Does this mean the start of a new Ice Age?

With all the cold spreading across Europe and the Black Sea freezing after 30 years, I started to look into things that would cause such a dramatic drop in temperature dispite the claims to global warming. I've looked into carbone emitions and apparently , according to globe-net.com between 1990 and 2009, CO₂emissions from the coal grew from 3% and natural gas 2%, while CO₂emissions from oil fell 5%. Transportation, heat and electricity produced 2/3's of global CO₂emissions in 2009, up from 58% in 1990. IMHO is quite a bit. We can do better than that. Plus isn't all that supposed to warm up the planet. So, I looked in to the gulf stream and the BP fiasco. According to and article on eworldwire.com
published in 2010, the gulf stream had stalled due to the BP Oil spill. That would help explain the cold since the gulf stream helps the spread of heat. Then I came across this little tid-bit. I dunno if it's of any consequence but I thought it was interesting none the less. Of course this is all speculation.

Clouds getting lower

What say you?

one things for certain, if we are seeing global weather patterns changing in the long term, you should see the changes ahead of time in the ocean currents. if something changes the gulph stream for any length of time it will have adverse effects on the climate far exceeding anything c02 could be responsible for.

Originally posted by XLR8R

What say you?

I say 'did no one send you the memo'?
Seriously I had to check the date of your post.
Have you not seen the news about the melting ice blocking part of the Danube? It's warming up now! Apart from which some of us (UK) just had a record breaking warm winter.

reply to post by XLR8R


possible, want to share something weird, i like in NW ohio and as soon as i clicked on this thread it spontaneously started hailing outside

reply to post by starchild10


Actualy no they didn't. I don't watch TV and I have a limited time to check for stuff on the net. Got anything interesting to add to this thread?

The Gulf Stream was not affected by the oil spill. The claims of Zangari were nonsense. The Gulf Stream was, and is, behaving normally.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

The study of cloud tops indicates that the result may have been a lessening of the rate of global warming over the past 10 years, not a reversal to a cooling trend. But the length of the study is too short to come to any real conclusions.

According to the calculations of Davies and Molloy, the negative climate forcing from a decrease in the average global cloud amount during the past 10 years has more than offset the positive forcing from an increase in greenhouse gases from human activities. It is little wonder that the rate of global temperature rise during this period has been so paltry!

www.worldclimatereport.com...

reply to post by LittleBlackEagle


I agree. But I still believe C02 is a big problem. Any kind of pollutant, really. We're killing our planet, she's bound to retaliate but I'm pretty sure it would take decades if not centuries to ice over anyway, gulf stream stall or not.

reply to post by TheGuyFawkes


That's awesome. I love coincidences like that.

reply to post by XLR8R


i seem to remember some years back , that reported that the gulf stream was changing its coarse and growing weaker , i think it was at least 10 years or so ,
so i don't think that the oil spill has anything to do with the weather.
as for the other post regarding mild winter this year , i take it that he is from the south because the winter up here in the north has been cold as normal .
since i remember how the winters were when i was growing up in the fifties , if anything i think the winters are going back to how they used to be , now if we can get summers like they were in the fifties i for one would be more than happy.

reply to post by Phage


Yes, but they did speculate

If there is indeed a consistent reduction in cloud height, and this isn’t just natural variability, then Earth would begin cooling to space more efficiently, reducing the surface temperatures and slowing the effects of climate change.

If indeed it would cool off Earth, to what extent?

Originally posted by XLR8R
reply to post by LittleBlackEagle

 

I agree. But I still believe C02 is a big problem. Any kind of pollutant, really. We're killing our planet, she's bound to retaliate but I'm pretty sure it would take decades if not centuries to ice over anyway, gulf stream stall or not.

there are far more pressing things than cO2 to worry about but yes i agree, combine them all and what we have left is an non life supporting environment and nowhere to run.

reply to post by XLR8R

It would depend on if, and how long, the observed trend persisted. If the lowering of average cloud tops continued at the same rate, yes, it would result in cooling.

“If sustained, such a decrease would indicate a significant measure of negative cloud feedback to global warming.”

www.worldclimatereport.com...

It is entirely unknown if the observations represent any long term trend and, if it does, how long it has been going on. The ten year trend was also influenced by the transient effects of La Nina, complicating any attempt at determining its true nature.

reply to post by Phage


Thanks for the additional info. Hopefuly it contributes to a better, more consistant climate. Only time will tell.

Well, global warming or not, man made or not - the carbon emissions will be dramatically reduced in the next 50 years. Why? no petrol left to increase the emissions hehe. Also the best quality coil is already gone, I guess we would not base our economy on scrap coil left from 100 years ago..

A local event is not indicative of Global Warming or Ice Ages. When will ATSers ever learn this? There have been several threads made of whether the cold snap in Europe is an ice age. It is not. An unusually cold winter in one spot is not either GW or IA.

But just for the record, GW doesnt necessarily mean a heat wave all over the world and winter does not mean an Ice Age.
What GW means is that weather will go wonky all over, with colder winters and hotter summers. Now if that trend continues, then we have a problem.

But it is no wonder people are confused as global meteorology is a complicated thing. Fact is, the weird weather is caused by the usual suspects just a little more extreme.
Now its that extreme that scientists are looking at for GW.

The same thing that is causing the un-natural warm weather in North America is causing the extreme cold in Europe.

We have seen a half inch of snow this year, which I do admit is a little disconcerting, as I have never seen a winter of so little snow. Not to mention that my kid is aching to use his sled.
So I can understand why Europeans find the coldest weather in 26 year a little disconcerting.

The event may/may not have to do with GW.

While the negative phase of the Arctic Oscillation brought cold temperatures to much of Europe, the same pattern brought higher-than-average temperatures to much of Canada during January and February, including the south central city of Winnipeg in Manitoba, which saw its third warmest January on record, with an average temperature of 12.6°F. It was so warm that 200 loads of fake snow were trucked in so that a popular snow-sculpting contest at the Festival du Voyageur could go on as planned.

NOAA

The U.S. National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration reported that July 2011 was the fourth-warmest July on record. A warm summer in the Arctic cuts the amount of sea ice. NOAA reports that sea-ice levels last July were the lowest in three decades.

The effect is twofold, the Wegener scientists report.

First, less ice means less solar heat is reflected back into the atmosphere. Rather, it is absorbed into the darker ocean waters. Second, once that heat is in the ocean, the reduced ice cap allows the heat to more easily escape into the air just above the ocean's surface.

cnn

The jury is still out if its due to GW or not. The AO has been stuck in a negative state for the past decade, to suddenly swing to the positive state after the second hottest year on record in 2011. It will take more study for the scientists to decide if its due to global warming or not, or if its normal wiggles.

reply to post by TheGuyFawkes


We had hail two nights ago, the sky lit up really bright too, though the sun had just set. It was cloudy. And it lit up all over the sky a strange white kind of light.

Today, though nearly March, after much mildness, it snowed here. But its now melted.

*shrugs*. We've had a super warm winter. It's snowed twice here, and both times it melted in a few hours, and was only a dusting. It's stayed in the 50s/60s pretty much from October-February. Now it's already getting into the 70's every day.

Originally posted by XLR8R
With all the cold spreading across Europe and the Black Sea freezing after 30 years,

Are you sure mate? I ask because i normaly never listen or see weather reports from Europe.
Here in Portugal it's like Spring time, and we don't have rain since last december
If there really is a cold wave, i had not realized yet!

In this case we are experiencing the opposite of what you said! This autumn was the driest I have memory, and this winter is being insanely hot!
As a rule , here, must have rained a lot this winter, and have such a very cold January, but nothing like that happened!