why I hate evolution..

Originally posted by ChaoticOrder
reply to post by Tbrooks76

 

The first two "super natural events" have not much to do with evolution, but the creation and source of the Universe as we know it. For more information regarding such events I suggest you take a look at this thread I made a few weeks ago: Before The Big Bang

3rd supernatural event, life created itself.

Yes, the very first self-replicating organisms must have been created via some extremely rare occurrence... however, you must understand a highly unlikely event is neither impossible nor super natural.

They don’t like the alternative (God) so they use denial to continue to believe in the evolution.

That's rich coming from a person who creates a thread titled "why I hate evolution". Hypocrite much?

edit on 18/6/2012 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)

I like physics, I can tell you allot about it and I read up on the big bang, there are bunch of ideas about what could have happen, but they require some miracle type event that cannot be proven.

An this second point is my point, life creating itself is untested hypothesis yet the complete based of their theory.

3rd that might have sounded hypocritical....sorry was not trying to be a hypocrite

As far as I can surmise, we live in a purely chaotic/neutral universe/multi verse. I do not believe that it is a scientific or philosophical folly to believe in a God or some type of higher force, but I do believe that creationism as it is typically defined, is childish and naive.

Not so much as a personal judgement or preference, but because it simply doesn't jive with what I CAN study, and what I CAN observe. I can observe, by default, that dead things do not rise again. I can observe (should I choose to truly do the research work) that we know the world is older than what many creationists suggest. I can observe "chance" all around me at all times. People being killed in car accidents, babies being born, rain falling from the sky etc... All of these things make the concept of miracles, curses, and destiny equally childish and naive for me.

I find that many believers of any type of unusual phenomena like to resort to the typical "Why do you reject things simply because you can't see them" argument. I don't think many people would mind if a god came down today, right now and made everything ok, even if only by letting us all know he or she was there.

People don't reject it because they are afraid of a god, they reject it because they refuse to allow their minds, perceptions and philosophies to be shaped by things they can not attain even reasonable evidence for. Science is literally what has made it possible for us to survive, even a cave man used science without even realizing it when he figured out his primitive understanding of friction to make a fire.

On a personal note, and this is in no way meant to be a rude dig against Christians, Muslims or even Sumarians for that matter but if the God written about in your holy books came down today, I would run like a mofo...

I admit that to observe ourselves, the world we live in, and the chances that we came to be at all, seem quite miraculous, but the universe appears to be quite infinite. So infinite in fact, that our existence could very well be as repetitious and insignificant as a single drop of rain within the entire history of earth.

That is a lonely thought indeed, but the sooner people can come to terms and be a bit more humble, the easier it is to open your mind to other non-creationism ideas. I agree 100% that you need not choose a side with absolutely no flexibility, but I also believe the sooner we knock out the ideas that have absolutely no basis whatsoever, the sooner we will get closer to the next breakthrough.

Originally posted by Tbrooks76
the big bang is required to any evolution model, and there is nothing to prove wrong, a theory requires evolution to prove right and this 1st step in the evolution theory that all life was came from an single cell organisms is improven

Evolutionary Theory only requires living organisms. It explains diversity, not origins. However, Evolutionary Theory provides a lot of evidence for common ancestry.

Originally posted by phishyblankwaters
reply to post by Tbrooks76

 

just google “Amazing Discovery Near Montrose, Colorado”.

I did. You get one hit from "discoverynews, which is in no way affiliated with the discovery channel mind you, and 2 other direct hits.

This thread, and the thread you probably lifted that link from.

There are various reasons for that being in the same layer, it's interesting yes, but to date, no humanoid fossils have been dated back far enough for man to have existed with dinosaurs.

As for cave paintings depicting dinosaurs. Well, we have pictures of what WE think they look like too, and guess what we had to go on? the same fossils those people probably encountered.

I could go on, but i'm sure others are already on the way.

The 1st link was just one the first hit I found from google, I was in hurry writing, but still it’s going to be consider a hoax or non-reputable source. I know some humanoid fossils have been found in the wrong layers and when they do it’s always assume they got there by some other means that fits an Evolution theory.
The comment about the cave paintings, I provided an example of a craving that really can’t be mistaken for anything other than a Stegosaurus, in an ancient Cambodian temple. We dug them only resonantly in history, are you assuming ancient Cambodian did the same and used similar tactics as us today to guess what they looked like? These are the same people that actually still carving on walls.

Originally posted by KnawLick
I get the point your trying to make but you mixed in a lot of things that don't actually pertain to evolution. Evolution doesn't attempt to explain how life was created, how the the universe was created....

I'll attempt to summarize your hypothesis though...

"Even an evolutionist must admit there was some "God", or creator forces, prior to life on Earth"

Most will not admit that, but I will also add most don't even agree on the details of the theory, which is crazy, it's a theory but has no offical clear model to follow.

reply to post by Tbrooks76


A question for you.

Why does your god create such a frail and faulty thing. Life is frailty. It's fragile and full of suffering.

Why would such a god create suffering? Pain, torment, torture, poverty, and untimely death - or death at all.

Your god, if you really want to argue it, is a beast. A creep.

So.. you can tell me about original sin and I can tell you I was not part of it. You can tell me about penance and I can tell you I did not ask for the life given to me.

Your god created to destroy. Like a child making sand castles only to make them crumble under his will.

OR

Life just exists... in all it's splendid pain and misery and wonder.

You are lost... You need this crutch to accept the fallacy of life, because your god tells you it is all your fault unless you meet extraordinary standards - and then you still suffer.

Your god is an illusion.

Things are created and destroyed. We are not special. We too will become extinct one day. Where is your god then?

Your focus is on such a small scale it is pitiful. And if you try to think big, all you can think of is god.

sad really...

Originally posted by luciddream

creation is just a "man... i have no frking clue how that happened, so im gonna say GOD!" man's theory.

likewise evoltion is the same boat.....we have no clue where life came from, so will just say it created itself.

Originally posted by Tbrooks76

Originally posted by luciddream

creation is just a "man... i have no frking clue how that happened, so im gonna say GOD!" man's theory.

likewise evoltion is the same boat.....we have no clue where life came from, so will just say it created itself.

It did. Elements of life are everywhere. And it is far more believable to accept than some mystic and invisible creator, creating things he no sooner tires off and destroys.

If you want to believe in god, you must therefore accept he created faulty creations. So much for all mighty.

Originally posted by Tbrooks76

Originally posted by luciddream

creation is just a "man... i have no frking clue how that happened, so im gonna say GOD!" man's theory.

likewise evolution is the same boat.....we have no clue where life came from, so will just say it created itself.

Again, Evolution, not Abiogenesis. Whats the point of debating if you don;t even want to see the difference. Theory Of Evolution has NOTHING to do with origin of life. Giant Jellyfish could have pooped life on earth, evolution still applies.

Evolution = Diversity of species.

What forces created the creator? Hmm?

2nd


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Originally posted by strafgod
What forces created the creator? Hmm?

2nd

 

Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

 

Oh you know, they will give you the answer "Creator was already there" talk about hypocrits lol

Originally posted by john_bmth
Even if evolution were suddenly falsified tomorrow, that wouldn't mean the torch automatically passes to creationism. That's not how science works. It's a creationist false dichotomy to suggest otherwise.

Actually, I disagree with Evolution, but I agree that creation doesn't have be the only other option. Personally your personal beliefs don’t bother or affect me typical. I just don’t like the schools tell my kids Evolution is only theory when the very first building block of the evolution theory is completely extraordinary concept unproven. All life coming from a self-created single cell organisms…. Carl Sagan popularized this as "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence". Is creation extraordinary…yes, but Evolution is the same category pass off as sceintific fact, when is not.

Originally posted by mainidh

Originally posted by Tbrooks76

Originally posted by luciddream

creation is just a "man... i have no frking clue how that happened, so im gonna say GOD!" man's theory.

likewise evoltion is the same boat.....we have no clue where life came from, so will just say it created itself.

It did. Elements of life are everywhere. And it is far more believable to accept than some mystic and invisible creator, creating things he no sooner tires off and destroys.

If you want to believe in god, you must therefore accept he created faulty creations. So much for all mighty.

Id like to see you do better

you can start whenever you like,,,, let me know when your finished......

Originally posted by ImaFungi
reply to post by Tbrooks76

 

you cant imagine an amazingly advanced and powerful being god,,, setting the universe into motion, with the intent of creating diverse life forms on trillions of planets,,, and have these energy capturing and utilizing mechanisms sort themselves out,,, decide their own fate and path,,,, organize themselves,,,,,, like computer programs that can "evolve" and fix themselves....... self replicating...... physical representations of math equations creating new formulas, working off of the original templates,,,,,

edit on 18-6-2012 by ImaFungi because: (no reason given)

part of that I can, but some parts of that no. I don't see us as an evolving people. One argument i heard once was about the eye evolve from just a critter with one light sensitive cell that became two then 3 and so on till it evolved into the eye. But it you take the eye as example and compare to last 50 years of data, you can see the it is doing the opposite of that, every year the number of people wearing glasses is increasing in percentages. The eye is improving it’s getting worse with every generation.

Reply to post by luciddream

Exactly. they'll say its a silly queston, everyone knows god created itself lulz


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Originally posted by Tbrooks76

Originally posted by ImaFungi
reply to post by Tbrooks76

 

you cant imagine an amazingly advanced and powerful being god,,, setting the universe into motion, with the intent of creating diverse life forms on trillions of planets,,, and have these energy capturing and utilizing mechanisms sort themselves out,,, decide their own fate and path,,,, organize themselves,,,,,, like computer programs that can "evolve" and fix themselves....... self replicating...... physical representations of math equations creating new formulas, working off of the original templates,,,,,

edit on 18-6-2012 by ImaFungi because: (no reason given)

part of that I can, but some parts of that no. I don't see us as an evolving people. One argument i heard once was about the eye evolve from just a critter with one light sensitive cell that became two then 3 and so on till it evolved into the eye. But it you take the eye as example and compare to last 50 years of data, you can see the it is doing the opposite of that, every year the number of people wearing glasses is increasing in percentages. The eye is improving it’s getting worse with every generation.

hmm i only see a score one for evolution here................ not everyone has bad eyesight,,,.,.,. majority of people have fine eyesight......... the way evolution works is if someone has bad eye sight,,, and falls off a cliff,,,, there are less chances that they would reproduce with someone to produce a new batch of life with bad eyesight/.....

its about disadvantageous traits being cancelled out,,,,, competition to better all,,,, all seeking perfection and progression....evolution.....

^^^^^^ This is the devil in god......... the ruthlessness,,,,,, the ends justifying the means,,,, innocent lives dying now,,, so immaculately perfect life can be discovered and lived later...

I too am curious how an eye came into existence,,,,,,,, and how it came into existence in the right place,,,, and with the right wiring connected to the brain to work as a perfect chemical elemental mechanism,,,,,, the material of an eye we dont see just laying around,,,, the colors are hardly even found...... I have a hard time saying that there is no essence of intelligence imbedded into the ways of the universe.... considering blind chemicals and elements,,, built such extraordinary creations and machines,,, and techniques..

its why i have a notion that the quantum world is where its at....... that the quantum world can connect and work together almost conciously to perform tasks and create creations..... it wanted to build up and exist as abstract creatures,, and be commander of something much larger then itself,,,, it built up these avatar bodies out of materials,,,, and we command these vehicles from the microscopic sparks in our minds.,.,


also everything really stems from those small quantom interactions,,,,,,,,, like plants obsorbing light from the sun,,,, us eating plants or animals that stored this energy from the sun,,, when we eat these things our gas tanks of stomachs break it down to the small simple nutrients of energy or mineral etc......

also back to quantom brain,,,,, everything youve ever thought and imagine,,, every dream and day dream,, complex train of thought,, self created vision,,,, takes place in microscopic areas of your brain,,,,, so much information in such a small place,,, and from that small place the ability to create space ships and sky scrapers and symphonies...

Anybody that comes into this thread and says "No creationism is the correct answer" or "No everything we see today is because of evolution" are equally tools.

Evolutionist (unless their are expert biologists) only knowledge of how life works is based on Darwins "origins of the species".

Creationist (unless their a prophet) only knowledge of how life works is based on 1 sentence in the Bible.

Two people fighting over Facts they've only personally read in a book....

.... Classic

Originally posted by PieKeeper

Originally posted by Tbrooks76
the big bang is required to any evolution model, and there is nothing to prove wrong, a theory requires evolution to prove right and this 1st step in the evolution theory that all life was came from an single cell organisms is improven

Evolutionary Theory only requires living organisms. It explains diversity, not origins. However, Evolutionary Theory provides a lot of evidence for common ancestry.

Evolution does try and explain origins, "origin of the species"
I have no dough in a common manufacture.

Reply to post by Tbrooks76

Evolution does try and explain origins, "origin of the species"

Thats not the same origins the fellow was talking about, and you know it. Hence the "common ancestry" bit in his reply Lol


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

Originally posted by mainidh
reply to post by Tbrooks76

 

A question for you.

Why does your god create such a frail and faulty thing. Life is frailty. It's fragile and full of suffering.

Why would such a god create suffering? Pain, torment, torture, poverty, and untimely death - or death at all.

Your god, if you really want to argue it, is a beast. A creep.

So.. you can tell me about original sin and I can tell you I was not part of it. You can tell me about penance and I can tell you I did not ask for the life given to me.

Your god created to destroy. Like a child making sand castles only to make them crumble under his will.

OR

Life just exists... in all it's splendid pain and misery and wonder.

You are lost... You need this crutch to accept the fallacy of life, because your god tells you it is all your fault unless you meet extraordinary standards - and then you still suffer.

Your god is an illusion.

Things are created and destroyed. We are not special. We too will become extinct one day. Where is your god then?

Your focus is on such a small scale it is pitiful. And if you try to think big, all you can think of is god.

sad really...

I say evolution is bad science, and you reply with a moral debate. ok but morally per the bible, God did not create pain and suffering, that was never the intent for mankind. We were created imortal with no such things, today most all pain and suffering is at the hands of mankind.