When you become a God, will you use evil the way God does?

reply to post by Greatest I am


Lol, no. The vote was 300+ for to 2 against (Arius and his traveling companion) and 2 abstainers. And they didn't vote on the Trinity, the Arian heresy dealt with the nature of Christ.

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Gnostics recognize that they have created him and that Jesus is just an archetypal good man

Once again, you're confusing Gnostics with some other philosophy, though since you don't seem to want show your sources, I have no idea who it is. The Gnostics, most assuredly, did not think that they'd invented Jesus, and he absolutely was not "an archetypal good man" in their view.

Some of the gnostic stuff i read, they denied he was ever human at all. They denied his human self as the man Jesus, to them he was pure Spirit.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Gnostics recognize that they have created him and that Jesus is just an archetypal good man

Once again, you're confusing Gnostics with some other philosophy, though since you don't seem to want show your sources, I have no idea who it is. The Gnostics, most assuredly, did not think that they'd invented Jesus, and he absolutely was not "an archetypal good man" in their view.

Some of the gnostic stuff i read, they denied he was ever human at all. They denied his human self as the man Jesus, to them he was pure Spirit.

edit on 6-9-2012 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)

Yes, in their worldview anything material was evil and anything spirit was good.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Gnostics recognize that they have created him and that Jesus is just an archetypal good man

Once again, you're confusing Gnostics with some other philosophy, though since you don't seem to want show your sources, I have no idea who it is. The Gnostics, most assuredly, did not think that they'd invented Jesus, and he absolutely was not "an archetypal good man" in their view.

Some of the gnostic stuff i read, they denied he was ever human at all. They denied his human self as the man Jesus, to them he was pure Spirit.

Yes, in their worldview anything material was evil and anything spirit was good.

Except for the demiurge. They didn't seem to like that guy all that much, lol.

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Gnostics recognize that they have created him and that Jesus is just an archetypal good man

Once again, you're confusing Gnostics with some other philosophy, though since you don't seem to want show your sources, I have no idea who it is. The Gnostics, most assuredly, did not think that they'd invented Jesus, and he absolutely was not "an archetypal good man" in their view.

They did not read their scriptures literally. Accept that or not. I don't care.

Regards
DL

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Gnostics recognize that they have created him and that Jesus is just an archetypal good man

Once again, you're confusing Gnostics with some other philosophy, though since you don't seem to want show your sources, I have no idea who it is. The Gnostics, most assuredly, did not think that they'd invented Jesus, and he absolutely was not "an archetypal good man" in their view.

Some of the gnostic stuff i read, they denied he was ever human at all. They denied his human self as the man Jesus, to them he was pure Spirit.

edit on 6-9-2012 by lonewolf19792000 because: (no reason given)

Yes, in their worldview anything material was evil and anything spirit was good.

Why then did they think that God was within them?
Did they think God would stay in an evil place?

Just a bit of thought is all it takes.

Regards
DL

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Why then did they think that God was within them?
Did they think God would stay in an evil place?

They didn't view God in the same way that Westerners do, but it was, indeed a spark of the divine in them that wanted to leave this evil place that drove them to find the Gnosis.

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Gnostics recognize that they have created him and that Jesus is just an archetypal good man

Once again, you're confusing Gnostics with some other philosophy, though since you don't seem to want show your sources, I have no idea who it is. The Gnostics, most assuredly, did not think that they'd invented Jesus, and he absolutely was not "an archetypal good man" in their view.

Some of the gnostic stuff i read, they denied he was ever human at all. They denied his human self as the man Jesus, to them he was pure Spirit.

Yes, in their worldview anything material was evil and anything spirit was good.

Except for the demiurge. They didn't seem to like that guy all that much, lol.

That's true, but didn't they think he created everything material/evil?

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Gnostics recognize that they have created him and that Jesus is just an archetypal good man

Once again, you're confusing Gnostics with some other philosophy, though since you don't seem to want show your sources, I have no idea who it is. The Gnostics, most assuredly, did not think that they'd invented Jesus, and he absolutely was not "an archetypal good man" in their view.

Some of the gnostic stuff i read, they denied he was ever human at all. They denied his human self as the man Jesus, to them he was pure Spirit.

Yes, in their worldview anything material was evil and anything spirit was good.

Except for the demiurge. They didn't seem to like that guy all that much, lol.

That's true, but didn't they think he created everything material/evil?

Yep, he was the bumbling creator all... (sweeps hand around) ... this.

He received a bit more fame as the God of Israel, of course. Valentinus was essentially another Marcion, with a flair for the theatrical

reply to post by adjensen


Ahhh Marcion, I wonder who sits in the lowest part of Hell, Hitler, Marcion, or Westcott and Hort?

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by adjensen

 

Ahhh Marcion, I wonder who sits in the lowest part of Hell, Hitler, Marcion, or Westcott and Hort?

Theyre all down there playing cards in the dark, Valentinus is down there with them. He didn't think he needed to be saved (i forget what those are called). In fact, i think that "Enlightened" fellow stole his cliff notes.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by adjensen

 

Ahhh Marcion, I wonder who sits in the lowest part of Hell, Hitler, Marcion, or Westcott and Hort?

Theyre all down there playing cards in the dark, Valentinus is down there with them. He didn't think he needed to be saved (i forget what those are called). In fact, i think that "Enlightened" fellow stole his cliff notes.

Valentinus was the L. Ron Hubbard of his time, I think. When he didn't get the nod to be Bishop of Rome, he took off with Marcion's notes, elaborated on the already existent Gnostic mythos to make Christ the Bringer of Gnosis and presented it as the "proper Christianity", even though he'd just come up with it.

Seriously, the similarities between Scientology and Christian Gnosticism (in deviation from established religion in their time) is quite striking. Though Hubbard would have to have REALLY been on the ball to have read the Gospel of Truth at the time he came up with Dianetics, so probably not.

reply to post by adjensen


Basically Valentinus threw a tantrum when he lost the bid for Bishop and decided to wreck christianity or at least try to. God's grace we had Tertullian, Justin Martyr and Ireneaus. Tertullian's Prescription Against Heresies worked well. Figures this junk would rear it's head again before the end. Gnosis is it's own type of Beast, the "secret knowledge" of lies.

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Why then did they think that God was within them?
Did they think God would stay in an evil place?

They didn't view God in the same way that Westerners do, but it was, indeed a spark of the divine in them that wanted to leave this evil place that drove them to find the Gnosis.

It is that spark of the divine that tells us that this is not an evil place.
Remember that it is a Christian view that God cursed the earth because of A & E and Eden, not a Gnostic Christian one.

Do you think the earth a good place or an evil one?
Do you see more good than evil here the way I do?

Regards
DL

Originally posted by Greatest I am
It is that spark of the divine that tells us that this is not an evil place.
Remember that it is a Christian view that God cursed the earth because of A & E and Eden, not a Gnostic Christian one.

Once again, you are putting a "Gnostic" sticker on beliefs that are diametrically opposed to Gnosticism, which taught, in no uncertain terms, that the material world was an evil place. What's the point of misrepresenting your own beliefs?

Do you think the earth a good place or an evil one?

Neither -- it's just a place.

reply to post by Greatest I am


If I were god I wouldn't give my creations the desires such as we have, and then tell them they can't act on those desires.

We know that life is hard enough for healthy individuals, so I would ensure that every child is born without deformities.

I wouldn't make some people ugly as sin.

I wouldn't kill any of them.

I wouldn't side with one group over another.

I wouldn't force them, or even just let them worship me.

Originally posted by jiggerj
reply to post by Greatest I am

 

If I were god I wouldn't give my creations the desires such as we have, and then tell them they can't act on those desires.

We know that life is hard enough for healthy individuals, so I would ensure that every child is born without deformities.

I wouldn't make some people ugly as sin.

I wouldn't kill any of them.

I wouldn't side with one group over another.

I wouldn't force them, or even just let them worship me.

So you would create robots who had no choice to rebel or no choice to reject to love you as God? How would you enjoy eternal life with billions of "robots"? Even we as humans are trying to create computers that learn and think for themselves independent of human input and programming.

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by Greatest I am
It is that spark of the divine that tells us that this is not an evil place.
Remember that it is a Christian view that God cursed the earth because of A & E and Eden, not a Gnostic Christian one.

Once again, you are putting a "Gnostic" sticker on beliefs that are diametrically opposed to Gnosticism, which taught, in no uncertain terms, that the material world was an evil place. What's the point of misrepresenting your own beliefs?

Do you think the earth a good place or an evil one?

Neither -- it's just a place.

When this was written, most thought it to just be a cynical view of life but I think it is quite true and irrefutable, based on the anthropic principle.
What do you think?

Candide.

"It is demonstrable that things cannot be otherwise than as they are; for as all things have been created for some end, they must necessarily be created for the best end.”

www.youtube.com...

This is done by nature and not a God but would be a requirement of a God if he were real.

Regards
DL

Originally posted by jiggerj
reply to post by Greatest I am

 

If I were god I wouldn't give my creations the desires such as we have, and then tell them they can't act on those desires.

We know that life is hard enough for healthy individuals, so I would ensure that every child is born without deformities.

I wouldn't make some people ugly as sin.

I wouldn't kill any of them.

I wouldn't side with one group over another.

I wouldn't force them, or even just let them worship me.

Seems like a better philosophy and theology than the Christian God with all the demands, needs and conditions that we are supposed to dance to. A lot of hands on though.

My own preference is a self-sustaining system where I can just take off to some new project.
Much like evolution works now actually.

Regards
DL

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by jiggerj
reply to post by Greatest I am

 

If I were god I wouldn't give my creations the desires such as we have, and then tell them they can't act on those desires.

We know that life is hard enough for healthy individuals, so I would ensure that every child is born without deformities.

I wouldn't make some people ugly as sin.

I wouldn't kill any of them.

I wouldn't side with one group over another.

I wouldn't force them, or even just let them worship me.

So you would create robots who had no choice to rebel or no choice to reject to love you as God? How would you enjoy eternal life with billions of "robots"? Even we as humans are trying to create computers that learn and think for themselves independent of human input and programming.

What is better?
To be a robot or a slave who smiles at his owner all the time because he fears hell?

Regards
DL