Strange confrontation at Disneyland..

reply to post by Laokin


No you're wrong. It isn't his freedom of speech to be an a$$hole in an establishment that he doesn't own. I have every freedom and right to kick someone out of my place of business for using language or behavior that is disruptive to the majority of my paying guests.

Originally posted by groingrinder
Where is it legal to pepper spray somebody for bad language?? I saw the man do nothing illegal or threatening to children or anyone other than the man who was pepper spraying him.

Come on groingrinder, you saw nothing illegal?? The guy punched or tried to punch the guard and its because of this the guard sprayed him.
As you have already stated that the man did do something threatening towards the guard.
So the guard did have every right to spray him
Im a dumd assed security guard in pubs and niteclubs in Australia.
I don't have cuffs or spray, but i have to stop Asses like this guy nearly every weekend.
And i can guarentee that if that bloke tried that with me i would have every right to have knocked him out.
Anyone that was in the guards place would have every right to do the same.
Anyone that feels that they are being threatened has every right to defend themselves, it called the Force continumn.

The term use of force describes a right of an individual or authority to settle conflicts or prevent certain actions by applying measures to either: a) dissuade another party from a particular course of action, or b) physically intervene to stop them. In nations of the developed world and the developing world, governments allow police, citizen, corrections, or other security personnel to employ force to actively prevent imminent commission of crime, or even for deterrence. It may also be exercised by the executive branch (i.e., through the president, prime minister, premier, governor or mayor) of a political jurisdiction, deploying the police or military to maintain public order. The use of force is governed by statute and is usually authorized in a progressive series of actions, referred to as a "use of force continuum.[1]

link.
en.wikipedia.org...


Australian security guards force continumn.In the Australian security industry, the accepted 'force continuum' taught is:[citation needed]
1.Presence of the security officer
2.Verbal commands
3.Touching or Seizing the offender
4.Weaponless Defensive Tactics
5.Impact Defensive Weapons (i.e. Batons, etc...)
6.Potentially Lethal Force

[edit] Notes
en.wikipedia.org...
Link

wow,now i see why this world is the way it is.people here saying he should have been beaten and so on and he deserved it.based on that vid?wow,what a state of mind.totally dismissing the over use of spray (visible in the vid.) and the crowd adding spice to the situation like if it was something entertaining.like the ones here saying it should of gone worse for him. seems like a gladiator movie with people in the stadium screaming kill him,just for there amusement. regardless of the previuse incident(not visible in the vid)to jump into judgment mode with out evidence? learn to observe and see not just look and asume then kill. that man in the white shirt did deserve to fall on the ground,that much i do know.and the people that came along to hold the drunk down,were wer they when the other kept spraying agravating the situation?

reply to post by n00bUK

What did you see that warranted a pepper spray? I see nothing other than a person spraying him. Drinking in front of children, even using bad language does not warrant this kind of action

Seeing as he was held down by many people in the start , i doubt that was a result of "bad language" don't you ?

When the video starts , and he does get pepper sprayed , while being held on by other people , he assults the man. I wouldn't be surprised if he threw punches before the video started , but we will wait untill that surfaces for a better picture , im sure you will eat your words later on ...

let alone a taser, which is something you said he deserved Next time your in a domestic, that has nothing to do with anybody other than you and the other person, i hope a copper comes along and tasers you

of course he deserved a taser , Next time i'm in a domestic ? I don't get in domestic , i know my limit in booze , i have alot of empthy , and if i act a fool , if i ever am in a domestic , i won't cry about the consequences as i have brought them on my self.

Please use reason and logic to reply don't try and attack me with emotional responses , i don't bite .

and gives you a taste of your own medicene, maybe then you wouldnt be so fast to hand out such punishment.

Yes , if i break the law , and act a fool and they taze me . I won't cry about the punishment . Its consequences of my actions. The taser will be a great reminder of what not to do next time.

All i see in this video, is a drunken man retaliating to a person whos continually spraying him for been drunk.

Thats because you havn't seen the rest of the video . If you did , you would understand people a little bit more and why things like this are warrented.

American reality. Cant get drunk at a theme park because if you get a bit rowday, you will get pepper sprayed in the name of the chilldreen

Actually no , thats your distored reality . Anyone can get drunk and have a good time , but when you act a fool , and start causing a scene , and interupting service and other peoples experince , then its a problem. You are disturbing the peace.

Oh, brilliant, and?..Thats our Police who do have the right to use pepper spray, i wasnt on about the Police - I was onabout security people

I was pointing out , how professional your police are

unlike this little chubby man in the video who probably couldn't handle the bad language/confrontation the drunken man was giving him and knew he could win, using this pepper spray. Take away the man having pepper spray, the whole situation would of been dealt with allot better

again, you don't know what happened at the start . you are assuming , it was just bad language . You don't know what happened before . Secondly that is a older dude , why would he want to fist fight a drunken fool ? What do you think pepper spray is for ?

You rather the old guy one v one the drunken fool ? It would be a great show for the kids and family to watch right ? and the crowd to egg it on ? Is that what you want ?

I.e - talking it out, the guy understanding its a childrens area and realizing hes been an asshole
Or, 3 to 5 guys (which eventually happened) take the guy to one side and escort him away
Both of these solutions are better than giving one weak man a pepper spray can.

You've never dealt with a drunken fool have you ?

So when ones doing wrong to you, accept it? Silly man. I'll resist and show I'm right in my resistance, thanks. Unless im in the wrong, then yeah, your statement means something - but not in this situation.

doing wrong ? If i was that drunken fool , i would accept all the consequences i got in that scene. While i'm at the police station washing out my eyes , i'll think twice next time . Its not that difficult. to comprehend.

the only one wrong in that video , and im sure the crowd and all the staff their would agree was the drunken fool , who made a traumatic day for many people who just wanna go to rides , without such drama.

its a magical place for kids , not a druken fools park


you'll resist? , for a short period of time , you'll rage . Then you'll be taken away , and then while you sit in jail , you will have alot of time to think about how you just got handled . Many people think twice , but sadly most come back to the same situation and cry about the system.

You enjoy that.




Must be nice to use all those resources , for something a bullet in the leg would've taken care of.

Every single person in that video is mentally disturbed. Every single one.

Originally posted by seedofchucky
reply to post by SunLife

 

In short, maybe crowd should have thrown rocks at him.

lol? thrown rocks at him ?

is this twilight zone ats today ?

I jest: however that woman ... ugh I had this visual of wanting to throw rocks at something.
Not saying the ol guy didn't have it coming but it did look like he had dog tags around his neck. I think back in the day that is how folks took care of things...STONE HIM! [ rob schneider ]

Originally posted by SyphonX
Every single person in that video is mentally disturbed. Every single one.

as mentally disturbed as posters like your self ?

"You are an experienced contributor to ATS. Please be an example for our newer members and make every post matter."

Did you forget that part ? and one liners?

How about a little context to your drive by post?

reply to post by seedofchucky


My context is the video itself. Did you not watch it? Everyone is screaming, everyone acts like they are drunk. Everyone is slurring their speech and repeating themselves. People are being assaulted, folks are wearing stupid outfits. It's a circus, the place is demented.

Originally posted by bumpufirst
seems like a gladiator movie with people in the stadium screaming kill him,just for there amusement.

Now thats a little over dramatized.

regardless of the previuse incident(not visible in the vid)to jump into judgment mode with out evidence?

Yeah i agree , so why are you defending the Idiot getting sprayed when YOU haven't seen all the footage either???

learn to observe and see not just look and asume then kill.

You should learn to observe too.

that man in the white shirt did deserve to fall on the ground,that much i do know

So your saying the guard should have been assaulted.
Your a hypocryte.

.and the people that came along to hold the drunk down,were wer they when the other kept spraying agravating the situation?

And now your saying everyone except the guy in the green shirt in footage should have been assaulted .
Again your a hypocryte.

ETA.
was that you, or your dad in the footage???

Originally posted by SyphonX
reply to post by seedofchucky

 

My context is the video itself. Did you not watch it? Everyone is screaming, everyone acts like they are drunk. Everyone is slurring their speech and repeating themselves. People are being assaulted, folks are wearing stupid outfits. It's a circus, the place is demented.

But you said every single one ? what about the kids who made no noise? what about the on lookers , who did not say anything? how about the mothers and fathers who might of been watching applaued? Just because you heard a few voices , you can conclude all ?

How about the people in the backround looking on , in shock ?

i watched the video and can't come to the same conclusions as you . Your logic is generlized with little basis or merit. Sorry sir

reply to post by WozaMeathed

ETA.
was that you, or your dad in the footage???

loool i was going to ask some of the other members who posted the same thing .

If these people saw the whole video their tune would change so fast , then they would be like "oh i knew it all along , he deserved it " lol

i can't believe some people think , security guards just go up and pepper spray someone without just cause , like its a bodily funciton .

Disney owns the park. Disney sets the rules. There's an exchange of goods and services for money. Disney can refuse service especially if it is disrupting the experience of other guests. It's not like they asked him to leave because of his race or he was wearing something with pornography or vulgarity on it.

But putting all that aside, this looks a little staged with the screamer in the background and convenient video footage.

I thought you guys were all about conspiracy? This is one staring in your faces. The guy who did the spraying was probably in on it and will get a cut of the settlement.

reply to post by baddmove


It is now acceptable and legal in our current culture to kill with pepper spray or Taser, the mentally ill or challenged, homeless, incarcerated or anyone deemed by society to be a problem. A quick internet search will demonstrate this fact, 60 peppers pray deaths. One here in my county, Lee Florida, was a mentally ill man strapped and confined to a chair with a spit guard on his mouth, that was so saturated with pepper spray, it was still dripping when finally brought to the hospital, that the emergency medical staff had to wear personal protection before treatment could be administered just before his death. If concerned or interested do a internet search to see more.
Tasers maybe used on um-obedient school children or anyone else deemed by society to be a problem, sometimes resulting in death.
I would say the guy and woman in the video are lucky to be alive.
No problem here move along...
And reading some of the replies here confirms public opinion it's OK.

Wow. The video is certainly ambiguous to the entire story, as nearly all videos of this nature are. By virtue of the fact that they are turned on after something interesting starts to take place we never see the 'opening act'.

I can say that both parties were out of line. I can also say that the crowd mentality is one that is typical and dangerous. How about Disney? Where were the properly trained people to handle this type of event?

So many people have assumed the guy was drunk. Based on his physical actions, the perpetrator of the aggression to the guard hardly seemed to have military training (reference to dog tags). BUT, perhaps the dog tags were medic alert? I can list a whole slew of reasons for people appearing drunk and disorderly who have never imbibed.

The guard with the pepper spray was either grossly under trained or grossly negligent in performing his duties. The perpetrator was either drunk and disorderly or acting out of physiological illness. Either way, the truth cannot be derived from this video.

There are a couple of truths to note though...

The crowd mentality of many, not all, people in the video was disgusting. They derived satisfaction and pleasure from watching the scene unfold. A responsible citizen may have acted to create an area for the guard and the perpetrator to engage each other in a more reasonable environment, ie. back the crowd up by 20 or so feet. The cat calls and degrading comments from the general crowd were a definite influence on the nerve of the guard and the perpetrator of the disturbance.

Anyone who picks a side for either one is really biased. This is not the kind of bias that jumps out and grabs you by the arm, but it is a slow simmering bias that often gets supported by others because the bias can seem to be of good moral fiber.

The other poster comment about crowd mentality and 'throwing him to the lions' or of him 'being stoned' is not that far off. Elements of that crowd were certainly voicing their own aggression and it easily could have led to crowd vigilance. After all it was onlookers who jumped on the guy to hold him down at the end of it.

My final observation?: Disney is guilty of serving if it was alcohol induced and guilty of not having trained staff for either alcohol or medical emergency. John Q Public embarrassed itself greatly that day as well.

Namaste

reply to post by WozaMeathed


see what i mean? i did not say i was defending any one or that it is ok to assault any one.yet again,by your judgmental ways,the guy in green deserved it for what ever unseen reasson,well then, for the reassons seen on the vid he had that fall coming his way as well.hypocite? theres tree fingers pointing back buddy.

reply to post by seedofchucky

well in that video it does look like they just walk up and pepper spray.have a look,again.lol by the way the man has tags on him? that over spraying could of gone worse,in place loaded with kids,is that the way to handle it? as you guys claim a ok.brain check.

Originally posted by seedofchucky
reply to post by WozaMeathed

 

ETA.
was that you, or your dad in the footage???

loool i was going to ask some of the other members who posted the same thing .

If these people saw the whole video their tune would change so fast , then they would be like "oh i knew it all along , he deserved it " lol

I bet they would too.
I bet they would be the first to criticize the guard for not acting if a child got hurt.

i can't believe some people think , security guards just go up and pepper spray someone without just cause , like its a bodily funciton .

.
Yeah they seem to think that we love putting our live's on the line for mininum wage, and that were only in the job for a fight.
They just dont seem to understand that some of are out their to make sure that they and their families have a safe day or night out.

This world has gotten fused between what a "right" is.

Somehow it's gotten twisted into "I can be an annoying sh#!head and there's nothing you can do about it". Well that's bullying mentality. And when someone fights back, the bully cries about their "rights".

Well sure, you have the "right" to be a jerk. You have the right to annoy me. You have the right to push the limits of what the law is. But you also have the right to suck on some pepper spray if you don't comply with the general public wants. And the general public wants to go to a themepark with your drunk a$$ causing problems.

I want to go to Disneyland and have a day of expensive fun without having to worry about drunks. I want other drunks to be very concerned about being drunk in the park. They deserve that fear.

you two remind me of the people in the video same type of bootcamp trainning.

reply to post by baddmove


baddmove,
Thanks for sharing your find. I do think he would not comply and that we missed the first initial and appearently drunk confrontation..But I do believe this video is the example of excessive use of force, for example; the man finally wipes what he can of the spray out of his eye, just standing there only to be unneccessarily unloaded on with the pepperspray again, provoking the second attack. Also I believe this is another fine example of unfit security guard officers..All that is missing are the Donuts.
Personally I love how the civilians handle it afterwards. He couldnt do a thing after the real men stepped in. What a joke, I hate authority. Yay for the People! Boo for that drunk guy though..he'll have a horrible migrane and chest pains for a while I presume.
Don't drink and go to Disney Land.
p.s. I agree the female was quite annoying & repetative! More than likely egging it on as well!
Thanks for your share!