

The Muslims haven't been playing we are the victims card like the Jews have. Also the Jews have a habit of buying politicians so they can make what they want illegal.

I'd rather be arrested than beaten to death by a pissed off angry crowd of muslim raging over a cartoon of Muhammad.

Just sayin.

Originally posted by buster2010
The Muslims haven't been playing we are the victims card like the Jews have. Also the Jews have a habit of buying politicians so they can make what they want illegal.

edit on 19-9-2012 by buster2010 because: (no reason given)

Now its clear who is the honest to goodness and who is the trick or treat.

What ever, we have a hard time changing the perception of people, their face stuck too much into whats media is feeding, its their lost in the long run.

You might get arrested for insulting Jews.
With muslims, it is a bit different. You may get blown up, sodomized, killed, dragged through the streets, your family may get attacked or you may be tried in absentia and be given a death sentence from another country.
I guess it all evens out in the end.

I think the difference is painfully simple. Literally so, in this case.

Muslims, at least the extreme that everyplace seems to have some of, kill people and break things when life doesn't go there way and someone brings Mr. Frown into their lives for even a passing time.

Jews get mad, huff puff and do all kinda of nasty money or legal things when pissed.


So....in a world of choices, the choice is this. Do they arrest people for pissing off the group who just yells right back and maybe files a lawsuit? Or do they arrest people for pissing off the group that measures it's rage in body counts as often as not?

AS much as I find little to no respect for the French on general principle, I can't help but think they made about the only choice available under the circumstances. It's getting to be fight or flight time...and I'd prefer the French take a flyer right from day 1 then play like they can be depended on and then disappoint in ways that get many people killed.... Just my thought.

The problem with deep seated beliefs is that sooner or later someone with different beliefs is going to come along and bash your beliefs and you'll be duty bound to respond. Think of what all could be accomplished while believers are fighting over what cannot be proven to exist.

Remember all those terrorist's attacks in France in the 80's?.... That's the answer to the question you pose in your title. Did you really think it was Muslim terrorist's doing all that stuff back in the day.... Did you?

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


Sort of the Muslims will just out right kill you. And the Jews just make you wish you were dead.

reply to post by openyourmind1262

Not sure what youre asking/implying here.

Are you saying it was false flag terrorism?

We can offend the muslims but not the jews, you see the muslims dont own all the big companies and coperations and banks and media outlets, and the muslims are somewhat powerless since we control their countries and armies through puppets, so we can always offend them at the end of a long stressful day.

if we do that to the jews then there will be big punishment with funding and assassinations and all this dangerous stuff I mean look at JFK for christs sake

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

Well I would say do neither, dont arrest anyone for exercising their freedom of speech rights, even if its offensive.

But there would seem to be a double standard.

I was given some advice 40 years ago as a new officer; "Nothing is ever as bad, or as good, as first reported."

From The New York Times:

Christian Dior said this afternoon that it had suspended the designer John Galliano pending an investigation into anti-Semitic remarks he allegedly made on Thursday night in Paris.

According to French news agencies, quoting police sources, Mr. Galliano made the comment to a man and his female companion during an argument at a cafe in the Marais. Mr. Galliano lives in the area. The reports said that Mr. Galliano had been drinking alcohol, and that he was briefly detained by the police.

But there are mixed accounts of what may have happened on Thursday night. According to the site sleek-mag.com, which quotes an anonymous witness, Mr. Galliano was sitting at the terrace cafe La Perle around 10 p.m., having a drink, when he tried to chat with the couple, who were seated nearby. The man, perhaps not recognizing the famous designer, rebuffed him and said, “You’re ugly, you’re disgusting, move away from here.” The witness said that Mr. Galliano replied, to the woman, “You’re ugly, and your bag is ugly, too.”

The conversation, such as it was, quickly escalated, the Web site said, as more insults were exchanged, and the police were called. The witness said Mr. Galliano referred to the man as Asian.

So, he gets a little drunk, gets in an argument, the police are called to break it up, and his boss says we don't tolerate bigotry, if the police find any, he's out of here.
runway.blogs.nytimes.com...

It doesn't look like government double standards from here, just a minor celebrity getting rowdy over his drinks. Cheers!

Originally posted by charles1952

From The New York Times:

The reports said that Mr. Galliano had been drinking alcohol, and that he was briefly detained by the police.

If the OP is looking for evidence of double standards, here's a big one.
In France, if the police is called on you for public drunkeness and disorderly conduct, you are put in a cell for the rest of the night till you sober up.

Galliano got out of this situation EASY.